Need/greed issue

So why is it that you can roll Need on a piece of gear if you are that gears job/class yet your said piece you have on is higher ilvl in raids or dungeons why? For example, if you have a 240 head piece, you shouldn't be able to roll on a 200 piece since you obviously have the better option and instead be given the option to roll greed on it like the rest of the party. its frustrating when your trying to gear up a alt job/class when the party member constantly rolls need on things they have no business of having. instead allow the rest of the party to roll on in case a party member actually needs it to gear up.

and please none of this salt/gitgud mentality, i want some real thoughts on this issue.

Well, some people roll need on gear simply because they want the piece for glamour, or wants to trade it in for gc seals. Imagine being forced to greed on something you really want for glamour and losing the roll every time. Usually, if someone requests a piece of gear, I'll pass on it and let them have it (unless I really want it for glamour and have been trying to get it forever, haha). If nobody says anything, then it's fair game.

Need does not just mean for ilvl upgrades.

glamour/desynth/company seal

It's because you can still use gear even if it's not an actual upgrade for you. You can desynth it or you can turn it in to GC seals for the current relic phase. A person may need the piece even though they don't need it for a gear upgrade. If this option was removed so that you can't need lower item level pieces than what you have on these people might just run the content in lower item level gear to be able to need for the pieces. At the same time, the only currently relevant gear are Savage, Lore and Weeping City gear, and no one's looting those away from you for seals or whatever.

If they aren't on that role then its up to the person who can need it. Cant really change a system thats working as intended.

Glamour.

Example: all the new Bard gear in dungeons is way below ilvl for me, but I really want to look like a cowboy, so I'll need it so hard.
If you want it, go on that job/role.

I've been healing EX roulette solely because I needed the upgrade body piece, as an actual upgrade, but of course others could need on it if I wasn't healing. Is that fine? Sure, they were the ones healing. So instead I healed to make sure I got it. (And after about 500000 runs I finally did...)

This is a thread topic that pops up every once in a while, always turns out the same way.

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Originally Posted by Yudzster

glamour/desynth/company seal

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what this guy said.
if you want it ask for it most ppl will pass.
if you dont ask you dont get

Also, highest ilvl isn't always BiS in some cases. This mostly applies to Weeping City, but I'd hate it if I couldn't have needed on the casting body, simply because I have the 240 lore one. Admittedly, people aren't likely to greed on it due to the once per week thing.

The only issue I have with it is Lancer/Dragoon can't Need on gear that clearly lists Lancer/Dragoon. As tank gear goes, it's not that great, but it might be an actually useful thing for the non-tank that can wear it.

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Originally Posted by Yudzster

glamour/desynth/company seal

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+retainers as well!

I actually had a post about this in the DF horror stories thread. I was running VA and I rolled Greed on a healing hat for my retainer. Tank proceeds to freak out on me. I told him I planned on using it for my retainer and that I rolled Greed instead of Need because it wasn't something my actual character needed, so he lost it fair and square. But he still made a big stink about it anyway.

I tend to only roll Need it 1) it's an upgrade. 2) I've been hunting for it for glamor 3) I'm absolutely GC seal deprived. I don't find needing very nice, but that's my personal thing. My boyfriend tends to roll need, though. But I do usually roll Greed on most loot.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

The only issue I have with it is Lancer/Dragoon can't Need on gear that clearly lists Lancer/Dragoon. As tank gear goes, it's not that great, but it might be an actually useful thing for the non-tank that can wear it.

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Agreed. A piece dropped that would have been upgrade and lost due to being unable to need on it.

Same thread as always. Same answer as always: If you want to roll Need on something, go as the class you want to Need on. Otherwise, you're not entitled because they have a higher ilevel but chose to go as that class.

Also, besides GC seals, desynth, glamour, retainers, there's the other jobs with the same role you are needing on. Say I'm whm and need on a healer body, even though my whm has the Orison body which is in this example better than what I'm needing on, but turns out I need this piece for my sch. Maybe just like you are trying to upgrading your alt classes, I am too, and happen to be on the role that can need on it.

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Originally Posted by JisKing98

So why is it that you can roll Need on a piece of gear if you are that gears job/class yet your said piece you have on is higher ilvl in raids or dungeons why?

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Because you can still need it for glamour, GC seals, desynthese or to sell it in the MB if it is tradeable.

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Originally Posted by Yudzster

desynth/company seal

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Which really should be separate roll options that directly convert the item, rather than extra walks you do afterwards, similar to the disenchant roll WoW introduced. I'd even disallow selling/desynthesis/turn in of dungeon items outside of that option, to make sure people only roll something else if they're actually going to use that item in some way, since the only other option is trashing it for nothing.

Using an item should always have priority over turning it into currency. Otherwise, we might as well allow every class to roll need on everything because hey, you need it for gil and it can be vendored. That's what the whole need/greed system is supposed to prevent, so it should be common sense.

Shame it's not. But you can't fix people.

It is not only about how useful is. It is for glamour, desynth for rare mats or leveling or turn them into Grand Company seals for example.

If you need a specific piece of gear, you can ask nicely to other member to pass. But you cannot obligue them. They can accept or not, and they are in their right.

When I join a party I always take a look at the parties gear. In most cases you even see it upon entering that some people are not geared. I'll ask if someone needs gear and if nobody says a word, I'll need/greed for my retainers/seals/alts/glamour etc. However if I find myself wiping 50 times at the first boss because people can't be asked to pay attention for 10 seconds, I'll greed/need anything that shows up on the loot window and get the hell out of that run lol

I always find it a bit annoying when people just plain need on items that are clearly downgrades, and in most cases quite ugly (opinion).. so it's pretty clear that they are doing it for GC seals.

I've myself always pushed "Greed" if I have wanted an item for either seals, retainer or selling for Gil. But guess I should change my ways to needing for everything, eh?

the expert dungeons gear gives a lot of gc seals, one of the reason people needing them on even tho its not an upgrade it seems.

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Originally Posted by Anzaman

I always find it a bit annoying when people just plain need on items that are clearly downgrades, and in most cases quite ugly (opinion).. so it's pretty clear that they are doing it for GC seals.

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Why do you find it annoying? The current relic phase requires 20k seals for 1 sand so that's a lot of turn-in gear required.

If I want something for seals than most of the time I will only greed it (especially if they are rings and other right side items) but if I want something for glamour than I will definitely need it. If you are not on the class that I rolled Need on well bad luck for you, just do the dungeon with that class next time. Run Sohm Al a lot of times as monk because I wanted that body for glamour (still missing monk and healer body T_T).

There was a void ark run were I always passed on the things but at the end boss I rolled greed onto the bard gear. Only after most people rolled one person said that they wanted that gear for their bard but it was too late and before I could switch to pass I got it. He and another person posted quite some "nice" things in the chat...Yes I did not have bard anywhere lvl50 but if you want something say it at the beginning of the run and not after most people already rolled..I would have passed on it if I had known earlier..

So if you really want something because it could help your other class than just say it at the beginning, most people that don't need it for anything will surely pass it to you but don't be angry at them if they still roll onto it because its not their fault that you choose to go into the dungeon with another class.

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Originally Posted by Yudzster

glamour/desynth/company seal

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I had a person who was angry with me that I rolled need/greed on Items in a low lvl dungeon. He was wondering why a maxed out player needed it. I told em that I needed company seal and they laughed and questioned my need for seals. I continued to roll need/greed and got most of the stuff. Even though I maxed out everything I still roll for items because even at lvl 60 they have use for end game items.

If someone really need it for upgrade, he should go with the class/job that need it and not with another class/job just because it have already better gear. You don't need it if you don't want to play the job for that gear.

Or we start to queue for content with the bare minimum ilevel (except on weapon).

I've been needing/greeding on things I don't need simply for the GC seals. Truth be told that when I actually needed that gear as an upgrade, someone was rolling on it too that didn't actually need it. It just is what it is.

NO reason to get gud or anything like that, it's just simply up to RNG.

*You could also state in party chat that you wan/need that piece of gear. Usually if someone does on a piece of gear I really don't need, I'll immediately switch from need/greed to pass.

I need on gear to level up my armorer desynthesis skill, would you prefer I unequip my better gear to wear some old stuff from several patches ago OP? Go on the job you want gear for, I often switch to jobs that have the most arm desynth gear for this purpose when I do random matchmaking for dungeons that drop desynthable gear.

Lol I personally don't like people that are needing on everything it appears that person is greedy in rl to me but try playing the mmo I used to play. We had once a week dungeons, an elite version of the weakly dungeons, & daily dungeons. The elite dungeons is where the best gear was, you could only access them if you beat the regular first, if you wanted to play anything more than once you had to pay with real life money. The elite they rigged it to were you always had to pay to play it, unless you were strategic, watched your bad luck limiter, & beat regular on day 1, ran elite day 2. The gear was not a guaranteed drop either. Point is at least if you don't get what you need/want here you can at least go back in without it costing you more money.

I don't really care what other people are rolling. I just want a way to greed/pass on ALL loot at the same time.

Simple answer: the glamour system exist/turn in for points.

Personally, I only roll need on items that drop for my class (healer) if I need it for glamour purposes, or if it's an upgrade. If it's for GC seals for my relic or whatever, I greed. I don't really judge others for doing things differently, but it's just a personal policy I like to follow.

I will only Need on things that are an upgrade for what I'm currently playing. If it's not an upgrade, I Greed. That's just my own personal thing.

I'm an ex WoW player, and I consider needing for desynth/seals to be the same as needing for disenchant; basically a no-go, and something you got called out on back then, and sometimes kicked for. I just can't bring myself to do it, even though the playerbase here seems to be around 50/50 when it comes to whether it's acceptable behavior or not.

There's a difference. WoW let you need on gear you couldn't use.

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Originally Posted by MayleeMorningstar

I'm an ex WoW player, and I consider needing for desynth/seals to be the same as needing for disenchant; basically a no-go, and something you got called out on back then, and sometimes kicked for. I just can't bring myself to do it, even though the playerbase here seems to be around 50/50 when it comes to whether it's acceptable behavior or not.

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You take the risk of not being able to need when you don't go as that class. If someone doesn't even have a lvl 60 and they can need but I can use it for desynth or seals why should they get it? Ive seen that way too many times even in farm parties. Go as the role you think you want gear for or hope people only greed.

I like to heal in everything if i can, but if i want gear for a certain role/job i usually play as that job to get it. I was running weeping as a Bard, but started as a Dragoon now to get the top, ironically now it stops dropping, lol. But lets say i "need" it for an upgrade but i nktice another dragoon/role I'm playing, i always ask, "do you need it?, are you after it?" Just so i have an idea of getting it or not, ive had maybe one person say they wanted a piece for glamour, thankfully it didnt drop, lol? But yeah the need/greed system is fine, its the loot drops that ate an issue, 2.4 dungeons got it right, un my opinion, lol.