Retainers in Disguise

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post3853958

"Wait for your squadron to return."

Anyone else kind of annoyed about this? I'm having Airship Exploration flashbacks all over again. You know, where they announce content that initially sounds reallllly cool, like "Wow! Airship Exploration?! And I'll be able to manually fly around with my FC mates and explore far off places and maybe even do airship fates and chase big flying monsters?"

Only now it's "Wow! Squadrons?! So I'll be able to go into low level dungeons without needing a queue or having to wait around if someone leaves mid-dungeon? Aweso-" Oh no wait, it's just another retainer system. Let me guess, the higher your squad member's levels, the better items you can get, right?

And yeah, at the bottom it says that sometime in the future they'd like to update it so you can take them into dungeons. But they also said a lot about Airship Exploration, and it's been over a year now with FC airships being close to worthless.

Here's a thought... why couldn't they just expand our current retainer system so that we can place the retainers we have (you know, the ones we've already spent time gearing and leveling and designing their looks) into squadrons and send them out in groups to fetch a bundle of items instead of one at a time? I mean, I have to imagine adding onto the current system we have in place would take less effort than designing a whole new system entirely (that essentially serves the same purpose). And with all that effort they saved, maybe they could have used it to actually let squadrons live up to their namesake and go into dungeons with us.

In disguise? I don't see a disguise.

I'm not at all surprised about this.
It's exactly what I expected it to be.

Yep. It's just retainers, except this time... there's... well... no difference really.

I rather like the basic system behind it (reminds me a lot of FF Tactics where I'd get randomly generated units too which I needed to train to use and could send them on missions on their own and talk to them in the tavern and all that).
But, you know, I could also do actual fights together with them, which is a thought in the far-off future at best in FFXIV so far.. :/

Oh well, I guess they are just not ready yet to let us wander off on our own with NPCs. I assume they'll add it when the "no one is doing old content anymore even with our extra incentives but we HAVE to give players the possibility to clear that content" argument gets stronger than the "players won't bother playing with other players anymore when they can have NPCs instead" argument.

The more I learn about this patch the more I'm like:

http://i.imgur.com/emniBdq.gif

I do hope they do make it so you can actually take them to dungeons, sooner than later.

But before that, it just looks to be retainers without item rewards for their ventures...

To be honest, if these new retainers require ventures and give nothing new or excessive, it's gonna be dead on arrival lol

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Originally Posted by Rennies

To be honest, if these new retainers require ventures and give nothing new or excessive, it's gonna be dead on arrival lol

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I don't think they'll cost ventures, they might make a new thing they end up costing or something... But the pictures don't really show any reward beyond XP for the squadron.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/a...4&d=1474089921

Let's just wait and try them out before we decide, shall we?

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Originally Posted by Khyzen

And yeah, at the bottom it says that sometime in the future they'd like to update it so you can take them into dungeons.

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Not only that, but in the stream they basically said they need to work out how to balance the AI to handle dungeon mechanics. It could end up being just another dead end they mentioned once and then never actually follow up on because it ends up being too difficult to actually implement.

Can't wait to summon a primal with my squadron!

It was already known that at best we wouldn't be taking them into dungeons and the like until 4.0. This atleast makes it more likely to happen then, well, primal summoning.

Given how the UI is designed, I'm actually hoping that this may lead to some sort of content/mini-game where you'll get to command the squadrons FF Tactics style, with your own character joining them as a leader unit. Picking classes for your squad would matter quite a lot then.

Only a crackpot dream though...

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

Given how the UI is designed, I'm actually hoping that this may lead to some sort of content/mini-game where you'll get to command the squadrons FF Tactics style, with your own character joining them as a leader unit. Picking classes for your squad would matter quite a lot then.

Only a crackpot dream though...

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Well this lays the foundation. There are many ways to build on it.

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Originally Posted by Balipu

Well this lays the foundation. There are many ways to build on it.

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Gee boy howdy, I wonder how much content you can slap that tagline onto that came out during 3.x

And I wonder how many of them we'll be looking back to with a passing thought of "Oh yeah, whatever happened to that one thing?"

Glad this expansion was so keen on delivering so much groundwork, maybe next expansion we might actually see the framework? Can't rush bringing out meaningful content with meat just yet; SO PLEASE LOOK FORWARD TO IT.

Not suprised, most of the new features were pretty underwhelming, its like SE has this amazing idea, but they only add the bare minimum.

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Originally Posted by Lewtskie

Gee boy howdy, I wonder how much content you can slap that tagline onto that came out during 3.x

And I wonder how many of them we'll be looking back to with a passing thought of "Oh yeah, whatever happened to that one thing?"

Glad this expansion was so keen on delivering so much groundwork, maybe next expansion we might actually see the framework? Can't rush bringing out meaningful content with meat just yet; SO PLEASE LOOK FORWARD TO IT.

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I don't want to be one of those guys who ask this cause they are annoying, but why are you still here?

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Originally Posted by Balipu

I don't want to be one of those guys who ask this cause they are annoying, but why are you still here?

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Probably, because he/she realy likes this game, but does not like the recent features, which were pretty underwhelming to be honest. I reckon that Lewtskie, just wants that the developers release features that are more complete and less menu-based.

I could be wrong though about his/her reasons, but what I am sure off is, if someone likes something they will complain about it, if they did not care, they would have uninstalled and moved on.

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Originally Posted by Laerune

Probably, because he/she realy likes this game, but does not like the recent features, which were pretty underwhelming to be honest. I reckon that Lewtskie, just wants that the developers release features that are more complete and less menu-based.

I could be wrong though about his/her reasons, but what I am sure off is, if someone likes something they will complain about it, if they did not care, they would have uninstalled and moved on.

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Nope, you're assessment was spot on. It's a shame that people will immediately assume any criticism means I must hate it. I don't; obviously I don't or I wouldn't be subbed. But all these recent side additions to the game have been "Decent/Poor as is, has room to be better" and it's rather bothersome. At this point, as we're looking back everything has been a prime example of quantity over quality. 3.x has been just a constant testing ground. Feels like I'm playing the Beta stage of a game sometimes.

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Originally Posted by Laerune

Probably, because he/she realy likes this game, but does not like the recent features, which were pretty underwhelming to be honest. I reckon that Lewtskie, just wants that the developers release features that are more complete and less menu-based.

I could be wrong though about his/her reasons, but what I am sure off is, if someone likes something they will complain about it, if they did not care, they would have uninstalled and moved on.

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This.

And this is an official forum, a direct communication with the development team, you're able to use it for feedback - in any form, like a salty comment which is less constructive but still shows displeasure with current trends.

I could go on a whole wall of text about how stupid some of responses with "stop moaning, devs don't deserve it, please don't make them sad" motifs and defence force antics are here, but I know better than to waste my time.

Really, another glorified venture joins the frame.

I wish they could focus on fixing/fleshing out previous content before... pumping out new unfinished content.

While I loved the basic stuff from this expansion (Story, Primal Fights, Raids, Beast tribes AKA things we had on 2.0)
the new additions pretty much fell flat except for PotD:

Diadem
FC Crafting
Airship Exploration
Verminion
And now Squadrons.

I fear they will not finished these and pump even more unfinished stuff when 4.0 hits.

I don't recall Challenge logs being needed with retainers, or a group mechanic, or the ability to freely switch roles for your retainer to take to fulfil a quest.

Why not expand on the retainer system? Maybe because you have to pay to have more than two retainers and to make Squadrons and expanded retainer system would get people complaining how you have to "pay to win" because in order to have more people in your squadron you need more retainers?


Retainer Ventures are limited by the amount of retainers you own, Squadrons don't require retainers because then favoritism would be put on those who have more retainers. Your NPCs involved in Squadrons are influenced by the amount of challenge logs you complete, so the more you do, the more NPCs you have(to a limited amount) and based on the potential size of NPCs you can have, it's less detrimental if you end up having to replace an NPC compared to starting back to square one with a retainer.

Example, you only get 2 retainers as base, it takes time to get to 60, it can take a little bit of time to gear up and then you are limited to only going on two ventures at a time.

Squadrons have more members, you can actively train them before sending them out, there is a distinct chance of failure/success rate to the missions you send them on so calling it the same thing as ventures is like saying Starcraft and Warcraft are the exact same game when they are just the same genre.

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Wait, this feature is influenced by the amount of challenge logs you complete in a week? Or am I just misreading the comments here?

Is it just me or does it seem like they pushed this out before it was fully developed?
I would much rather they have waited for us to be able to take these npcs into dungeons first.
As it is now there doesn't seem like much point in leveling them.

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Originally Posted by Vejjiegirl

Is it just me or does it seem like they pushed this out before it was fully developed?
I would much rather they have waited for us to be able to take these npcs into dungeons first.
As it is now there doesn't seem like much point in leveling them.

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Yeah, I get that feeling as well and would also prefer it to be further along than its current stage and be out later, than what it seems right now.

As of right now, based on previous content additions in 3.0 and even some before - I don't feel like spending time and resources leveling something on the potential that it'll be "better later" is a good idea, especially when it's just another "later it will do this" comment from the dev, it could quite simply be fogotten for the next "better later" idea.

Disappointing, but pretty much what I expected: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post3852171

If they use RNG once again it is destined to fail... same as airship and retainers!
Still NEVER ever seen any pet since retainers are in game... i given up on ever getting one!

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

I do hope they do make it so you can actually take them to dungeons, sooner than later.

But before that, it just looks to be retainers without item rewards for their ventures...

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Not into dungeons related to roulettes. That I can say.

I hope at least they can go to any dungeon and bring back all the gear that can be found there, while I focus on something else!...

The best would be to be able to enter dungeons with them and maybe even Extreme duties, the fact that this is a MMO doesn't mean we couldn't do things alone if desired, besides I think such ability would allow for the ultimate learning for any trial we wanted to clear, given the squadron members had human AI in level of ability!... :)

What I would like to see, which will likely not happen, is 4.0 open world content require a party either with people or these NPCs. Make the world rewarding and dangerous.....

Squadrons are Retainers minus Venture and actual gear... So Squadrons are exactly like the Garrison Table in WoW.... except... WE STILL GET CONTENT TO DO!! XD

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Originally Posted by Ayer2015

What I would like to see, which will likely not happen, is 4.0 open world content require a party either with people or these NPCs. Make the world rewarding and dangerous.....

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On this note: That is a terrible idea. Look at the game now. How many people actually go through the zones without any reason besides leveling or events. And even then they rush it immediately and stop. Say they do make the open world require a party. 4 months later, what happens to a new player that comes into that content and can't do anything because they can't kill simple field mobs. They quit, unsub, and probably don't come back unless they nerf said mobs into the ground so a group isn't required for them.

i agree with the op. I have two max level retainers id rather them just let me "fetch my retainer" from the fc retainer stables after feeding it some ventures, and then have it help me gather a node, or fight monsters... we could even make flavored ventures and have a favorite foods section that boost their stats. ok so that idea is a bit far out, but why level squadrons when my retainers are geared and over 210

I hope we can use them for Savage, I am sure NPCs can perform rotas 100% and avoiding 100% without fail... that way i can die and watch them cleaning the fight for me :)