IDEA: Separate Gatherer and Battle Diadem groups

Everyone is wanting a fix but the only idea for the fix so far has been to stop gatherers from entering Diadem or to stop gatherers from getting loot.

My idea, I decided to make a new thread so it wouldn't get lost in a thread of a similar topic. Is to have a Gatherer Diadem queue and a Battle Diadem queue.

Maybe we will need to lock the type of Job once you are in the zone. If you use the battle queue you can switch to any job that is DoW or DoM. If you use the gatherer queue you can switch between any DoL job.

Will this be too hard to implement? I hope this idea could be useful for the Diadem fix.
If anyone has any ideas to make this idea for Diadem to be fixed then please go ahead and put your thoughts down ^^. Hopefully with the more ideas we have it will be easier for them to work out how to fix it.

Would need some more adjustments because DoL are pretty much helpless in combat and lack stealth, which is their main way of circumventing it.

But yeah...otherwise agree, segregation is the way to go for DF. Should be a non-issue in full premades, though, as everyone should be on the same page before you queue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zojha

Would need some more adjustments because DoL are pretty much helpless in combat and lack stealth, which is their main way of circumventing it.

But yeah...otherwise agree, segregation is the way to go for DF. Should be a non-issue in full premades, though, as everyone should be on the same page before you queue.

---

The mobs are a bit hard to solo thought aren't they? I know where the botany nodes are there are a lot of 3 rank and 2 ranks around, I don't think I would be able to take those down myself XD. Since Stealth is useless and monsters are hard in there the lack of being a DoW/DoM shouldn't be too bad right?

I think maybe this could be DF only queue?

Another idea, add 1 or 2 gatherer role slots to Diadem DF queue and make it that you can only switch to a class/job of the same disciple. 8 DoM/DoW classes and 1 or 2 DoL classes.

This thread... again. With a similar, older, thread on the same page no less. How about this... seeing as we can't have nice things how about we just lock Diadem to people in free companies. That's who the content was designed for, only makes sense to keep it to them. Not in a free company? Well what are you waiting for?!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

This thread... again. With a similar, older, thread on the same page no less. How about this... seeing as we can't have nice things how about we just lock Diadem to people in free companies. That's who the content was designed for, only makes sense to keep it to them. Not in a free company? Well what are you waiting for?!

---

This is a brainstorming thread not a whining thread... If you are whining please do it in the Diadem whining threads scattered throughout the forums :p.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

This thread... again. With a similar, older, thread on the same page no less. How about this... seeing as we can't have nice things how about we just lock Diadem to people in free companies. That's who the content was designed for, only makes sense to keep it to them. Not in a free company? Well what are you waiting for?!

---

I'm in a FC, but as it's not huge it can hard to get 8 people together and for all of them to have 90+ minutes to spare. I'd personally hate it if they did that, it's a nice experience (well, nice for what the content is) using the Party Finder. Now, why they thought of it allowing it with Duty Finder is beyond me. Maybe it helps people on smaller servers, if that's the case then I do like OP's suggestion.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chiramu

This is a brainstorming thread not a whining thread... If you are whining please do it in the Diadem whining threads scattered throughout the forums :p.

---

That was my idea. The point of Exploration was to give companies with gatherers something to do together. Breaking them off into their own instances defeats the purpose of Exploration and further punishes those who do just want to gather (Stealth doesn't work in Diadem). It was made for companies so lets keep it to companies. Leave the NPCs there in Ishgard but remove it from Duty. Have it work just like Coil used to in that you have to form a party and talk to an NPC to gain entry, or use the workshop console if you have a house with that. And of course the NPC only allows those in a company to enter. Problems solved and noone had to be punished for 'ruining your precious content'.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

snip

---

Then make it so preformed parties have the ability to go in with whatever composition they desire without restrictions. To add onto OP's suggestion, I think the Easy mode of the Diadem should truly be "easy". Allow players to go in solo with a gatherer class (with the ability to switch to DoW/DoM of course), make the mobs soloable or allow stealth to work. I see no reason for easy mode's existence at the moment, no one does it from what I can tell and I check the Party Finder often enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

That was my idea. The point of Exploration was to give companies with gatherers something to do together. Breaking them off into their own instances defeats the purpose of Exploration and further punishes those who do just want to gather (Stealth doesn't work in Diadem). It was made for companies so lets keep it to companies. Leave the NPCs there in Ishgard but remove it from Duty. Have it work just like Coil used to in that you have to form a party and talk to an NPC to gain entry, or use the workshop console if you have a house with that. And of course the NPC only allows those in a company to enter. Problems solved and noone had to be punished for 'ruining your precious content'.

---

You started your "idea" with a very rude beginning that showed you did not read my OP very well... I stated quite clearly why I started a new thread and you thought you were being smart by making that irritating remark of yours...

I'm actually rather tired of people making scapegoats of gatherers in content that was expressly promoted as being inclusive of them. All because some people just want to use Diadem to gear up quickly. So my idea is to give the content back to the players it was meant for. Were my comments smart? Hardly, they were the product of being annoyed at the gatherer witch hunts that's going on now regarding Exploration.

Here's a better idea... Why not make this content open world. You go in as you please, stay as long as you please, there's no stinky instance timer/lockout, and do whatever you want as you please. If you need a party to take out NM, well that's part of the game. The gathers get to do their thing, if they have to avoid detection from the high level monsters near the nodes, that's part of the deal. There, all the problems solved.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

I'm actually rather tired of people making scapegoats of gatherers in content that was expressly promoted as being inclusive of them. All because some people just want to use Diadem to gear up quickly. So my idea is to give the content back to the players it was meant for. Were my comments smart? Hardly, they were the product of being annoyed at the gatherer witch hunts that's going on now regarding Exploration.

---

I totally agree. It's rather rude and irritating instead to have the gear crowd continually try and adjust the duty to suit their narrow focused interests and to create thread after thread trying to exclude gatherers from the duties. What needs to be fixed is to have a lockout on the amount of gear that can be obtained from Diadem and prevent this mindless zerging of mobs for 90 minutes. This isn't what the duty should be about.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gilraen

I'm actually rather tired of people making scapegoats of gatherers in content that was expressly promoted as being inclusive of them. All because some people just want to use Diadem to gear up quickly. So my idea is to give the content back to the players it was meant for. Were my comments smart? Hardly, they were the product of being annoyed at the gatherer witch hunts that's going on now regarding Exploration.

---

Again you failed to read clearly.

I think I read it fairly accurately. Your idea is this; queue as a combat class/Extra Job you're locked out of gathering classes, queue as gathering you're locked out of combat classes/Extra Jobs. While this might make the zerg crowd happy it would be incredibly inconvenient for companies, they'd have people locked to their roles defeating the purpose of Exploration altogether. There's slightly better ideas to the 'problem' in the other threads.

I like the idea of adding two gathering slots to the Que and allowing them to switch between what they signed in as. That should apply to both groups. I think the should give stealth back to the DoL so they can go on their own. This way the people who want to fight won't get penalized for not having enough dps. I think brainstorming threads are a good idea to help figure out a peaceful solution for everyone.

Or you could just communicate with people! I don't know what it's like on other servers, but I see people here putting up PFs clearly stating whether they're going for gear or for gathering. It's really not that difficult.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kabzy

Or you could just communicate with people! I don't know what it's like on other servers, but I see people here putting up PFs clearly stating whether they're going for gear or for gathering. It's really not that difficult.

---

Yes it because people still join and after they are in they ignore the rules. You can't do anything about it until you leave. Why are people so reluctant against changes? Obviously there are issues that need to be fixed as with any new content. Some people are just offering peaceful suggestions, while other are a bit snarky about it. Like you said just communicate with people. That's what some of us are doing. Communicating what we have experienced and the need for some changes.

Shouldn't the goal be to make DoL more useful in Diadem? I'll be honest, I haven't played it yet so not sure of the specific but it seems to me they should be digging up hidden coffer and setting off traps to help with combat. Maybe even removing barriers.

Would be nice if it could sort of be an abyssea sort of thing. A special item that allows access for a more limited time frame. Would need restrictions though to keep it balanced.

Could extend out to single party, maybe jobs are locked--or at least locked between discipline. Chests could be gated behind an objective of sorts. Maybe not the lights system like with Abyssea, but it could be a kill count or something.

The goal of the party make-up wouldn't be too friendly towards farming chests, but it could allow a means to nab a few while in there. The focus would be geared more towards supporting the DoL's. So you could sort of have a mining/gathering expedition--a handful of gatherers/miners with a small contingent to handle their agroes.

Granted....people SHOULD be doing this on their own to some extent, but the system isn't really doing much to promote this angle. Perhaps some new implementation along this line might encourage such an approach.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dyvid

Snip

---

They can find hidden coffers but not as effective as killing mobs. You\\'re right. That\\'s a great idea. They need to make gathering more useful than they currently are the more people would want them there. The main hindrance is if you lose dps, tanks, and/or healers to gathering then you lose out on the amount of dps needed for your team to make an impact on certain kills thus losing out on getting a drop. Also people who are just gathering rolling on loot from fights when they are not helping. Imagine killing mobs and getting 5-10 chest in the time it takes one gatherer to obtain one chest. (Dont know the actual rate).The people killing are doing more work but the gathering can loot on all gear even though they are technically hindering the group because of the lost of dps. Really sucks when it comes to level 210 gear.The same thing applies to people who just afk the whole time. You are screwed because you can\\\\'t kick them and even if you could you can\\\\'t get more players to take their place so you can\\\\'t meet the dps check to make chests drop. This equals to wasted time due to being locked out from requeing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Chiramu

You started your "idea" with a very rude beginning that showed you did not read my OP very well... I stated quite clearly why I started a new thread and you thought you were being smart by making that irritating remark of yours...

---

To be fair, the number of threads about this is pretty irritating in and of itself, especially when most of them are just a rehash of old posts and don't introduce anything new. This one's tossing about one of the ideas that's been tossed about in several others.