Foresight

Does anybody still use this? Ever since I found out it only reduces physical damage by 5-6%(?) I've gotten to a point where i barely ever use it or i forgot it even existed. So if anyone still does use it, when and how do you use it? I'm honestly curious.

I usually use it during trashpulls and between tankbusters. If the boss is purely magical, it's useless but so do some other tank skills...

Damage reduction is damage reduction. Use it.

Generally you just want to keep it on CD, sometimes it's worthwhile to save for certain phases but generally you won't need to.

I honestly can't tell if its doing anything but I keep it on cooldown anyway. I think someone mathed it out and because of the way it scales, activating it is like putting on one more accessory. I'm not sure what ilvl you need for foresight to be that strong though.

I use it all the time, pairs nicely with blood bath and berserk on trash pulls.

I mean, with that mindset, why bother with Protect? Or any damage mitigation? Everything adds up. A tank that uses his CD's vs one that doesn't bother is worlds apart in difference when you are running through content.

Does anyone know the scaling on Defense VS mitigation?
Does Foresight get better with better gear or is it always a 5-6% equivalent?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jamillion

I use it all the time, pairs nicely with blood bath and berserk on trash pulls.

---

I use it with vengeance and bloodbath for big trash pulls. It gives my healers time to fire off a few salvos of Holy.

I use it as an anti-RNG cooldown or for times when I'll be taking a little extra damage, e.g if I get targeted by hypothermal missles in A1s or in thordan ex when tanking the 2 knights and mine is in sword oath stance.

These are some nice ideas i'm seeing here. I'll start experimenting with Foresight more. Thank you.

I generally throw it up on GC or at the tail end of pulls so that the healer might have a chance to throw out another AOE to bring down low health mobs. I save it though if the pull is mostly magical, which is less often.

last i heard it mathed out to 8% damage reduction. By itself it is fairly bland, IMO it should always be paired with something, not used as a stand alone CD

With most of the attacks in A4S being Magical this makes Bulwark, Sheltron, and Foresight good abilities for tanking Dolls. Better than nothing ^^. Otherwise, I usually just combine Foresight + Awareness as a single cooldown since their timers are the same.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Galgarion

I use it with vengeance and bloodbath for big trash pulls.

---

Curious. People have been saying in this thread that Foresight prevents about 5 or 6 percent of damage (raising defence by 20%). Combine that with Vengeance, which prevents 30% of damage, and how does that math work out while dealing counterattacks of 50 potency and Bloodbath recovering 25% of damage dealt as health?

I think the bottom line is that it reduces physical damage. Whenever you are taking physical damage, it is of benefit to use.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WolfKid

Does anybody still use this? Ever since I found out it only reduces physical damage by 5-6%(?)

---

It's a fair bit more than that now that tank gear has a lot more Defense to it.
It's now useful as opposed to it being rather forgettable back in 2.x.

Macro it to bloodbath and/ or berserk like I did. They all share a 90sec cd. Then just double tap the button problem solved.

Yea, as others have said it's a bit underwhelming when used alone. I typically pair it with convalescense, or sometimes with awareness if I don't need it for raw intuition protection.

Foresight increases physical defense (look at your Attributes before and after popping it). Foresight isn't to the "damage reduction" mitigation like Rampart or Vengeance, but it's still defense.

I use it often. Granted, it's the first defensive CD I always use, as I never want to be completely naked during most fights, especially bosses.

Foresight is good.

If your basic defense mitigates 40% of incoming damage, then Rampart's 20% is actually only acting on 60% of incoming leftover damage. 60% x .8 is 48% so Rampart's 20% actually only mitigated 12% of true incoming damage.

Raising your 40% mitigation from defense by 20%, will increase it by 8%. 8% doesn't sound like a lot, but it's 2/3 of what Rampart did. Most people do not look at the Defense mitigation model correctly, and they compare Foresight's mitigation to Rampart's advertised mitigation, instead of Rampart's actual mitigation effect.

Full 210 tank gear defense with protect mitigates about 42% of incoming damage at the moment, so Foresight is a little better than 2/3 of rampart, and will get better over time again as we gain item level. Of course, it only works on physical.

Extreme versions of this model are nice to illustrate the difference in scaling. If defense mitigates 0% of damage, foresight is useless. If defense mitigates 50% of incoming damage, foresight is exactly even with a 20% mitigator. If defense mitigates 80% of damage, Foresight would be 4x more effective than a 20% mitigator ability.

When I'm DRK MT in Thordan Ex - Just as Shield Oath Holybladedance is coming up, I will use Dark Arts + Dark Dance + Foresight to save on my stronger CDs I will also use this combo for the first Heavenly Heel to save on CDs for later. For Sword Oath Holy Bladedance I will only use Shadow Wall if I have faith in my healers. Otherwise it will be both Shadow Wall + Shadowskin.

Overall, I will use Foresight combined with another skill that has a shorter CD timer.

It makes it look like I'm doing tank things instead of writing that spur of the moment Haurchefant Fanfiction idea I had.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Judge_Xero

Does anyone know the scaling on Defense VS mitigation?
Does Foresight get better with better gear or is it always a 5-6% equivalent?

---

It gets better with better gear because the Defense value on that gear keeps going up.

I combo foresight with vengence sometimes and if used with path and IB active it's like nothing hurts at all. But I use it on trash mobs or if it's too late to dodge AOE I use it to mitigate some damage. It's better then being bare naked. I combo it with rampart or shadow skin. The higher your defense the stronger it is. Not saying much since others lowers damage reduction. But with better armor it should scale better.

Quote:

---

Does anybody still use this? Ever since I found out it only reduces physical damage by 5-6%(?) I've gotten to a point where i barely ever use it or i forgot it even existed. So if anyone still does use it, when and how do you use it? I'm honestly curious.

---

Like with all my other CDs I don't keep Foresight on cooldown but I do use it, like when there's 3+ melee monsters or if I've been at ≤75% health for a while. As a healer I've ran with tanks that seemingly keep everything on cooldown, even when only fighting 2 monsters, and then be CD-starved when fighting bosses. So as a tank I try to use it when it matters, not when it doesn't.

I'll usually tack it on the end of Awareness after Bulwark falls off.

As others have said, mitigation is mitigation (so why do we hate Parry again?), so it's worth using, and it will have the most effect in situations where you're taking a lot of physical damage.

I tend to keep at least one CD running most of the time. Foresight is one that I keep almost entirely on cool down though, since it can mitigate a fair amount. I would NOT use just foresight on any pull with teeth though.

I keep it on cooldown. I usually activate it going into a trash pull or at the beginning of a boss fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WolfKid

Does anybody still use this? Ever since I found out it only reduces physical damage by 5-6%(?) I've gotten to a point where i barely ever use it or i forgot it even existed. So if anyone still does use it, when and how do you use it? I'm honestly curious.

---

Your character is beautiful. The golden eyes, dark skin combination on lalafells rock. I'm out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunda_Cat_SMASH

I tend to keep at least one CD running most of the time. Foresight is one that I keep almost entirely on cool down though, since it can mitigate a fair amount. I would NOT use just foresight on any pull with teeth though.

---

I like Foresight just as equal as my other CDs.

I find Foresight to be abysmal if not in synergy with other mitigation CDs. So basically I see Foresight as a combo CD and pretty much not a reliable defense mechanic.

Given it reduces physical damage by about 7%, yeah I use it on cooldown for all non A4S bosses. 500+enmity per use (iirc) and 7% is still more than dark dance (mfw).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Violette

Given it reduces physical damage by about 7%, yeah I use it on cooldown for all non A4S bosses. 500+enmity per use (iirc) and 7% is still more than dark dance (mfw).

---

Correct me if I'm wrong, but for DD to be less than 7%, your base parry rate would have to be zero or very close to it. When progressing on an encounter tanks aren't able to get their parry rate to the bare minimum using Void Ark gear and other such shenanigans that are symptoms of being hideously overgeared to begin with, so its actually a much more powerful CD in those instances when you're gearing up and having to deal with having a parry rate higher than whatever it is at 341, which is still enough to make DD better than Foresight... And then there's its recast which makes it at least double Foresight's mitigation over the course of a fight.

Either way, DD almost 100% means Reprisal, which is raid wide mitigation at no cost to DPS and really is kind of an extra CD for DRK as much at it is just looked at as another oGCD DPS ability, so comparing it to Foresight which has no implications or effects for DRK beyond that 20% extra defense is a bit misleading, I feel.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Syzygian

Correct me if I'm wrong, but for DD to be less than 7%, your base parry rate would have to be zero or very close to it. When progressing on an encounter tanks aren't able to get their parry rate to the bare minimum using Void Ark gear and other such shenanigans that are symptoms of being hideously overgeared to begin with, so its actually a much more powerful CD in those instances when you're gearing up and having to deal with having a parry rate higher than whatever it is at 341, which is still enough to make DD better than Foresight... And then there's its recast which makes it at least double Foresight's mitigation over the course of a fight.

Either way, DD means Reprisal, which is raid wide mitigation at no cost to DPS, so comparing it to Foresight which has no implications or effects for DRK beyond that 20% extra defense is a bit misleading, I feel.

---

Well, you're not exactly wrong, it's just a simple mathematical calculation comparing the two:

I.E, 20% defence is roughly 7% physical damage taken down during it's duration.
Compared to dark dance,, which is 30% parry (roughly). A parry is 20% physical damage reduction, which mean it itself will average out to 6% over infinite samples. Of course, should you proc RE during DD (not guaranteed, just likely assuming you pop it during a auto-attack continuous phase), you will bump it up to 16%. (simply put, 0.2*0.3=0.06, hence 6% damage reduction)

EDITED SECTION: For the sake of science I had a look at some old threads and it appears the base parry rate for classes is different, with dark knight rocking much higher than expected, (8%), which would put DD parry at 38%, which would then put defensive end at 7.6%!, meaning it edges out the estimated defensive bonus of foresight slightly. However this can roll higher OR lower, but DD gets better with more parry and defense while Foresight only gets better with more defense.

Though I may have made a wrong assumption somewhere in there due to spending all day reading boring papers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Violette

Well, you're not exactly wrong, it's just a simple mathematical calculation comparing the two:

ONE MOMENT MATH WAS WRONG

---

LOL, I think unlike raw mitigation CDs which are multiplicative, an % increase to a RNG *rate* in this game is additive. Otherwise things like Abandon Stacks, Internal Release, and Battle Litany would be so laughably weak as to almost make no difference. I could be wrong. It'd be really sad if I was.

As I was editting because I made the same initial mistake, DD at base parry rate is roughly ~0.2-0.4% better than foresight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Violette

For the sake of science I had a look at some old threads

---

OMG. I know which ones you're talking about. Been looking for EVER. Link pls?

I usually try to rotate it on Dark with shadow skin usually during Dark Dance or at the tail end of Blood Price to close the gap between defensive buffs. Also a bunch on paladin and Warrior, to slow down hp loss. If you are barely using it then your total defense is likely good for content or your healer is on top of things (other than enmity.)

Foresight + Convalescence is a pretty potent combo. By themselves, they aren't all that great, but when used together they cover for each other's deficiencies (assuming your healer is even half awake, that is). Convalescence, also cover's for Foresight's lack of magic mitigation via active healing, and given that the two of them share a GCD, it's pretty straight forward to just pair them together regardless of which tank you are using.

Together, they work quite well for low dmg situations. This is pretty much my go to combo for small pulls or any instance in which I know dmg is light. If Dmg is heavy, on the other hand, they can also be easily paired with other GCD's for additional mitigation without using a strong CD such as Rampart/shadow skin or Sentinel/shadow wall. It's a good way to save your bigger CD's for when they're really needed.

When helping in Thordan learning parties where the dps is abysmally low so that Awareness, Foresight, and Clemency can just barely be used twice, I've actually gotten through Blade Dance just fine (like... consistently a nice 300 hp remaining, or 3.3k with Clemency crit) just with Foresight, Shelltron, Awareness, Convalescence, and a pre-cast Clemency (heal hitting on the 3rd hit, with Shelltron blocking the 4th; no further RNG blocks needed). Drop the Foresight, and I die. Similarly, my shittily geared pure str PLD can survive the cleave, Heel, cleave combo before phase shift even with just a Foresight, pre-cast Clemency, Shelltron, and a second pre-clemency, no Cure IIs needed. Again, without the Foresight, I die.

6% mitigation is quite nice when you would otherwise have died by 4%.