Hey there everyone I have a question. I'm new to FF14 but not new to mmos. So my question is how hard is tanking in ff14? I've always mainly play as a DPS class in wow and my main is a ret. paladin there. So I started ff14 as a Gladiator because I really like using swords. But I'm little scared I won't be able to handle the responsibility of being a tank and plus I being hearing from my free company member that ff14 is hard on tanks. So is tanking really that hard? If so what class do you think I should switch to?
Thank you
Edit: Thanks guys for answering my question and I feeling little more confident about being a tank. If anyone else have more tip for a beginner Tank please post them. Also what you guys thing is easiest way to play the game a keyboard and mouse or a PS4 controller? Thanks again for all the help.
Edit 2: Wow alot of great advise thanks guys. I really enjoying this community. Yáll been very helpful.
Question about Tanking in FF14
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12-28-2015, 01:05 PMMrJPtheAssassinQuestion about Tanking in FF14
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12-28-2015, 02:11 PMEnkidoh
Welcome to Eorzea! :D
Tanking in FFXIV is pretty straightforward but can be challenging depending on the class/Job. Lucky for you though Gladiator (GLA) (and it's Paladin (PLD) Job upgrade) is regarded as the 'basic/beginner' tank class as it is very bread and butter in it's abilities - although early on naturally you won't have access to all of them, but the first twenty levels or so still teach you the basics of your role.
A lot of players dislike GLA/PLD though sadly simply because it is so basic and prefer more flashier, complex tank classes (the others being Marauder (MRD) and it's Job upgrade of Warrior (WAR) that use a great axe, and the new 'extra Job' of Dark Knight (DRK) which has no base class which uses a two handed great sword), but that does it a gross disservice, as GLA/PLD is still very fun and easy to get into - it has strong damage mitigating abilities and a simple set of attack rotations, with PLD adding a tanking stance that boosts hate considerably. Another advantage for playing as a tank in general is tanks are always in demand and thus you will find queue times in the Duty Finder will be much less than other class roles. ;)
But then I am biased because GLA/PLD is my main and has been since I first started in the original version of FFXIV (1.0). Plus I just love the whole 'knight in shining armour' idea. ;) -
12-28-2015, 03:06 PMClaire_Pendragon
With the current tweeks to tanking, I'd say 90% of the time, tanking is going to be easy. 10% of the time you'll have issues.
(Some level ranges on some classes, with certain combinations of gear, can make tanking near impossible, even with skill. But it's rare.)
For now, just know when to range pull your primary target, aoe enough times to make all targets have threat on ya, and then single target which ever mob has the lowest HP. (As thats the mob you will most likely see DPS have the highest threat on)
Pop at LEAST 1 defensive CD at the start of each fight, once u have a few/enough to do this. (hard to do it at low levels, as u lack CDs)
Pop offensive CD at the start of a boss fight, to make sure u get threat.
Conserve ur resources (be it MP or TP)
You can spam all day, and hold perfect threat, but then when u run to the next group, you're out of resources.
(This is the main reason geared tanks pull more than 1 group of mobs, to make sure they can dump more resources, and get more out of them.)
Dont bother stuning attacks, as most of the time u help the healer by just dodging, as DPS continue to attack the mobs standing there trying to do their AoEs.
Some bosses might need it, but very rarely.
I'd suggest stuns for mobs who are close to death, and you may need to focus your threat on another target, but you're about to lose hate, or just lost hate to that low HP mob. (stun is 3-6 seconds, and the mob usually dies before the stun wears off)
Gear up your weapon 1st, then armor. (dont slack on them too much, as it WILL make things harder on ya.)
(also, if you play MRD/WAR, I found it easier to control the group of mobs, if u run through the group, and hit flash as u enter the center of the group. turn around, and overpower. Mainly since ppl love to range random targets, which cause yoru overpowers to sometimes miss mobs. Otherwise, as DRK and PLD, single targeting is fine, as your circle AoEs wont usually miss the stragglers. But its still good to turn mobs away from the rest of the group MOST of the time, just make sure the enemies attacks dont line up with the rest of the group.) -
12-28-2015, 05:11 PMJoe_SchmoeI'd say harder, if only because, unlike WoW, all dungeons scale your gear/stats down to what the dungeon level is. In this game, you won't queue up and then have your job done for you by the raid-geared/heirloom geared players that decide to queue up as well. Here, you gotta learn the hard way. Personally I think it's awesome, but I'm pretty sure opinions vary.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrJPtheAssassin
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12-29-2015, 07:04 PMUrthdigger
Tanking, at least early on, is piss easy. Use the ranged attack from your level 15 class quest to pull monsters (Only two guildhests are at level 10, other than that all group content is 15+), use your AoE ability (Flash for paladin) to get some initial hate on the enemies (a good rule of thumb is to do so once for every monster in the pack), then use your enmity combo (Fast Blade into Savage Blade, then into Rage of Halone once unlocked). Cycle through them to ensure you keep hate on everything (You can also mark a kill order, but many players ignore this). Alternatively, if you have more than 3 monsters just keep spamming your area of effect.
That's the bare minimum you need to know. Do that, and you'll be able to tank all your dungeons as you level up. There's more you can learn, such as how to maximize your damage capabilities while keeping hate, how to do large pulls to clear dungeons far faster with AoE damage, and the more advanced tricks necessary for trials and raids (Which is something every role needs to learn on a fight by fight basis). Still, if you manage to keep hate on everything, and keep your gear decently leveled, you'll do well enough to keep your party happy. -
12-29-2015, 08:40 PMSpiritMuse
Not much to add except that it's important that you keep your gear at least somewhat up to date. And make sure you're wearing specific tank gear, not just "Disciple of War" gear, as it'll help a lot with your survivability and make your job (as well as the healer's) a lot easier.
And both the mouse/keyboard combo and the controller are valid options. It really depends on what you prefer, I play with a controller and don't find it to be difficult. I think mouse/keyboard may give you a bit more flexibility and customization though if that's important to you. -
12-30-2015, 03:53 AMNaria
I think it is less that tanking is hard in FFXIV so much as it is very visible, so that when a tank makes mistakes it is noticed by more of the party. One thing I would like to add is do not gear for strength while leveling and learning (bonus points and accessories). Strength tanks are something that is done in FFXIV at endgame for DPS checks and speed runs which I have unfortunately have been seeing copied by more and more baby tanks. Gear vit while learning--it will give you more HP and room to make mistakes (or have your healer make one) without resulting in a wipe which will slow the party down a lot more than a little less dps.
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12-30-2015, 09:10 AMMrJPtheAssassinThanks alot about the tip about gearing up Vit that make alot of scene. Thanks for the help.Quote:
Originally Posted by Naria
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12-31-2015, 02:10 AMKosmos992kI'd just like to add, that if you do not play end-game content, then playing a hybrid build of STR/VIT works well, but feel free to max your VIT. In Duty Finder the quality of players will vary by their ability and experience. So you may be faced with a healer that cannot keep up with the demands of healing you as a STR tank, but can keep up if you stacked VIT for all those extra HP. They provide an additional buffer for the healer, which can be the difference between them losing you and catching up in time to keep you alive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Naria
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01-03-2016, 05:55 PMviewtyjoeHonestly, if they can't keep a STR tank up, they aren't going to do much better with a VIT tank. The single most important thing you figure out at the outset of a run is how hard you can lean on your healer. If this means I'm single pulling all dungeon long, so be it. I'd much prefer to be doing that much more damage and ending encounters quicker. The extra STR also means that I'm more effective at holding threat in the first place, which then frees up good healers and DPS to be less cautious.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kosmos992k
Of course, I also main a melee class, so I come from the perspective of consistently peeling bosses off of VIT tanks and less geared tanks in general. -
01-03-2016, 06:35 PMChiramu
Make sure to rotate your enmity combo between the mobs to keep aggro. The enmity metre is on the party list icons, full bar is full aggro. So make sure you keep your enmity up on all targets.
Breaking into tanking you can number the targets to tell the DPS to attack 1, 2, 3 etc. You still must keep aggro on all targets or you will have mobs running after Arcanists/SMNs(AOE DOT damage) and your healers with heal aggro. -
01-07-2016, 03:19 AMKosmos992kIf you are an experienced DPS player, then you should know to throttle your initial burst of damage, and manage your target selection. If you as a fully leveled and geared DPS cannot throttle your DPS to allow a newbie tank to do their job, then you are not helping them learn the game. It doesn't matter whether they have a STR build or a VIT build in the leveling dungeons, if you don't throttle your output, or give them a chance to build a lead, you'll be able to rip hate from them.Quote:
Originally Posted by viewtyjoe
In non-end game content, the STR tank meta from End-game doesn't really have a place or belong. There is all sorts of theory craft about the use of STR not least of which is the argument that the best mitigation is killing things more quickly. That's not actually true, but people think it is because if stuff dies quicker, then ultimately the tank takes less cumulative damage and the healer has to do less cumulative healing. However, that's not functional mitigation.
If you're facing a pack of 4 enemies that can do high damage with their base attacks, you need damage mitigation and more HP to survive the encounter. Being able to kill all 4 in one fewer GCD (turn) because you're running an STR build doesn't help if you die within two turns because you have all your optional build points in STR and therefore don't have enough HP to survive long enough for the healer to recover. With less HP, the incoming damage is more threatening to you forcing the healer to spend more time and attention on healing you. Remember that this is advice for a new player, not a level sync'd player with gear options coming out of their ears.
Again from the perspective of a new player; in Brayflox story mode for example, there are several quite hard hitting enemies, the same is true for Haukke Manor and of course manage other leveling dungeons thereafter. A tank geared appropriately to their level doesn't have enough mitigation to survive a large pull or even a normal pull without constant attention from the healer. The more VIT and therefore HP a tank has at that stage the greater the cushion is for the healer to recover from the initial bursts of damage the tank will take. A STR tank build with level appropriate gear will be cut down quite quickly unless the DPS are strong enough to make everything dead fast.
Bard/Archer can also rip hate via their AoE, and some of the Melee classes can do the same if they ignore target priority (or are highly geared level sync'd players who do not throttle their initial damage burst). Numbering targets is a good thing to do, but don't be surprised if many DPS players ignore the markers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiramu
I play Paladin, so this is from the gladiator/paladin point of view; Rotate your hate combo as suggested. I tend to do a 1,2 on target 1, then 3 on target 2, then 1,2, on target 1 and 3 on target 3, and toss in extra Flashes to keep things topped up. Opening with 2 flashes is a good idea. Don't use provoke to pull unless you have to pull at extreme range, otherwise you waste the skill and it has a significant delay.
The reason I suggest breaking up the hate rotation 1,2, and then 3 on a separate target instead of rotating each attack to a new target is that the hate multipliers are least strong on the first two moves, so for a significant amount of aggro, you really need moves 1 & 2 on the same target, then 3 on another target. Move 3 is strong enough that you don't need to immediately follow with 1 & 2 on that same target
It there are 3 targets, called A, B and C, I'd suggest something like;
shield lob/tomahawk target A, flash, flash
1 & 2 target A
3 target B
Flash
1&2 target A
3 target C
1&2 on target B
3 target A (unless it's dead, then switch to C)
And so on. You keep the combo going for max hate multipliers, but by keeping moves 1&2 together you generate more than a trivial amount of aggro. The first move in the combo has nothing but the base hate multiplier, and is therefore pretty weak. The second move has a higher hate multiplier in conjunction with the first move, so 1&2 together are significantly better than either 1 or 2 on their own. -
01-07-2016, 06:17 AMKatra
There are also videos that you can view to get a good handle on tanking. This one I found on YouTube is probably my favorite one that covers low level tanking (up to level 30) for both tanking classes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUP6MgI2RGA
Although I do not tank a lot myself, I would take the crafting suggestion only as that, a suggestion. So do not worry about trying to level a DoH to create a weapon. Otherwise, I thought it was a funny and insightful guide for someone learning the basics of tanking in ARR and beyond. -
01-07-2016, 06:20 AMIagainsti
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01-11-2016, 05:33 AMHiromiVenia
I will tell you the most common fails i see on newbye tanks, and not so newbye ones.
1- Not having updated gear.
Make sure you at least check for cheap gear on market or even npc.
2- Failing Flash/Overpower for control waves of enemies.
You need to learn the Flash range (its not hard), and to position yourself for overpower if you are war.
3- Delivering hate only on the first/focus target.
You should switch targets and split your enmity combos between, making sure the focused target has enough enmity (depends really on how hard your dps strike), or abusing aoe enmity generation (limited to MP/TP).
4- Not caring about positioning the mobs.
Sometimes your dps mates need to side attack or "backstab" the target, make sure they can do it, and block/parry will only work when you face the targets.
5- Defensive cooldown control.
Make sure you use your skills... but don't do overkill like using them all at once. -
01-13-2016, 08:53 AMKosmos992kAll good advice. Here are a few more tidbits.Quote:
Originally Posted by HiromiVenia
If a target is known to have attacks with a knockback effect, put a wall behind you to mitigate the knockback.
When performing a pull, run through the enemies and take position with the enemy between the rest of the party and yourself. That way;- all melee dps get to attack the back or flank of targets,
- all attacks from the party are back attacks and cannot be parried or blocked,
- any AoE the enemy uses will be targeted away from the party,
- and finally you have good visibility on the group, so if a Mob breaks of to attack a healer, you are well placed to see it and provoke it back onto you.
- Any omni-directional AoE will not hit the ranged attackers and casters because you are keeping the enemy with you.
Oh, one more thing. Positioning trash packs (groups of monsters) and Bosses becomes increasingly important as you grow in level, jobs such as Monk, Dragoon and Ninja have specific positional requirements for some of their more potent attack combinations. You are helping the party DPS greatly if you position the pack/bos correctly and do not move or spin them around. So, trust your healer to keep you up, use your cool downs, dodge the stuff you can safely dodge (but return to your original spot ASAP) and pump out the aggro.