Stop complaining and learn to play

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

Then please enlighten us with your rotation if you would be so kind.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

Enlighten us oh great one. Tell us where you succeeded where even experienced bards failed, what are you doing so different.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwAOHVBKTwg

Featuring Raptors as Bards who don't like their job being more difficult to play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

Please post a recording of your rotation and parse and enlighten us with you godlike DPS.

It's good... however it requires a lot of concentration. And I still agree on an overall damage buff.

But I think most of the complaining is now "I can't jump around and my easy DPS job is gone". Sigh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AskaRay

It's good... however it requires a lot of concentration. And I still agree on an overall damage buff.

But I think most of the complaining is now "I can't jump around and my easy DPS job is gone". Sigh.

---

The truth has been spoken.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

Your bard is only level 50. Trolls be trollin'!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raiker

Your bard is only level 50. Trolls be trollin'!

---

OP,
Obviously with the sheer amount of bards taking to the forums to discuss this in not just NA, but other regions as well, we have a valid complaint as Bards, and I think we deserve to be heard on the issue just like any other class that felt they deserved to have their concerns heard.
If you don't play bard then I implore you to disregard our griping but please let us be so we can get some acknowledgement from SE on the issue. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AskaRay

It's good... however it requires a lot of concentration. And I still agree on an overall damage buff.

But I think most of the complaining is now "I can't jump around and my easy DPS job is gone". Sigh.

---

Yes that is the Point! No more Faceroll about positions, no more Green Arrow or Legolas style, and more Hank the mofo Archer that stands around style!

Nothing wrong with wanting a easier class to play. All the new skills and bloat just made a lot of the class tedious. And this new skill changes the fun of what a bard was.

Tedious does not always means harder.

I'm not saying that the OP is just completely wrong. But I make the counter argument that many of us already DID know how to play. . . then this. It also goes deeper than that, honestly, and I wholeheartedly invite you to take a look here at some of the points made.

I make no demands for rotations or proof, and I agree some people really DO need to learn how to play their job better. But "learn to play" is simply too flat a statement to make.

TBH learn to play applies to those BRDs who see significant increase in their parses in actual battle when having WM perm on.

Because they fucked up their 2.0 bard so bad that WM became an improvement in battle.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raiker

Your bard is only level 50. Trolls be trollin'!

---

I'm pretty sure OP meant he played WITH a bard not AS.
Perhaps you should read carefully before hitting that T button.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Delroy7

Yes that is the Point! No more Faceroll about positions, no more Green Arrow or Legolas style, and more Hank the mofo Archer that stands around style!

---

No its not the point, while I liked my mobility, Im not hardpressed to go without it. However, It does concern me when my mobility is taken away in favor of boosting my dmg, but that dmg actually works out to be LESS than the dmg I could have had on vanilla bard REGARDLESS of movement. and THAT is the point of these bard or riot threads.

Op is an obvious troll but I'd agree with him on one point. Stop Complaining. There's tens of threads everywhere about about how Square destroyed bards, how Minuet is crap and all of that. And it's so hard to find serious theorycrafting threads about the current state of bards playstyle. Don't ask him to post his parse or rotation, post yours. That'd be more productive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bhuni

I'm pretty sure OP meant he played WITH a bard not AS.
Perhaps you should read carefully before hitting that T button.

---

Even more reason why OP shouldn't even be starting flamebait threads like this if he/she ain't main-ing or even playing a BRD.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vespar

OP,
Obviously with the sheer amount of bards taking to the forums to discuss this in not just NA, but other regions as well, we have a valid complaint as Bards, and I think we deserve to be heard on the issue just like any other class that felt they deserved to have their concerns heard.
If you don't play bard then I implore you to disregard our griping but please let us be so we can get some acknowledgement from SE on the issue. :)

---

Did you literally just say that your complaint is valid because a lot of people share it? Come on you can do better than that

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nekuxdesu

Did you literally just say that your complaint is valid because a lot of people share it? Come on you can do better than that

---

I have posted my VALID points in another thread and I care not to repeat myself. The fact that I echo the statements of other bards is relevant because it shows that not just one or two bards have an issue with WM, but the community of Bards as a collective and thereby it serves as merit to our concerns.

If you care to read the VALID points of myself and other bards you may find them in the "Buff Bards or Riot" thread.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nekuxdesu

Did you literally just say that your complaint is valid because a lot of people share it? Come on you can do better than that

---

We don't really have to do better? No one has a right to tell a person what is fun to them. If bards was doing amazing dps that groups would notice that is one thing, but if it takes some super expert player to get the most out of bard. That is bad game design in itself. If most players have to "l2p" a class and stay super focus just to try to come close to other dps. It is flawed design.

Truth is, the class lost a lot and gained very little.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FateAudax

Even more reason why OP shouldn't even be starting flamebait threads like this if he/she ain't main-ing or even playing a BRD.

---

Such terrible logic, as there's no such thing as parsers am I right?

stop complaining about people complaining and learn freedom of speech.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wavaryen

f it takes some super expert player to get the most out of bard. That is bad game design in itself. If most players have to "l2p" a class and stay super focus just to try to come close to other dps. It is flawed design.

---

Wait wait wait
Let me laugh


Okay I'm back
no wait give me another moment

So you're saying that if i play infinitely better than someone else, I shouldn't do more dps? Rewarding skill is now "flawed design"?
Are sports flawed because someone practices and is VASTLY better than someone new to them?
Is cooking flawed because someone who has been doing it for dozens of years is better at it than a baby?

Come on man, all of your brd babbies cant be this silly...right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nekuxdesu

Wait wait wait
Let me laugh


Okay I'm back
no wait give me another moment

So you're saying that if i play infinitely better than someone else, I shouldn't do more dps? Rewarding skill is now "flawed design"?
Are sports flawed because someone practices and is VASTLY better than someone new to them?
Is cooking flawed because someone who has been doing it for dozens of years is better at it than a baby?

Come on man, all of your brd babbies cant be this silly...right?

---

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qmgmNWoXbcA/hqdefault.jpg

That is clearly an headshot.

Actually its not. Your taking a very confrontational view towards what that person was trying to get across to you.
I will not try to sway your opinions one way or the other because no matter what we say, you will come back with yet another argument that has little to no bearing to the issue we are conveying to SE anyways.

This thread is a congregation of high and mighty players who is here to defend their throne from any chance of BRD/MCH buff.
Basically, it is filled with salty tears and if you listen carefully, you could hear moans of "My class is high and mighty because it's melee/caster/healer." while they gently stroke their e-peen.

Just look that those who are asking us to L2P, play a melee, WM is a buff, WM is fine, and etc. Their main class ain't even a BRD/MCH.
As for those BRD/MCH who says WM is a huge astronomical buff and it's a 100% welcomed change, you should be learning to play. This will be my last reply here. Don't get butthurt ya'll ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nekuxdesu

snip

---

Since it seems you have a hard time understanding how games should work. Let me help you out. I can't stand to see such warped and closed minded logic. Anyone who agrees with you also. I will teach you something.
All classes at its core should be easy to use but hard to master. A MMO takes all player types and all skill types. People who want to master a class and do better more power to them and IT SHOULD show if they do that.

However, that gap should not be so huge that other players feel that person is a waste of slot, or they get hate because they slow down dungeon runs due to class balance issues. If a class play style is fun, and not tedious with skill bloat. People would want to improve in a more natural way. Changing a class play style is one thing, but making it so "hard" that players have to focus and play super elite just to do acceptable dps is wrong from a game design point. So stop acting like you are some better player just because you don't agree. Calling people bad makes you look foolish.

Not all of us are complaining about WM because it changes our playstyle (though it is annoying) but because it gives us so little in return - and even less so when we're actually doing what we're built for - i.e singing to support our party members.

We're not asking to be top dps - we never where but we are asking for the ability to be an asset for the group instead of a bother that's taking up a 'space' for 'better' dps. And yes I am only lv55 but I've played bard a long time and spoken to many bards who have reached lv60 and now swapping to different classes because of this >.>

Ugh. Why is it so hard for people to get it?

First of all for some reason you all seem to think Bard was "easy" or something. Well why didn't you all play Bard then? /shrugs. I didn't pick Bard because of "easy" or because of damage, I played it because I liked how it worked.

Imagine this then:

Let's give Monk more damage, but instead of them making use their fists, let's make them a ranged job throwing energy punches only!
Let's give Ninja more damage, but make their weapons a great sword instead!
Let's improve White Mage healing, but instead of using white magic, they will now heal by throwing bandages at their party members!
Let's make Paladins better tanks, but instead of using shields, they will now guard themselves with a bar of soap!

There, I just made your jobs better on paper. It doesn't matter if I changed the original way it was played or general aesthetics, RIGHT?!

Well now that all the childish calling people bad, and hate talk has been defeated with logic. Time for me to take a long rest. Take care all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

I really wish that people that claims that Bard dps "are really high" and advising "learn to play" include actual numbers so people can see for themselves - is it really good or not.
I am not even asking about rotations, I just want to know what exactly people are talking about.

When you compare 800 dps bard with 300 dps df ninja it really is "really high dps". But when you compare the same bard with 1100-1200 dps nin/mnk/drg the flaw of the class became obvious.

Personally I've dropped Minuet for the most part and will simply continue to dps as I did before. Nothing gained really with this addition for me because I'm electing not to use the new skills. I'm not really liking the casting style much and I do that more than enough with my blm. I'm still having fun with my bard in spite of it (just hit 60 as a second class) but am certainly not pleased with what they've elected to do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

Imagine this then:

Let's give Monk more damage, but instead of them making use their fists, let's make them a ranged job throwing energy punches only!

---

This could help monks to keep their buff up.
But giving MNk their Chakram (a throw weapon for PGL/MNK during 1.0) back would be good enough

With a level 50 Bard and furthest raid progress being T5 the OP definitely has the credentials to advise on this subject...

Right.. b/c both the entire Japanese community that is in an uproar over this PLUS the Eng community are all wrong.

It's the same story for MCHs. Apparently there are a select few that have the keys to the class, but refuse to post evidence of it including rotations for us to test. Because... bad players?

If the OP is going take the stance that all of us bards complaining not just on these forums but the Japanese forums too are wrong then he better back up his post with evidence, parser proof and rotations given else he can go troll somewhere else.

Both bards and especially machinists need improving and fixing. In comparison to most other DPS classes and even tank and healers of equal gear ilevel are way out DPSing too often these classes, to such an extent bards and machinists are quite often excluded and kicked from groups just because of their class so there is a serious problem.

Many threads went into a lot of details about the problems, SE needs to look at those and keep reading them, taking on board what is being said and fix them. It's easy to say you grouped with an ilvl 170-180 bard while you are say ilvl 120-140 and see they might do more then you but in like for like ilvl against other classes, both bard and machinist DPS due to bad skill design and WD is a serious problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

While I dont think WM is nearly as bad as some make it out to be (its mostly just whining about having to cast now) it really doesnt seem to help. It needs work. Damage should go up, and we should be able to queue our shots. I dont care what the greedy casters say, its a PvE game, and in PvE, DPS should be comparable among all DPS classes while dealing damage.

As for your OP .... hmm, what do you think Tataru?

Quote:

---

http://i732.photobucket.com/albums/w...taru_troll.gif

---

... yeah my thoughts exactly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ooshima

TBH learn to play applies to those BRDs who see significant increase in their parses in actual battle when having WM perm on.

Because they fucked up their 2.0 bard so bad that WM became an improvement in battle.

---

so much THIS :D

Well looks like they are looking into brds and know about the issues with it. ^_^

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odioillatino

This is for all the people complaining about the BRD's Minuet. I have played with BRD using Minuet, and I can assure you that the DPS is really high. Maybe the people that is complaining should learn to play :)

---

Maybe the mobility that we enjoyed prior to HW is beyond your comprehension now that you have positionals as ninja perhaps you should learn how to replay your "main"? Those of us with an issue with Minuet have valid reasons primarily because we picked a job that had a playstyle that appealed to us for ranged dps.