Open World Dungeons?

Hey everyone, I'm not sure this is where a thread like this would go, but anyways here are my thoughts.

I love FFXIV. It's a great game and very well thought out. However, one thing that I truly miss is the aspect of partying up with friends and taking a stab at a difficult dungeon in the open. I'm not sure how this would work in the FFXIV:ARR system, but I've always thought it could be a really cool addition to the game. There are a few small caves/tunnels scattered around Eorzea, but it would be very interesting to see how they could be utilized as full fledged dungeons or maybe use the dungeons we already have and give the option for exploration?

Not sure if anyone has thought about this idea or if this makes sense, but what your thoughts on this?

If they did that, there would likely be a boss there. Being open world, ANYONE could attack the boss. There'd be two ways to handle a boss spawn: the quest way and the hunt way. The quest way would limit the attacks to only those in the party for that step of the dungeon, similar to a levequest and other people being unable to attack the things for you unless you're in a party (although anyone can still heal you). The hunt way would be a timed spawn and would 'require' a large amount of people to get down there in time to kill it and claim credit. Obviously, people would complain about 'early pullers' then. They could make it a short spawn, but to balance it they'd have to give it rather crappy rewards, or limit it to once a week or something, which makes it a chore because then you HAVE to get it before reset or you lose out on it. They could make it take a few days to respawn, with the possibility for very nice rewards, but then some people will miss out because they're not online or it was 'early pulled'. They could also make it spawn only at specific times, so everyone has a chance to get there in time or logging in for it, but that leaves the likelihood of people prioritizing it over real life things ('sorry honey, I'm canceling our date tonight so I can kill this boss!').

I like the idea, but I can't help feeling that somehow it would be ruined by the community.

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Originally Posted by OoglieBooglie

I like the idea, but I can't help feeling that somehow it would be ruined by the community.

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Yeah I agree with that. I think in some ways I wish there was a little more danger or challenge in the over-world, or give reason to travel around the world of Eorzea. Also, what you mentioned about Leves interests me. I could be wrong but I find that Leves are heavily ignored in FFXIV which if they put exploratory dungeons then it could help Leves have more purpose. Because I use Leves for leveling up my lower classes it would be nice to implement them in a way that causes one to do more exploratory hunts to give immersion.

That way people aren't able to jump in at an over-powered level and steal a kill that you were waiting hours for. I mean, people already quickly stack up to kill for Hunts and they barely leave enough time for more people to help out.

I'd love to see this type of content...would actually give me something to do with my FC and friends lol

Sounds like a total waste of time they already tried lots of similar content and it's just a zerg fest. There is no challenge or interest in that. People generally in MMO's don't want to explore they just want to get rewards in the fastest way possible so after a couple of weeks when everyone figures things out it'll be boring. I don't care much for open world as a concept anyway people talk about it like it's the magic rainbow that solves all problems.

Nobody cares much for FATES and Leves etc they just exist for people to level up bots and this would just be the same. Same for hunts and diadem nobody cared after a week.

In 1.x they had this stuff and it was far from zerg fests. The mobs were actually hard so even if you brought 18+ people it was still a struggle.

dont believe me? Here is a screen shot of half of our group going to a stronghold..and we WIPED soooo much!

http://i.imgur.com/viXwbKZ.jpg

It was extremely rewarding and satisfying if you could successfully coffer farm.

Besides..I guess we have never heard of forced popped NMs? Can always allow people to force pop things in tiers and only the PT who spawned it may fight it. Wow..no more zerg fest, imagine that ^_^

Anyway, this has been suggested for years now...and they still aren't doing it, so I am not expecting anything at all anymore lol.

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Originally Posted by Iromi

Besides..I guess we have never heard of forced popped NMs? Can always allow people to force pop things in tiers and only the PT who spawned it may fight it. Wow..no more zerg fest, imagine that ^_^

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Which...just kinda instances the fight. In which case, you might as well just make it a proper instance and make picking up after the wipe a lot more convenient for everyone involved.

No really. The difference here are two loading screens and the fact that you need to manually walk back after a wipe. A great idea if you want to add a timesink, but...yeah. That's about it.

I think that having open exploration dungeons adds an element of getting to know your server community. On small servers like Mateus (the one I'm currently on), it's incredibly hard for people to be social and to party up or make friends. The Duty Finder is great for people who can't find members, but I think open exploration dungeons adds a new way to meet and team up with folks that are on your server. The downside of Duty Finder is that you can't party up again with the same people because it takes players from different servers.

I have an idea, how about an open world area that people can travel to on an airship where they can farm gear and trade unwanted gear for tokens they can trade for mounts and materia, have regular tough mobs and bosses... I'd call it Diadem... what's that you say? It already exists? what is this thread about then?

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Originally Posted by Venom

I have an idea, how about an open world area that people can travel to on an airship where they can farm gear and trade unwanted gear for tokens they can trade for mounts and materia, have regular tough mobs and bosses... I'd call it Diadem... what's that you say? It already exists? what is this thread about then?

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Lol, even though that's not exactly an open world dungeon and is also by definition an instance? Not sure if that was supposed to be funny or...?

Also, this isn't a concern of getting gear, mounts, or materia, it's about playing the game in a more social environment and having more room for exploration rather than memorizing the zones the moment you enter each one. HW was a really step up in terms of the zones widening and things being more exploration based in some aspects. Also, for 3.3 they are including some treasure dungeons and other types of dungeons so they are definitely thinking about the concept.

Some of the dungeons that we run in instances could be made into open worlds too. Wanderer's Palace, Amdapor Keep, Sunken Temple....no reason dungeons like this, once we run them and once they are done with them, couldn't be converted into an open world dungeon. The maps are basically there, they would just need to open a few extra spots that were covered by debris in the instanced form and they could make them fun venturing spots open world. Put NMs in them, special fates or make them part of certain quest chains for more lore. There is so much potential to double the world size we have now just by doing that.

Plus it would be fun just from an exploration standpoint.

I shudder when I think of how horrible XI wouldda been if Garlaige, Ugg Temple, Bibiki Bay and other such areas were instance only dungeons. But that's essentially what we have now.

If player behavior is anything to go by, new open world stuff will be mobbed for weeks, preventing you from getting a lick in, followed by everyone abandoning the content and not being able to find people who want to help out.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

If player behavior is anything to go by, new open world stuff will be mobbed for weeks, preventing you from getting a lick in, followed by everyone abandoning the content and not being able to find people who want to help out.

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Sorry, can I ask what you mean by open world stuff would be mobbed for weeks? I'm not sure I totally understand, are you talking about players just camping there or something? I can sort of see what you mean by players could potentially abandon content though, especially older dungeons, but let's be real though, a lot of people who unlock the hard modes who want to just stick with the hardcore stuff stay there. So in some ways, that is already happening.

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Originally Posted by koichiresh

Sorry, can I ask what you mean by open world stuff would be mobbed for weeks? I'm not sure I totally understand, are you talking about players just camping there or something? I can sort of see what you mean by players could potentially abandon content though, especially older dungeons, but let's be real though, a lot of people who unlock the hard modes who want to just stick with the hardcore stuff stay there. So in some ways, that is already happening.

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Two examples: Hunts and the Diadems Dinosaur Island.

The community made it's bed, Poo'd in the bed, then complained the bed smells of poo.

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Originally Posted by MXMoondoggie

Sounds like a total waste of time they already tried lots of similar content and it's just a zerg fest. There is no challenge or interest in that. People generally in MMO's don't want to explore they just want to get rewards in the fastest way possible.

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Can throw this logic into trash. Just remove it. People just want lore as fast as possible they'll just skip any they can or pull the entire dungeon if they could and lock them out.

It's totally possible to "want to explore" but the effort has to be made on SE part too.

diadem failed because they didn't make the trash hard enoug. They let you fly around which negated exploration in danger.

They gave you objectives you could easily Get the rewards for elsewhere. So the only thing to do was farm dinosaurs.

SE failed to make objectives worth doing. Exploring doesn't mean oh we just wanna look around with no reward. People want explore with a rewArd actually attached to it.

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Originally Posted by Razard

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Originally Posted by Critical-Limit

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What these two said. If there's a quick and efficient way to get rewards, the players will grind it to the ground and once everyone has their fill, no one will bother after that. All rewards are only relevant to the current patch and once the next set of rewards come in the new content later, the old content gets the shaft. That's why open world stuff is never going to stay relevant unless the rewards system gets revamped.

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Originally Posted by Critical-Limit

Exploring doesn't mean oh we just wanna look around with no reward. People want explore with a rewArd actually attached to it.

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Or we could just skip the Pavlov. I dunno, this statement just screams conditioning to me. Exploration? Nah. Reward? Yay! Combine reward with exploration and after a while exploration = yay... until exploration doesn't have rewards for a bit.

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Originally Posted by Razard

Two examples: Hunts and the Diadems Dinosaur Island.

The community made it's bed, Poo'd in the bed, then complained the bed smells of poo.

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Yeah, hunts are in a bad state right now. People saying they're on the way, gets pulled anyway... Hunts are so over mobbed by players right now that if you're not in a full party you get basically 5% of the total possible reward...

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Originally Posted by Edvardelis

People saying they're on the way, gets pulled anyway... Hunts are so over mobbed by players right now

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You seem to be complaining about both sides of the coin.
You want people to wait for the server to show up or do you want them less outnumbered?

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Originally Posted by Razard

The community made it's bed, Poo'd in the bed, then complained the bed smells of poo.

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This made me laugh. at work.
immature4life lol

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Originally Posted by Canadane

You seem to be complaining about both sides of the coin.
You want people to wait for the server to show up or do you want them less outnumbered?

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They need some auto-join functionality to make it easier to get full credit, kind of like the way fates work.