Do they take us for granted?

I really enjoy this game on the whole, and I'm convinced that the devs love working on it.

What I'm not so sure about, however, is whether or not their bosses realize the value of this game to the company. I don't have any hard evidence, but it always seems like Yoshi P and his team are constantly working with way less than they should be, while other projects SE has get a glut of work put in for products that are far less likely to get a good, much less steady return.

Is XIV just a money machine that isn't getting invested back into considering the success it's had? I can't say for sure. But it's hard to allay suspicions when the team is so enthusiastic, but mysteriously can't seem to get ahead no matter how hard they try. What do you all think?

Well rumor (and it's only a rumor!) has it that Yoshi-P kind of is at odds with SE's president about funding. Especially funding for servers and the like.

I have the same feelings as the OP. Yoshida has always made it known that alot of features that they want to add is blocked by the lack of developers and server memory thingy.:mad:

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

I know this isn't exactly the place to say it but,

If it is going to take 5+ years to make the FF7 remaster, then try finishing FF15 and KH3 before stretching man power even thinner. If corpret did that then maybe FF14 could get the funding and man power it desperately needs and they could actually make the FF7 Remake into a single game instead of a multi episode farce. The only way I'd support that is if Before Crisis, Crisis Core, OG FF7, and Dirge of Cerberous were the "Episode" and all 4 were getting remastered.

Otherwise That'd be like the 3.1 update, and 3.15 update, and 3.2 update all costing 5-10 USD apiece to install.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaiser-Ace

I know this isn't exactly the place to say it but,

If it is going to take 5+ years to make the FF7 remaster, then try finishing FF15 and KH3 before stretching man power even thinner. If corpret did that then maybe FF14 could get the funding and man power it desperately needs and they could actually make the FF7 Remake into a single game instead of a multi episode farce. The only way I'd support that is if Before Crisis, Crisis Core, OG FF7, and Dirge of Cerberous were the "Episode" and all 4 were getting remastered.

Otherwise That'd be like the 3.1 update, and 3.15 update, and 3.2 update all costing 5-10 USD apiece to install.

---

Pretty sure FF7 remake is being made with the help of CyberConnect 2 and is using Unreal Engine 4 instead of an in-house engine. So it should be a much easier project for Skweenicks to handle.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Pretty sure FF7 remake is being made with the help of CyberConnect 2 and is using Unreal Engine 4 instead of an in-house engine. So it should be a much easier project for Skweenicks to handle.

---

Easter to develop doesn't mean they won't spend money and man power FF14, FF15, and KH3 needs for their projectss inorder to develop it slightly faster. If they aren't careful it'll repeat the lightning trilogy incedent again and set all their projects back another 10 years.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

Well rumor (and it's only a rumor!) has it that Yoshi-P kind of is at odds with SE's president about funding. Especially funding for servers and the like.

---

Yeah, it's... I feel like either they need to have more servers that are closer (and hopefully better), or they need to rewrite the netcode to be way more efficient. I understand why they needed to use the old stuff as a backing board, but it doesn't make sense now. Surely the probationary period of the game to get its money back has passed since the launch of the very successful expansion?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

---

Sure, that's the answer. Let's find a scapegoat and not look at the bigger picture here.

I'm not on PS3, but here's a thought: Substitute your platform of choice where you put PS3 (yes, even if on PC), then tell me if that still sounds perfectly okay.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

---

You're still referring to PS3, right? Because a LOT of players are on PS4 as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Laerune

I have the same feelings as the OP. Yoshida has always made it known that alot of features that they want to add is blocked by the lack of developers and server memory thingy.:mad:

---

PS3 memory. It's easy to add gobs of RAM to a server, and it's cheap too.

But, for example, you know how we did without TP bars for so long, and even when it was added they had to eliminate the stat bonus display from the party frame?

Stuff like that is a part of it. Can't just stick more RAM in a PS3.

Considering that FFXIV was in development for the better part of a decade and the disaster that was 1.0 they probably have a huge amount of development costs to pay back.

This all just comes back to the relationship between developers and publishers. From a publishers point of view, the developers are solely responsible for caring for their product. A publishers whole concern is the bottom dollar of EVERYTHING they publish. FFXIV is a tiny blip on SE's radar. Their focus is on how many pieces they can get away with splitting FFVII into and still charge full price or how badly will delaying FFXV hurt Q4 profits for 2016. Publishers don't care about the products themselves or the consumers. Its all about numbers.

Don't ever expect a PUBLISHER to give a damn beyond balancing their books.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

---

While ps3 may hold us back some, ps4 has no issues running the game or any other future content for that matter, pc and ps4 both have their pros and cons. Targeting consoles to be the problem really doesn't solve the actual issue. Besides if they dropped consoles altogether from the game probably about 40% of the games population would disappear, and se would never want that, and nor would that percentage of ps4 players. The world of final fantasy started on consoles and to disregaurd them from any final fantasy would be a great disrespect to any dedicated console gamer. The great thing about being able to play this game on ps4 is that people who are so used to consoles or people who do not have that great of a pc or money to spend on one have another option to still play ff14 with. So i feel that attacking consoles is both somewhat ignorant and not backed up by any actual proof that ps4 holds the game back in any way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

---

Show me proof that PlayStation (either 3 or 4) holds back FFXIV in any way and I will start playing on a PC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naria

Considering that FFXIV was in development for the better part of a decade and the disaster that was 1.0 they probably have a huge amount of development costs to pay back.

---

I've been doing some very rough math about that. If the initial development of 1.0 was 450m, and they've brought in, at my figures, probably around 500m in just subscription fees alone without anything else factored in, I would think they've got to have at least gotten close by now? Costs are costs, sure, but there's got to be at least a pretty positive forecast with what they're bringing in here? It doesn't line up. But if someone has more concrete figures, I welcome them to correct me- it's really hard to know, what with a lot of things being unreported or opaque in general.

SE knows , Final Fantasy XI is the most profitable in the franchise....why? 10 years , subs , expansions and what not....

the point is that how many u can save and still keep getting ppl to pay (as examples? look at wow , WoD has been void of content since release outside Raids and the new island ) is no wonder they lost 5M~ of players in that time....now the question is if putting all this devs to work and create content is more profitable than doing nothing and still keep the others 5M of players...

Is a risk , use resources in creating content and keep the actual playerbase and maybe gain more? or do the min and try your luck....half the playerbase gone? oh...we still have 5M of players paying while the cost is at min (servers maint)

The main issue with mmorpgs is that losing a player is that u probably lose it forever....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ThirdChild_ZKI

Sure, that's the answer. Let's find a scapegoat and not look at the bigger picture here.

I'm not on PS3, but here's a thought: Substitute your platform of choice where you put PS3 (yes, even if on PC), then tell me if that still sounds perfectly okay.

---

Except PS3 was released in late 2006, and consoles typically use parts that are a few years old, so we're looking at over a decade old hardware. So yes, PS3 holds back the game because they have to manage the game so it still runs on a PS3.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BARDS_ARROW

Show me proof that PlayStation (either 3 or 4) holds back FFXIV in any way and I will start playing on a PC.

---

Easy.
PS3 memmory is too low, 256MB, and since we play on the same servers and stuff, game has to be the same on every other platform.

With that tiny memmory they can't add new content such as a parser, add-ons, and in-game stuff like wider maps with more stuff on them, storage problems (armoury and normal storage, since it has to be pre-loaded already. Retainers doesn't count since is not storage on-the-go and it loads only when you request it).

And the overall mapping, jobs, effects etc has to be nerfed and limited in order to make it happen on PS3.

PS4 is ok since it has enough memmory and resources to do it, but PS3 is draging it down. I'm glad they'll forget about it in 4.0, hopefully.

I have been wondering about this too. I don't know, and I guess we shall never know, if it is a case of "taking us for granted", or rather a "no actual grasp of the situation", as far as the suits up top are concerned. But they sure as hell keep milking us for more and more money, in worse and worse ways as time goes by - money that the project known as FFXIV apparently needs, money that it apparently doesn't seem to get. I mean ok, I understand, 1.0 was a disaster - but it's been more than two years since the launch of 2.0, and despite that we keep hearing the same excuses of why things can't be done, all of which ultimately boil down to money.

I don't know the situation when it comes to the Japanese servers. But quite frankly, I don't even care: "it's home" should not be an accepted reason for anything at this point. Not when the game is as international as it is, translated localised to multiple languages, available all over the world (even in some more special countries), enjoying success all over the world, having a completely global and international playerbase - no, at this point, "it's home" should not even be a bad excuse, much less an accepted reason. What I do know, one thing that I do know and can say: take a look at how we, on non-JP servers, have been suffering from quite consistently excessive RMT activity basically since the launch, RMT actitivity we all know can't be wiped altogether, but RMT activity we know could be made bearable. Take a look at how we have made dozens of threads with hundreds (if not thousands) of posts in those, giving all the suggestions we could think of (I'm willing to bet we completely depleted the pool of "potential anti-RMT tools"), time and time again. And here we are, more than two years later, and still none of it is implemented. From what we hear, there is no RMT issue on Japanese servers. You do the math - even without a penchant for conspiracy theories, the dots here are all too easy to connect, imo. This is definitely one of several things that makes me feel like we're taken for granted.
Another thing is: take a look at all the recycled/rehashed content. They started doing it like half a year after launch - from what I hear, WoW didn't do that for 7 years? But never even mind that. Just take the most recent example, this absurd and nonsensical monstrosity that is called Anima Weapon. Practically "zero-effort" content, and even this was how many months late?? It's outrageous. And this isn't even the only example for "zero-effort" or very late or "much too little much too late" content. They keep repeating.

But you know, at the same time, I can't even really blame them. I can't blame them when we keep eating everything they shove in our faces. Think of what I just described above, and think of all else I'm sure you can think of that just went in the "this stinks" drawer. There is more than enough to fill it, I'm sure; personally, my biggest file in there is titled "housing".
Considered all the gripes? Good. Now take a look at the forums (based on English, that's what I understand personally).
Here we are, most every thread at one point or another, usually more, getting hijacked and derailed into petty squabbles, personal disputes, things that really don't have anything to do with the game itself.
Here we are, with the "it's all optional" attitude, with the "if you don't like it, don't do it" attitude, with the "i'm enjoying it / i got lucky with it, so i don't care" attitude, letting important core issues, main points get lost in all this.
Here we are coming up with excuses like "did you see how tired he was?" for them; concerning ourselves over their wellbeing - I don't mean to sound rude, but what the hell? Are we all like a giant big family, because last time I checked, most of us here are complete strangers to each other?? Or do you concern yourself over a random stranger that falls asleep on a train late in the evening on the way home because they're so tired, do you suggest them to take a break and go on a vacation??? Yeah, I didn't think so. Yet for some reason it seems to be a "thing" around here. I'm sorry, but none of this is any of our business. It was a bad thing for them to mention whichever exact bit of this they mentioned the first time even as a joke, to begin with. We're customers, we are paying for a product/service - it's their job to deliver that, it's their job to figure out how to deliver it in an acceptable way. I get that most of us are (still?) passionate about this game and want it to do well and want the devs get the recognition and rewards of a good job, but come on. Some people have gone way overboard with that.
Here we are being so extremely apologetic for them, towards them, as if we're in the wrong, accepting every excuse, every reasoning, no matter how nonsensical it is. Because instead of that, we get caught up in the idiocies mentioned above.

Yeah, I can't blame them for taking us for granted. We keep throwing our money at them, despite getting so many very basic things that are just not good in one way or another; despite ridiculous excuses; despite completely absurd concepts - despite everything. Some of the stuff by now, I'm sad to say, is just outright disrespectful towards us - as players, as paying customers, as a community they claim to consider oh-so-important. At the same time though, on a certain level, I do feel bad for Yoshi&co, from everything they do, the interviews, the events, the livestreams, it's very clear that they are involved and they are passionate and they do live and breathe the game... But yeah, those above? I'm just not sure what to think of them.
And on a sidenote, I do blame media outlets as well. You know, big sites (smaller ones too, dw), for example IGN, when they report things like yet another oh-such-success for SE and yet more profit for them, or things like GASP Destiny servers going down for maintenance - and never anything about any of the issues, some of which are indeed big and glaring, that we do get more than disgruntled and pissed off about (have been for months and longer). But I guess we only have ourselves to blame for that too, considering we really can't unite against anything (see above). Even though I'm sure everyone's aware what kind of miracles a little negative media feedback can achieve.

It might just be that we're outright taken for granted. But if so, the blame is not with them - or at the very least, definitely not entirely with them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BreathlessTao

snip

---

Yeah. I mean, I wouldn't put it quite the same way, but essentially I agree. I think the suits up top are squandering the good will that Yoshi P and company are working so hard to gain. Nothing else makes sense at this point- unless the devs got some kind of amnesia, a lot of their decisions have got to boil down to "we just didn't have enough time/money/people." Why else would they repeat a relic step that had such bad optics? Why else would so much of the content come off as disjointed and unequal in reward versus effort? It's not even that it's necessarily the worst ever, just that... it was acknowledged, so it really narrows the reasoning.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ksuisa

Just blame ps3 and how they still have to support it until 4.0
no doubt they could toss some cool stuff out there if they dropped console support altogether and got rid of that restraint

---

Ok I can see PS3 being taken away but there also PS4, so you be kind of hurting yourself as a player. Cause that taking money away from SE from what sounds like in earlier post already the dev team already short on funding. Content not going to improve with less money coming in.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Warlyx

The main issue with mmorpgs is that losing a player is that u probably lose it forever....

---

From personal experience I don't believe that is true. WoW lost my current subscription, but will get it back once the next expansion comes out. SWTOR lost my subscription after six months (2012), but I've started it back up recently, even though it is F2P. WildStar lost my subscription because of 'lack of story'. When it went F2P I started up again, did not subscribe. Rinse. Lather. Repeat.

The thing is, people get bored of doing the same thing. An MMORPG is really only the same thing -- it's the nature of the game genre. Once story time is over, grind time begins. Can't do much to change that ... although another poster on the forums did give me an intriguing idea about a story-driven MOBA ...