DRK Det vs SkS for crafted melds?

Two tanking rings, both have a Str5 in the guaranteed slots.

It's crit capped already, so that leaves Determination or Skill Speed for melds.

Determination gives less stats than Skill Speed. Det 4s give 6 Det whereas SkS 4s give 9.

Tp costs were reduced last patch, making TPing out less of a concern.

Skill Speed means more mana returned from Blood Weapon when you can use it, and of course more auto speed. Lower GCD is also my preferred style of play from WoW days, I enjoy the faster gameplay.

3.0 adjusted SkS so it affects dots. This should mean Scourge AND Salted Earth scale from SkS. I'm not sure if the relationship between the two has been properly mathed out by anyone yet.

24 Det vs 36 SkS, which would you prefer? Remember you cant' just compare Det to SkS because you are getting MORE SkS per materia slot.

maybe someone else can chime in but i was under the impression that you could not meld STR into crafted gear regardless of if they have a slot or not.
i would personaly take the Det, the SKS will only bleed you dry faster, not that 36 SKS is much but is is still something worth concidering.

You can meld STR onto the VIT accessories. I currently have 2 both with 15str in them. Again, TP cost reduction happened and I dont think bleeding dry is an issue. I'm trying to get advice on pure dps between 24 det and 36 sks

If you get it all due to sks having exponential returns you're looking at sks melds.

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Originally Posted by Violette

If you get it all due to sks having exponential returns you're looking at sks melds.

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What do you mean by "if you get it all"? Anyway I'm thinking SkS melds are best for the tank rings, just seeing if anyone had other thoughts.

Det. Hands down, without question.

Skill Speed is actually really bad for DRK. The shorter your GCD is, the less of a boost Blood Weapon cutting 10% from it is (-10% from a 2.4 GCD is a greater gain than -10% from a 2.35 GCD). That and if your GCD is too short you cannot always properly double-weave under Blood Weapon.

If you like, get enough SkS for a GCD of 2.37 (minimum allowable GCD to not lose Scourge without BW use, should high Grit uptime be required for mitigation checks). I believe the value is 687-ish iirc. Any lower than that and you're just gimping your gains from BW and DRK's newly decent TP sustain.

Basically, you're better off pumping out higher raw damage since you already have a cooldown that effects your attack speed.

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Originally Posted by Syzygian

Det. Hands down, without question.

Skill Speed is actually really bad for DRK. The shorter your GCD is, the less of a boost Blood Weapon cutting 10% from it is (-10% from a 2.4 GCD is a greater gain than -10% from a 2.35 GCD). That and if your GCD is too short you cannot always properly double-weave under Blood Weapon.

If you like, get enough SkS for a GCD of 2.37 (minimum allowable GCD to not lose Scourge without BW use, should high Grit uptime be required for mitigation checks). I believe the value is 687-ish iirc. Any lower than that and you're just gimping your gains from BW and DRK's newly decent TP sustain.

Basically, you're better off pumping out higher raw damage since you already have a cooldown that effects your attack speed.

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I'm still trying to figure out my pattern for my crafted accs

@Syzy although while it does decrease tp/damage, it also does have the best damage/return out of all the stats, including crit (if you get enough of it).

My reasoning here is in small doses sks is stronger than det (not crit) and given the small amount of sks weighted against the potential eStr gain that sks is better.

Given that det is linear crit is quasi linear (still slightly negative) and sks is a)being forced on us b) positive with value that sks is not a bad stat.


Not to mention losing a tiny bit of blood weapon effiency is not worth a larger increase in gcd. That's just stupid man, c'mon.

Let's just take your example: 10% of 2.4 is 0.24.
So end gcd will be 2.16, no?

If the gcd starts at 2.35, 10% is 0.235.
So end gcd is 0.2125. Of course it is MINORLY less efficient but if that gets you an extra action during bloody weapon (which it does. 15/2.16 =6.99994 while 15/2.125=7.05) it is far more worth it for mp regain.

Skill speed only boosts the effective damage from more frequent gcd based moves, as far as Drk is concerned. On the other hand, det not only increases the base damage of all gcd moves, it also increases the damage dealt by drk's over abundance of offgcd attacks like Carve and Split and Dark Passenger.

I'd say det wins out.

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Originally Posted by BattleGrace

maybe someone else can chime in but i was under the impression that you could not meld STR into crafted gear regardless of if they have a slot or not.
i would personaly take the Det, the SKS will only bleed you dry faster, not that 36 SKS is much but is is still something worth concidering.

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Only overmelding is forbidden for primary stat
As long as you have open green slot AND if the equipment is not capped you can meld STR
Needless to say that only accessories are not STR capped

[QUOTE=Syzygian;3591152]

If you like, get enough SkS for a GCD of 2.37 (minimum allowable GCD to not lose Scourge without BW use, should high Grit uptime be required for mitigation checks). I believe the value is 687-ish iirc. /QUOTE]

I was looking for this information but couldnt get it. Thank you very much, that s always useful to read you.

It might be a silly question then i m sorry if it doesnt make sense but could it be useful to trade the Nothung for the i210 Deathbringer in order to get a SkS increase and reach that cap?

With i209 gear fending right side i m around 870 dps without grit and i feel like it could be better. I ve 519 SkS and 519 DET lol and cannot decide which route i should go

Ty!

So the valid argument is pure damage vs damage make up from hitting gcds a lot quicker. If I'm correct sks changes the gcd every 25 right? Maybe a nice median between getting sks and det.

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Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

Skill speed only boosts the effective damage from more frequent gcd based moves, as far as Drk is concerned.

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It boosts DoT damage, so Scourge and Salted Earth. Do we know the actual damage increase of Sks vs Det on these ?

I overmeld the rings w str V an SkS on the rings, since at least skill speed fell off a lot when the change arrive , an it feels a in a better track,
The earrings I use strV again an crit x4, still think the other 2 acc I should use det pentameld an one w accuracy pentameld, a nice balance of all.
WHat are you gojng for at the end?
Im interested to find out.

Sks also would increase the damage of Scourge AND Salted Earth (Thanks Reynhart for pointing that out above as I forgot), according to the 3.0 patch notes. Those two dots make up a nice chunk of our DPS. I don't know if anyone has mathed out how exactly it affects it but according to the game itself, it seems like it should. Maybe that could be a good factor in the debate between the two?

Also I think its very important to note that you can't really compare DET to CRIT on a point for point basis. Maybe det vs crit, det wins out on a point for point basis. However the materia values are not even. Det IVs give 6, SkS IVs give 9. You simply get more SkS for your materia slots than det, and that amounts to 10-12 bonus stats on a right side crafted piece. That adds up and further makes SkS look like a great choice in addition to its other benefits such as more mana from Blood Weapon, a faster GCD (Which I heavily prefer from my time in WoW, a lower GCD just feels more fun to me), more damage to Scourge and just in general

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

WHat are you gojng for at the end?
Im interested to find out.

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I think that ultimately the difference between full det or full sks will be relatively minor, leaning in one or the other's favor. Because of that, I am going to meld and run as much SkS as I can (choosing crit over sks whenever possible ofc) just to see how gameplay is for a DRK with tons of SkS. I listed a bunch of reasons in my original post why I dont think it will be a bad idea, but I also don't know how good of an idea it will be, so why not?

The thing is running Materia 4's sks will pull ahead on a point by point basis simply because you get 9 SKS instead of 6 DET however that is only with 4's. on a point per point basis with 5's the difference will be so small that an argument for either being better is moot, so yes technicly since you are strictly using 4's and not 5s then SKS is better from a mathematical standpoint since you just simply get more volume (stat) for relatively the same weight (stat weight) assuming that DET and SKS are as simular for DRK as they are for WAR and a lesser extent PLD (pally favors DET by a larger margin where as WAR is closer).

In my opinion though, math can go die in a sewer, i would still go DET but thats me.