Where are lalafells from again?

So i always thought that Lalafells were from some southern islands until i got my hands on a certain fish.

A Dark sleeper.

A small freshwater fish originally from the eastern continent of Othard. It is said that the first dark sleeper was introduced to Eorzea by an exiled Lalafellin prince who wished to once again experience the luxuries of his homeland.

So here we have an item stating that there was a Lala prince wanting to taste a fish from his homeland, a fish from Othard. But lalafells are from Southern Islands not Othard.

So where are Lalafells from exactly?

Plainsfolk are from the southern islands (north of meracydia) atleast, those lalas that went to Vylbrand came from there. BUT there s the chance of more lalafels existing. of that one being Dunefolk(wich i honestly don't know where they are from) And the chance of being just an exception about one lalafel that was a prince there for other reasons.

But we know that well. uhm.. if we go deeper.... allagans rulled all over the world. when their downfall was brought, some survivors went to thanlan ish(i think) (tho that the ruins of qarn and other pre-beladhia structures have the same architectures as the Cathedral of the remnants of sephirot(treant beings) that praised Azeyma too AND were from Meracydia.

but anyway, tryng to get back on the track.... there is the chance that allagans have also sort of spread lalafels there? (as silly as it might sound, popotos)

Well, there's this...

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Aetherochemical Compound 123.

Unlike anything else on Eorzea, compound #123 is thought to be another of the Allagan Empire's failed chimeric creations. The creature seems to be harmless enough, feeding only on the tiny water lice which inhabit Azys Lla's aetherochemical pools. Its outer hide, however, has given many a naturalist pause as it bears a texture almost identical to that of a Lalafell's skin.

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This is one of those times that a caveat comes into play: History as we know it is written by historians of the Sixth Astral Era. Some of what they say is true, some of what they say is false, and, most confusingly, some of what they say was only true at the time.

Example: According to Sixth Astral Era historians, the Elezen were the sole inhabitants of Eorzea until three great migratory waves of Hyur showed up. So what's up with all the Allagan royalty being Hyruan? Unei? Doga? Hell, all of the augmented clones are Hyurish.

The truth is that the races have come on gone, rose and declined, for 10,000 years. Just because the Elezen were basically the "sole inhabitants" of Eorzea in the early Sixth Astral doesn't mean there couldn't have possibly barely been any in Second Astral Era times. Even the Clans seem to rise and fall and shift, and most of the ones we have seem to have risen based on recent events. The Duskwight and Gelmorra, the Dunesfolk and the arrival in Thanalan, the Highlanders and the Tribes of Gyr Abania, the Hellsguard and the tribes of the Farreach.

Back to your question: The lalafell as we know them came to Eorzea as recently as we've been keeping history from the Southern Islands. But they could have been anywhere and anywhere before that. Hells, it could be both and that aforementioned Lalafell prince went to Othard from the Southern Islands. We just don't know much more than relatively recent history.

Yeah, it seems that lalafell (Plainsfolk)are from the Southern Isles and there are plenty of evidence that states this: Fig Umbrella, character creation detail, etc.

Dunesfolk lalafell seem to be the later "evolution" of the lalafells that migrated to Thanalan; their eyes being adapted to the desert.

The world of Hydaelyn in vast in that there are many continents; Othard is just one continent so it's very possible that a country within Othard had a Lalafell-ruled kingdom

I personally believe that there have been many tribes/clans of the known races throughout the world that we don't yet know about. Like how Dunesfolk seem to be an offshoot of Plainsfolk. Duskwights being an off shoot of the Wildwood especially since it was said they adapted to life in the underground to keep apart from the Hyur.

Then there's the Garleans who are Hyur, but are clearly different; just like a Midlander vs Highlander.

Lalafell are clearly Voidsent. How else do you explain those eyes? Ahriman ancestry.

/thread

:cool:

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

The truth is that the races have come on gone, rose and declined, for 10,000 years. Just because the Elezen were basically the "sole inhabitants" of Eorzea in the early Sixth Astral doesn't mean there couldn't have possibly barely been any in Second Astral Era times.

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But Anonymoose, not that most of Mhachi's habitants were lalafells. Arent they the ancestors or Uldah? Doesnt surprise me if there were hyurs too, specially hyghanders ( hyghander statue on the void ark )
So by the time of the 5th astral era, there were already hyurs, elezen, lalafells and miqotes too ( miqotes came on the ice age or even before )

Why you are saing that elezens were the only inhabitants of eorzea on the early 6th astral era? o_o

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Originally Posted by Frederick22

Why you are saing that elezens were the only inhabitants of eorzea on the early 6th astral era? o_o

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It's the very first thing you're told about Elezen in the Character Creator.

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In former times, the Elezen were the sole inhabitants of Eorzea, claiming dominion over her. Traditionally a nomadic people, the tall, slender Elezen believed the realm to be theirs by divine right—a gift from the Twelve themselves. Unfortunately, this belief made the eventual appearance of the Hyur in their multitudes akin to an invasion, and a long history of conflict ensued.

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The timing of the migratory waves is helped along by Albin the Ashen's Hunt flavor.

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When the Hyuran tribe came to Thanalan some 800 years ago, Albin the Ashen was at the head of one of the columns.

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And to bring it all home, Fernehalwes laid it out more clearly in an interview:

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Originally Posted by Koji Fox

There are times when Eorzea has been more populated by one race over another and there will be conflict there. With the Hyur and Elezen, that’s very recent. In the Sixth Astral Era, the Elezen migrated in and in that era they were like, “We’re the first ones here!” even though they weren’t <...> And of course the pesky Hyur, who are everywhere, come in and the Elezen are like, “Oh, my god(s). We left you that whole continent up there! Why are you here!?” And the Lalafell come in and you have these cycles of clashing and moving and that gets ingrained in their society and their racial cultures.

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In terms of the Lalafell, again... Belah'dia (Sixth Astral Era successor of Mhach, later split into Ul'dah and Sil'dih) evidently had Lalafell based on the tombs left by them in the ruins of Qarn and continuing Lalafellin leadership today. But do we know much about Mhachi races, yet? We have the hyur-ish statues in the Void Ark and a few names, but otherwise it's just the south seas Lalafells that teamed up with Mhach to take down Nym, that I remember.

The bottom line is that you have to look at historical information as a whole. Some of the conflicting information is the result of in-world ignorance.

Miqo'te at least were also known at the height of the Allagan Empire as well - one of the node quests in Azys Lla actually identifies the player by their race if they happen to be a miqo'te, and are then treated as a regular (although evidently lower ranked) 'citizen' by it. I don't buy the whole 'the modern races were all genetically created by the Allag!' arguement, but at the very least, that and the lalafell references previously mentioned show that the Spoken races were at least known to them, if not a part of their society.

That doesn't mean they didn't at least make use of the existing races in their Frankenstein research though - because it was clear that at their height they had eventually became so decadent as to throw all morality to the wind and actually use their own people in genetic experiments, a monster with the skin of a lalafell' starts to make a twisted and disturbing kind of sense.

As for the elezen being the 'original' race in Eorzea, again that's something I'm rather wary about claiming as gospel - remember the original 'Eorzea creation story' that was first mentioned way back at the start of 1.0, referring to the 'early tribes' moving out across Eorzea after the First Calamity? true it doesn't specifically refer to any particular race, but....

Then, there is something that has quietly unnerved me throughout ARR, has been the constant subtle referencing to the five six races collectively (usually by the beastmen or Primals) as the 'sons/daughters of man', suggesting... a protorace of 'men' once flourished in the past. And this makes me think back to FFXI with the whole Zilart/Kuluu thing. Yet it's never been explained once. Was there another race way back at the beginning of history, long dead but from which the Spoken races all descended? If so, what exactly is this race?

/puts on darksteel foil hat

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Miqo'te at least were also known at the height of the Allagan Empire as well - one of the node quests in Azys Lla actually identifies the player by their race if they happen to be a miqo'te, and are then treated as a regular (although evidently lower ranked) citizen. I don't buy the whole 'the modern races were all genetically created by the Allag!' arguement, but at the very least, they were known to them, if not a part of their society.

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I don't buy it, either, but with Lala's... I most certainly do... and I'm only partly joking there.

The question is, if they are then are Lala's in fact the finished result and for what (hellish) reason, or did they realize it wasn't going anywhere and just let them join the other less-than-civilian-rights groups?

Also, I believe that node identified the player character by race no matter what, be it Lala, Au Ra, Elezen etc etc.

Lalas just grow spontaneously from within large heads of cabbage.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

It's the very first thing you're told about Elezen in the Character Creator.

The timing of the migratory waves is helped along by Albin the Ashen's Hunt flavor.

And to bring it all home, Fernehalwes laid it out more clearly in an interview:



In terms of the Lalafell, again... Belah'dia (Sixth Astral Era successor of Mhach, later split into Ul'dah and Sil'dih) evidently had Lalafell based on the tombs left by them in the ruins of Qarn and continuing Lalafellin leadership today. But do we know much about Mhachi races, yet? We have the hyur-ish statues in the Void Ark and a few names, but otherwise it's just the south seas Lalafells that teamed up with Mhach to take down Nym, that I remember.

The bottom line is that you have to look at historical information as a whole. Some of the conflicting information is the result of in-world ignorance.

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I didnt know that specific part, thanks for the clarification XD

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

one of the node quests in Azys Lla actually identifies the player by their race if they happen to be a miqo'te, and are then treated as a regular (although evidently lower ranked) 'citizen' by it.

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The nodes address you by your race where appropriate no matter what it is:

http://puu.sh/iUG3b/2e18248bc5.jpg

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Originally Posted by AstralKaos

Also, I believe that node identified the player character by race no matter what, be it Lala, Au Ra, Elezen etc etc.

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

The nodes address you by your race where appropriate no matter what it is:

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Ah, I see, thanks for that confirmation both of you. :) I'd seen in another thread someone mention a reference on Azys Lla to miqo'te being created by the Allag, so typical me didn't check her facts first and just saw that node's statement as 'confirming' that. Either way, it definitely proves that the Spoken races were known to the Allag at least, but again, I'm not convinced they are all results of Allagan genetic engineering.

Thanks again! :)

Well Miqo'te are from Myracidia and Allag did go on a very long conquest campain against Myracidia, resulting in The True Bahamut being killed, Bahamut Prime being summoned in retaliation, then the imprisonment of Bahamut Prime in Dalamuld and inslaving/imprisoning of the other Dragons for various ends.

So, in the campain I can guarantee the Allagan came across the Miqo'te at least a few times.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

Well Miqo'te are from Myracidia and Allag did go on a very long conquest campain against Myracidia, resulting in The True Bahamut being killed, Bahamut Prime being summoned in retaliation, then the imprisonment of Bahamut Prime in Dalamuld and inslaving/imprisoning of the other Dragons for various ends.

So, in the campain I can guarantee the Allagan came across the Miqo'te at least a few times.

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We were slaves..

The term is "reduced-privilege prospective citizen." How dare you misconstrue the magnanimous glory of Allag.

Though in all seriousness, it's amazing how much we've managed to learn without having any idea about the questions that people actually care about.

Sorry for hijacking the thread, but since you guys are talking about continents...

I ws playing Gubal again, and my friend took note of one of the books:

Though there is some debate as to whether or not Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn and her League of Lost Bastards were the first Eorzeans to discover the western continent, (...)

(...)Of particular note is their first encounter with the Mamool Ja, as well as other indigenous peoples and creatures which seemed curiously intent on their demise.

What continent are they talking about? I had the impression that Eorzea was the last one to be discovered and most of the world was known by the present time. And... a whole continent, why is nobody talking about this?!

And... this seems very very recent. Wasn't the library closed for decades?

And that little bit about the Mamool Ja. Aren't they native to Vylbrand? I mean, they were in the island BEFORE the Galadion arrives in there... right? Were they just hiding?

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Originally Posted by Rofel

Sorry for hijacking the thread, but since you guys are talking about continents...

I ws playing Gubal again, and my friend took note of one of the books:

Though there is some debate as to whether or not Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn and her League of Lost Bastards were the first Eorzeans to discover the western continent, (...)

(...)Of particular note is their first encounter with the Mamool Ja, as well as other indigenous peoples and creatures which seemed curiously intent on their demise.

What continent are they talking about? I had the impression that Eorzea was the last one to be discovered and most of the world was known by the present time. And... a whole continent, why is nobody talking about this?!

And... this seems very very recent. Wasn't the library closed for decades?

And that little bit about the Mamool Ja. Aren't they native to Vylbrand? I mean, they were in the island BEFORE the Galadion arrives in there... right? Were they just hiding?

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First, this is way off topic and has nothing to do a all with this thread, not a even a little.

Second, you are mistaken, this has already being talked and a lot.

Sure, forgive me about that. Could you please link me to one of said threads talking about this? Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Rofel

Sure, forgive me about that. Could you please link me to one of said threads talking about this? Thanks.

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Look of on the Lore, find something that involves the books of the Gubal Library.

Mamool Ja are not native to Vyldbrand, but instead the western continent (New World). There was a mass immigration after Dalamud due to a shortage of workers/mercenaries in Vyldbrand which attracted them to replace the diminished Adventurer population (iirc).

It's more likely "rediscovered" western continent, but yes this is important. It sounded like, I think, that Merlwyb's discovery was before her ascension to the Admiral seat so probably some 20? odd years ago.

It's much the same discussion in this thread about Lalafell. Yes, Lalafell, as Eorzean scholars believe, came from the South Sea Islands--but they only really have details about Sixth Astral Era migratory waves between Clans. Most Umbral Eras have been something of a dark age where previous knowledge was lost. We know Vyldbrand was inhabited by the Nymians, and by extension Lalafell, before the Galadion crashed.

Hells, Eorzean scholars still debate about whether magmafish are real or whether Hydaelyn is millions of years old or only about 20,000 years old.

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Originally Posted by Rofel

What continent are they talking about?
And that little bit about the Mamool Ja. Aren't they native to Vylbrand?

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Originally Posted by Rocl

Mamool Ja are not native to Vyldbrand, but instead the western continent (New World). There was a mass immigration after Dalamud due to a shortage of workers/mercenaries in Vyldbrand which attracted them to replace the diminished Adventurer population. <...> It's more likely "rediscovered" western continent <...> they only really have details about Sixth Astral Era <...> We know Vyldbrand was inhabited by the Nymians, and by extension Lalafell, before the Galadion crashed.

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Nailed it.

To use the tired but true Hydaelyn-Earth metaphor, the Three Great Continents are basically Africa (Eorzea), Europe (Ilsabard), and Asia (Othard). Thavnair's a nearby island themed after the Ottoman-ish areas, and Meracydia is an island and/or minor continent to the south. However, the "New World" consists of "The Americas". When the Mamool Ja come from there, they even bring avocados, which opens up the door for a really uncomfortable migrant Latin American labor parallel that I'm going to avoid as much as possible.

When the game says Near East of Far East or New World or Oriental, it's pretty close to what you'd expect on Earth.

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Originally Posted by Rocl

Hells, Eorzean scholars still debate about whether magmafish are real or whether Hydaelyn is millions of years old or only about 20,000 years old.

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Oh, gods. 10,000 years of eras... A second Genesis around Hydaelyn and the fear of the Moon...

Are our major hints leaning towards us being ... Young-Crystal Creationists!?

I have to go.

I have a...  ...food...  ...in the oven.

Thanks for the answers, fellas! Really appreciate it! :3

well it started long ago when a drunk allagan scientist thought it would be funny to tinker with some specimens and make them shorter then they were that have no boobs of any kind and all look alike whether they are male or female. Maybe cuzz he was hungry and figured they would be tasty treats?...point is they are tiny puntable race that are forever doomed to look like fat kids all the same regardless of gender.-shrug- dunno