Optimal melds for main hand, body, offhand

We have the choice to prioritize craftsmanship or control for those 3 items. CP being easily capped (pre-capped on the body even).

Which to prioritize and why? And is it worth to wait for better availability of tier V craftsmanship to meld earrings, bracelet and necklace (who lack 3 craftsmanship from max each, if you don't care)? V tier could also be used for the guaranteed slot on main hand, offhand and both slots of body.

I only did the rings so far, and that sure dug a hole in my finances by itself. Even if the ring crafting was relatively cheaper than before (only about 800k cost if getting a seaborne HQ).

I'd personally recommend waiting until the requirements for 3* items are released before doing any serious melding. That way you'd be able to determine the most cost effective method of meeting the requirements. All I've done is put on some temporary cheap CP melds on my main hand and offhand, and my chest pieces (plus all other pieces of equipment other than accessories) are generally still in storage for future use.

I doubt grade v melding will be common or cost effective for this current generation of gear since grade ivs already provide significant stat increases over the i180 counterparts. The primary source of grade vs in the future will probably be i170 conversions, so it'll be strange to convert them just so that you can meld a grade v onto a new replacement piece of i170 gear.

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The primary source of grade vs in the future will probably be i170 conversions

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I seriously doubt that stuff costing at *mininum* 600k for NQ is gonna be the primary source for grade V. Unless they're supposed to be 10 million a piece. I was kinda expecting steel spoils or brass spoils (or anything!!) to become V tier.

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since grade ivs already provide significant stat increases over the i180 counterparts

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If you only-IV meld your main hand, I'd rather buy the i180. I might miss out on 4 CP, but the rest isn't so bad (if there is a difference its positively tiny), for saving 4 million gil in melds. For example: Craft IV x2, Control IV x2, CP IV x1 = +4 CP, -3 craftmanship, same control. And 4 million poorer. Not counting the mats from crafting it. I guess that's 2.5 million more.

Body is 237/82/4 or 243/78/4
Vs 239/75/4
Big difference is one can be dyed. But if you're not keen on having to wait months to meld, or spend 4 million in temp melds, or have inferior stats to the i180 body in the mean time... I guess unmelded is still superior stats to the i150 temp-melded, just like offhand.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

If you only-IV meld your main hand, I'd rather buy the i180. I might miss out on 4 CP, but the rest isn't so bad (if there is a difference its positively tiny), for saving 4 million gil in melds. For example: Craft IV x2, Control IV x2, CP IV x1 = +4 CP, -3 craftmanship, same control. And 4 million poorer. Not counting the mats from crafting it. I guess that's 2.5 million more.

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The only real practical advantage to an i170 main hand is the extra 4 CP plus avoiding the 26 token price tag of an i180 main hand (unless you load it with grade vs which might well turn out to be completely unnecessary for progression in the future). In the best case sceneario, we might not even have to penta-meld it with grade iv materia if the cumulative melds from our other pieces of gear can make up for a weaker i170 main hand relative to the i180. Everything hinges on the stat requirements for 3* items.

I don't think there's any reason to believe that we will definitely need grade v materia at all for this set of gear. If I remember from ARR, to meet the minimum 4* requirements using AF gear, I only needed a single guaranteed grade iv craftsmanship meld on my artisan's offhand (2.4), which was long after grade ivs were introduced. I didn't even use a single piece of grade iv materia on my DoL gear.

Well, if affordable enough grade V craftsmanship existed, I'd meld them in the first slot of belt, earrings, necklace, bracelet, and thus be 100% sure its maxed forever and ever.

The difference between a fully melded HQ i170 and an i180 mainhand tool is actually 22 craft, 15 control and 4 CP. I dont think it qualifies as "tiny". It's actually huge.

However, i do agree with you that it's probably not practical to spend that much money on it. You see, I strongly believe that SE released those i180 for a reason. I don't think they would set 3 star requirement so high that we need melded HQ i170 to craft. So that extra stats from i170 is a bonus but wont be necessary. For me and others who are adventurous though, that bonus stats allow us to discover new methods of crafting. So as a pioneer, i would try to seek as much as i can within my budget.

26 Tokens for an i180 mainhand is A LOT though. It's 1300 red scrips, equal to ~3 weeks of work. If you intend to gear up 8 classes with these i180 mainhand, it'll take you 3x 8 weeks = 24 weeks = 6 months! So the crafted version does offer a much faster choice, since it only need less than 2 Tokens now since 3.1.

I've gotten the main hand i180 for CUL, CRP, LTW so far, and in a week and a half, BSM. 3 weeks after, WVR, and 3 weeks after again GSM. I'll have just ARM left to make after and it makes few pieces, including the CUL mainhand which I won't need. ALC isn't as important, I'll still eventually get it.

and for the i170 fully-melded, the difference is tiny if you go IV, and huge in gil if you go V (provided someone even sells them, which is just about never).

I don't think I'll even have the gil necessary to make the 8 sets before 3.2. Because I don't have a spare 200 million gil.

I'm surprised that you say the rings dug a hole in your finances being as you have all DoL jobs at 60 too.

I made all of the ride side acc + decent melds (not max melded naturally) and the belt and have the same amount of money when i started. Are you just buying all the favour mats off the MB?

It cost 6 million in melds (and for the rings, this is max-melded). Only about 1.5 million in mats. That's a hole considering it's just 2 pieces of gear out of 6 common and 56 unshared pieces (provided I would craft the main hand, otherwise 48).

And I bought the Dryad Saps yes (crafting both rings cost 90k per Dryad Sap x7, since I had 3, and 2x Seaborne Aethersand HQ at 330k each). I haven't finished gearing my gatherers, and I didn't spend tons of time in Diadem. I also bought the Astral Oils at 150k each HQ, just to not fail.

I have 56 million left. I'd need 3 million in melds per item x52 = way more than I have.

I'd have used my own mats, I just didn't have a stack of Astral Oils handy. I figured I can't craft lv 58 mats without using crafting food without having 412 CP. So I wanted to hit that threshold. I went from 396 to 402 CP. I could use Stone Soup to hit 412 now.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

It cost 6 million in melds (and for the rings, this is max-melded).

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The melds are:
Control +4
Control +4
CP +4
Crafts +5
Crafts +4

Let's assume Command IV are 300K a piece. Cunning IV are 200K a piece. Competence III are 20K a piece.
1st meld: 300K
2nd meld: 300K x 4 = 1.2 mil
3rd meld: 200K x 10 = 2 mil
4th meld: 20K x 20 = 400K
5th meld: 20K x 30 = 600K
Total = 4.2 million

Ok, maybe not 6 mil, but you're on the right track...
Wow, I didn't even realized I spent that much! LOL!

I melded 2 rings, also I used Crafts +6 and Crafts +3. Competence IV was 40-50k, while Competence I was 10k. Command was 300k a piece, Cunning 100k.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

I melded 2 rings, also I used Crafts +6 and Crafts +3. Competence IV was 40-50k, while Competence I was 10k. Command was 300k a piece, Cunning 100k.

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Competence IV is a lot more expensive on my server... about 100K each. And Competence III is actually cheaper than II.
So for me, there was no reason to use Competence IV + Competence I.
It would have been wiser to go Competence III + III.

Far from it for me to tell anybody how to play FFXIV, i mean i have made plenty of decisions crafting wise that i'm sure some other people would be "WTF? O_o" but ...

Why not farm the Favor mats yourself? Also to be fair it seems materia on your server is twice the price or more than mine. Also do you need to max meld the rings? I went for IV Command, IV Cunning, III Command, III Competence and finish with a II/III Competence. That puts you what? 1 Control less than cap?

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Why not farm the Favor mats yourself?

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Still need Miner hands, Botanist head, Botanist body, Botanist hands, Botanist feet, Botanist legs, Fisher head, Fisher body, Fisher hands, Fisher feet, Fisher legs.

When I've done all that I'll think about wasting my useless red scrips on something that isn't necessary like gear.

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Also do you need to max meld the rings?

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In the first post I'm asking about what to do with offhand, main hand and body - due to materia V not being really available yet. But also belt, earrings, necklace and bracelet are only maxed IF they get that Craftmanship +9 from a V tier (or they'll either be short 4 control or 3 craftsmanship - while still getting pentamelded with tier IV). And I'm not sure what to do because I'm perfectionist and a bit obsessed about doing the max on things.

I guess it's probably not 'needed', and that my getting the i180 main hand is going to advantage me a bit over people who get the i170 one, but don't meld it cause they're waiting on V tier materia, or 3 star stats to know what to meld.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

Still need Miner hands, Botanist head, Botanist body, Botanist hands, Botanist feet, Botanist legs, Fisher head, Fisher body, Fisher hands, Fisher feet, Fisher legs.

When I've done all that I'll think about wasting my useless red scrips on something that isn't necessary like gear.

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I'm assuming you mean that you would rather get those things first than do favors, i'm assuming somebody like yourself know you don't need any of those thing FOR favor farming.

I mean not to argue for the sake of arguing, but if you DID do the favors yourself you could EASILY afford the melds too because the market on Favor turn ins / mats is isnane, rather than spending your gathering Scripts on gear that lets face it, is totally unneeded at present.

That all being said i TOTALLY respect why you want to get all that gear first with your scripts rather than farm the mats yourself.

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And I'm not sure what to do because I'm perfectionist and a bit obsessed about doing the max on things.

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Totally understandable there, once you start you can't stop.

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Originally Posted by Caimie_Tsukino

Let's assume Command IV are 300K a piece. Cunning IV are 200K a piece. Competence III are 20K a piece.

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This right here is one of the main reasons I rushed Crafting Endgame first. Crafting materia was insanely low prior to Heavensward and up until about 2 months into it. To be fair though, the current materia prices on my server are 1/3rd this price even after the recent increase in general Crafting interest.

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Originally Posted by SchalaZeal

Still need Miner hands, Botanist head, Botanist body, Botanist hands, Botanist feet, Botanist legs, Fisher head, Fisher body, Fisher hands, Fisher feet, Fisher legs.

When I've done all that I'll think about wasting my useless red scrips on something that isn't necessary like gear.

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Using your Red Scrips for Favors is FAR from useless, especially if you're having gil and/or Crafting issues. With the current turn-in items being tripled Favor items are not only in high demand but extremely valuable for a Crafter. For me, it helps looking at it from a cost perspective:

1 Token gives 5 Favors. With a low average of 3 items per Favor (Personal average is 4+) 1 Token is equal to 15 Favor items. If you spent 2 Tokens on Favors you would end up with 30 Favor items, 20 of which you could have used for both of your rings + 1 leftover lumber, and the remaining 10 could be sold to pay for the HQ sand. This would have cut at least 1.2m off of your Craft and given you a leftover lumber for your wrist/neck/to be sold.

If you prefer Gathering over Crafting though I can understand prioritizing the i180 Gathering gear, especially since there isn't a Crafted equivalent yet, though I don't think it's really necessary for any of the current content.

As for your ORIGINAL question on melds for the chest/MH/OH, it really depends on what your rotation is. I personally did 3 Command IV 2 Competence IV for the body and 1 Cunning IV 1 Command IV and 1 Competence IV for the MH/OHs. I left room for 2 melds on the MHs/OHs in case I needed a little more of something for the 3.1 Crafts but I ended up not needing anything more than what I already have.

The majority of the time if I'm melding something I'm going to go all the way or not at all, but I went ahead and overmelded with Tier IVs for a number of reasons:

1. Tier V Crafting materia is currently unavailable outside of Mutamix RNG.

2. We have NO idea when it will be available. Many people (Including myself) assumed it would be available in 3.1, but this was not the case.

3. When it finally DOES become available it will be a very VERY VERY long time before it's at a cost that is reasonable for overmelds outside of vastly wealthy Crafters.

4. I HIGHLY doubt SE would require gear with Tier V melds to Craft any recipes in the near or distant future. As Caimie said, it's mostly just a bonus for those who can afford it, and while I understand being a perfectionist there is also the reality that even with Tier V melds you cannot cap the chest/MH/OHs

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Originally Posted by Caimie_Tsukino

The difference between a fully melded HQ i170 and an i180 mainhand tool is actually 22 craft, 15 control and 4 CP. I dont think it qualifies as "tiny". It's actually huge.

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Hi Caimie,

Actually it's less than that, no?

i180 Main Hand:
* Craftsmanship: 278
* Control: 149
* CP: 0

i170 Main Hand: (Base Stats, No Materia Yet)
* Craftsmanship: 263
* Control: 141

So the i180 is initially ahead of the Crafted i170 by: +15 Craftsmanship, +8 Control.

To make up for that difference you HAVE blow 4 Slots (out of 5) on the i170 just to catch up and exceed that, with the 5th Slot being CP. So:

* Craftsmanship Tier V: +11
* Craftsmanship Tier V: +11
* Control Tier V: +7
* Control Tier V: +7
* CP Tier IV: +4 CP

That brings you up to: Craftsmanship 285, Control 155, CP 4.

So you only *gain* +7 Craftsmanship, +6 Control, and +4 CP compared to the i180.

That's paltry for blowing Millions and Millions on Tier V Forbidden Melding IMHO. :(

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If you prefer Gathering over Crafting though I can understand prioritizing the i180 Gathering gear, especially since there isn't a Crafted equivalent yet, though I don't think it's really necessary for any of the current content.

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I guess I'm kinda expecting 60 2 star gathering mats possibly gated behind new folklore books, or from the same folklore books (but instead of giving info on 2 nodes per region, it might be 4). Which I unlocked all right now. I'll also have to work on the miner and botanist offhand and the craftable accessories+belt.

Also i think I'll need the red scrip gathering gear to have max HQ on legendary nodes. I think I got 7% on them now.

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Using your Red Scrips for Favors is FAR from useless

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I mean my scrips will be useless once I finish getting the gear.

I calculated that someone only doing decent melds on accessories and offhand, while getting the tier below i170 on belt + accessories, and getting all red scrip otherwise, would probably only need about 10 million gil. To the 250 million gil I'm probably going to need. And we'd likely be both able to craft most things. The i180 guy would just take forever to gear 8 crafts...but SE is expecting that guy to have only 2-3 crafts at best (like my brother for example).

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Originally Posted by Kiara

So you only *gain* +7 Craftsmanship, +6 Control, and +4 CP compared to the i180.

That's paltry for blowing Millions and Millions on Tier V Forbidden Melding IMHO. :(

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I agree with Kiara, Tier V overmelds are not worth it, nor are they necessary.

Another thing to keep in mind when deciding i170 Crafted MH vs i180 turn-in MH is the i180 MH doesn't come with CP which is the absolute most important Crafting stat, well worth the reduced Craftsmanship/Control even if it's the only thing melded into it. A strong rotation can more than make up for less-than-maxed Craftmanship/Control, and you can always just meld 2 Competence IV 2 Control IV 1 CP IV and only miss out on 3 Craftsmanship.

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and you can always just meld 2 Competence IV 2 Control IV 1 CP IV and only miss out on 3 Craftsmanship.

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JUST for that and crafting the item, I calculated I'm saving 45 million by going the i180 way for the 8 ones.

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Originally Posted by Kiara

Hi Caimie,

Actually it's less than that, no?

i180 Main Hand:
* Craftsmanship: 278
* Control: 149
* CP: 0

i170 Main Hand: (Base Stats, No Materia Yet)
* Craftsmanship: 263
* Control: 141

So the i180 is initially ahead of the Crafted i170 by: +15 Craftsmanship, +8 Control.

To make up for that difference you HAVE blow 4 Slots (out of 5) on the i170 just to catch up and exceed that, with the 5th Slot being CP. So:

* Craftsmanship Tier V: +11
* Craftsmanship Tier V: +11
* Control Tier V: +7
* Control Tier V: +7
* CP Tier IV: +4 CP

That brings you up to: Craftsmanship 285, Control 155, CP 4.

So you only *gain* +7 Craftsmanship, +6 Control, and +4 CP compared to the i180.

That's paltry for blowing Millions and Millions on Tier V Forbidden Melding IMHO. :(

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*LIKE*
You're absolutely right! Even though the cap is high, I forgot even with Tier V, one can't max all them stats! It's totally NOT worth it! I do value that 4 CP a lot from the crafted mainhand though, just because I actually find good use of it a lot of times.

From my experience in manual crafting, 478 CP is 1 CP short for me in a lot of situations. In macro crafting, I also have a number of rotations that utilizes 469 CP, and one rotation that uses 472 CP. I'm just too much of a CP fan, LOL!

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Originally Posted by Sollux

This right here is one of the main reasons I rushed Crafting Endgame first. Crafting materia was insanely low prior to Heavensward and up until about 2 months into it. To be fair though, the current materia prices on my server are 1/3rd this price even after the recent increase in general Crafting interest.

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Meh, I totally missed the cheap materia window! LOL! It's ok. What's done is done! XD

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Originally Posted by Katchoo

Also do you need to max meld the rings? I went for IV Command, IV Cunning, III Command, III Competence and finish with a II/III Competence. That puts you what? 1 Control less than cap?

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Right, there's no need to max that 1 tad bit of control. I have forfeited 1 control for most of my i170 gear. I maxed my rings because those were my very first i170s, and at that time Command IV were only 100K each.

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Originally Posted by Caimie_Tsukino

Right, there's no need to max that 1 tad bit of control. I have forfeited 1 control for most of my i170 gear. I maxed my rings because those were my very first i170s, and at that time Command IV were only 100K each.

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Exactly. Thing is, losing out on one or two stats on bits of gear these days is way less of an issue than what it was because we have much more choice when it comes to food. We can now get more CP than Bouillabaisse gave us AND give ourselves a big boost in either Craftmanship (Baked Onion Soup) or Controll (seafood stew).

I spent nearly 6 million melding all accessories and belt altogether. Fully melded. I got all MH and OT but I'm not touching them until 3.2. I wanna see the next range of craftable items before I start melding