Square Enix blew it for some of us, but I'm still here...

My friends and I are thoroughly disappointed with Heavensward. Three of them actually quit already, because that's how important first impressions are. We thought Heavensward was going to be another step into freedom and innovation. Instead, we get more of Square Enix's old ways dating all the way back to Final Fantasy 11, content gating.

1. In order to fly on mounts, you have to do main scenerio quests, a lot of side quests to get more "aethers" unlocked, then explore the entire map to discover "aethers". That defeats the whole purpose of being able to fly because once we're done with all the quests, there's no reason to fly on that map anymore.

2. Almost every single quests so far, after playing 10 hours of Heavensward, consists of getting quest from point A, go all the way to other side of map at Point B, then teleport back to point A. After that, run all the way back to other side of map at Point C, then teleport back to point A. Almost every quest feels meaningless and another one of Square Enix's ploy to extend the game without putting any real content in the game.

3. You left us off with quite an amazing story at the end of A Realm Reborn. I even watched the trailer for Heavensward because I was so excited for the new chapter. Imagine my disappointment when I find out that I have to run "errands" for my new host. Yes, it gets a lot better, but first impressions are the most important. Overall, it was a very poor "grand opening" for Heavensward.

4. Many people already have issues with having to do main scenerio quests to unlock content and progression. It wouldn't be an issue at all if the main scenerio didn't feel like fillers and running delivery errands between point a, b, or c.

5. What happened to what made the Final Fantasy franchise so great? Where is the "HOLY CRAP, THAT WAS EPIC!" part of the game? Final Fantasy 11 did a much better job with the main scenerio in that regards.

Even though I'm disappointed, I will stick it out because I am a fan and will always have faith in Square Enix to get it right. I'm sure many disagrees with me, but I really feel like the game is not as immersive as it should be. I don't feel like the world is a fantasy world I am part of because of the zones, the content gating, and the invisible walls.

This game has so much potential; I hope it's fully realized before it's too late.

I really disagree. I feel that while ARR had a lot of fetch quests and filler, HW has had very little. I've thoroughly been enjoying all the MSQ and always want to know what happens next. You should know by now that a lot of content is locked by MSQ, that's hardly a surprise.

Flying is more like a reward for exploring. If we could fly evewhere straight away, who would actually appreciate everything on the ground? The whole big journey would be pretty redundant if you could fly everywhere at top speed straight away.

Well, it's all opinions. But it really just sounds like you want things handed to you with no effort on your part...

I'm shocked that you didn't mentioned the love for "hide and seek" quest which SE have installed for us in Heavensward especially in Dravanian Forelands and Churning Mists.

Find the items which these moogles lost.
Find the moogles.
Find this and find that.

Apart from these hide and seek quests (which I have completed), I have no other complains except that they've changed my beloved bard into a caster (which I will rant in the relevant thread).

What do you suggest?
I think I only agree with number 1 a bit.
The story is so good that I don't even mind the fetch quest...welcome to MMO's? I meant MMO's...ALWAYS do that.
I also like we have options to speak to people, more choices always welcomed.

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Originally Posted by FateAudax

I'm shocked that you didn't mentioned the love for "hide and seek" quest which SE have installed for us in Heavensward especially in Dravanian Forelands and Churning Mists.

Find the items which these moogles lost.
Find the moogles.
Find this and find that.

Apart from these hide and seek quests (which I have completed), I have no other complains except that they've changed my beloved bard into a caster (which I will rant in the relevant thread).

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Haven't gotten there yet. Lost motivation to continue with main scenerio after all the going back and forth between NPCs just to unlock new content.

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Originally Posted by FateAudax

I'm shocked that you didn't mentioned the love for "hide and seek" quest which SE have installed for us in Heavensward especially in Dravanian Forelands and Churning Mists.

Find the items which these moogles lost.
Find the moogles.
Find this and find that.

Apart from these hide and seek quests (which I have completed), I have no other complains except that they've changed my beloved bard into a caster (which I will rant in the relevant thread).

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Yeah those god dam moogles man.

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Originally Posted by seida

I really disagree.

...would be pretty redundant if you could fly everywhere at top speed straight away.

Well, it's all opinions. But it really just sounds like you want things handed to you with no effort on your part...

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I am sorry, but making us into robots is hardly called "effort". I do not mind earning anything, in fact, I loved the grinding in Final Fantasy 11. However, making me become a robot and going between point A and point B just to unlock content is not effort. It actually undermines my intelligence and yours. Does it take effort to go between point A and point B? It takes time, not effort. It definitely does not require strategy. It's definitely not fun.

I can partially agree with some of your points, but I completely disagree with 1 and 3.

1) Making you gather the aether forces you to actually experience the zone and content and deal with the mobs. If you could fly right away, THAT would defeat the purpose of even having anything in the zone at all. Might as well make it empty or make all the mobs flying creatures.

3) The story makes perfect sense. [SPOILERS] You are dishonored, disgraced and on the run. With no way to prove your innocence, you are forced to take shelter in Ishgard. While some Ishgardians have heard of you and your exploits, you're still a foreigner and largely unproven in the eyes of most Ishgardians. Your patron is taking a risk just vouching for you. It makes sense you would have to start at the bottom of the ladder and work your way up again.


I do agree that filler quests are annoying and there are better ways to handle quest-leveling, but they aren't completely useless. They do make you explore the area.

OP your first point is totally wrong. Given how many quests there are in every region that require flying to complete what you say makes zero sense.

Every region also has several higher level sections of the map that can only be accessed with a flying mount. I'm going to assume you haven't followed any of the quest chains back to previous regions and thus have no idea what you're talking about.

I must disagree with most of your points. I thought the start of Heavensward was a great way to ease us into the main story and Ishgard. I also like how SE is making us play through the story. They actually care about their lore and want people to experience it, rather then it being a novelty like in other MMO games. Frankly I never found FF11 to be that amazing when it came to story (Which was far too gated I thought anyway).

The one point I may slightly great with you is in regards to flying, but even then I am assuming flying will be of use for daily quests/future MSQ's. Even so, its nice to be give an actually reason to explore the game map now, which feels larger then ever before.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Haven't gotten there yet. Lost motivation to continue with main scenerio after all the going back and forth between NPCs just to unlock new content.

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I do agree that the quests can get tedious, but there are other options. FATES, Dungeons, and Levequests are all available to break the repetition.

I've waiting no longer than 3 minutes to get into The Aery as a DPS. So dungeon spam is viable for all jobs.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

However, making me become a robot and going between point A and point B just to unlock content is not effort. It actually undermines my intelligence and yours. Does it take effort to go between point A and point B? It takes time, not effort. It definitely does not require strategy. It's definitely not fun.

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AKA you don't like the story. I find the story fun and interesting. I didn't say it took strategy or skill, that's not the point of it.

I enjoy the characters and seeing what happens with them... there have been occasional useless quests but on the whole the MSQ has been excellent imo.

Subquests though, yeah they're all fetchquests.

So many of this whining threads about the game being too tedious to play. They aren't stupid to give players the ability to fly freely at the very beginning when they know everyone who got early access will definitely ignore everything else and just be zipping from one quest giving NPC to another trying to burn through content just to be the first to hit level 60 in 1 day. I'm happy that i am even able to fly before max level and seeing cool flying mounts unlock as i progress further into the story. Seeing that you are only level 51 i suggest you play the game more and then get back to us later on the story not being as epic as before. Though I would agree with the extremely repetitive quest chores of being a delivery boy or just chit chat kills the game somewhat and that is definitely something the developers can work to make questing much more enjoyable.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

OP your first point is totally wrong. Given how many quests there are in every region that require flying to complete what you say makes zero sense.

Every region also has several higher level sections of the map that can only be accessed with a flying mount. I'm going to assume you haven't followed any of the quest chains back to previous regions and thus have no idea what you're talking about.

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Really? I explored the entire region of Falcon's Nest by foot already. So you're saying there's parts of that map that I have to go back to that can only be accessed via flying? Why? What's the point of that?

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Originally Posted by seida

AKA you don't like the story. I find the story fun and interesting. I didn't say it took strategy or skill, that's not the point of it.

I enjoy the characters and seeing what happens with them... there have been occasional useless quests but on the whole the MSQ has been excellent imo.

Subquests though, yeah they're all fetchquests.

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First 2 hours of main scenerio quest is running errands for your new host. It has no character development at all. Again, first impressions.

Did you not play 2.0 at all? You had to progress through main story to get mount, unlock dungeons, basically move through the game. A lot of 2.0 was fetch and grab too.

Flying mounts in MMOs as a whole are in a rut. WoW didn't even want to have them in their last xpac because they felt players skipped over everything just to get to quest markers. So I understand why SE did what they did. Hopefully their have air content that actually makes flying worth while.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I must disagree with most of your points. I thought the start of Heavensward was a great way to ease us into the main story and Ishgard. I also like how SE is making us play through the story. They actually care about their lore and want people to experience it, rather then it being a novelty like in other MMO games. Frankly I never found FF11 to be that amazing when it came to story (Which was far too gated I thought anyway).

The one point I may slightly great with you is in regards to flying, but even then I am assuming flying will be of use for daily quests/future MSQ's. Even so, its nice to be give an actually reason to explore the game map now, which feels larger then ever before.

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I agree with you, except their lore has a lot of fillers, like the first 2 hours of Heavensward. Running between points and A and points B is hardly story.

Disappointed? DISAPPOINTED!?

Gosh, I'm anything but! So far I've been loving the expansion thoroughly! I love the new jobs, the new race, the new armor sets, the architecture and layout and lore of ishgard, the story, the characters, (...).
On another note: you love grinding (killing lots of the same over and over and over) but HATE going from point A to B? What!? For some reason this sounds horribly contradictory!

You are more than entitled to your opinion but nonetheless I think all you have mentioned are HORRIBLE reasons to hate the expansion!


Oh well!

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Originally Posted by Kaedan94

I can partially agree with some of your points, but I completely disagree with 1 and 3.

3) The story makes perfect sense. [SPOILERS] You are dishonored, disgraced and on the run. With no way to prove your innocence, you are forced to take shelter in Ishgard. While some Ishgardians have heard of you and your exploits, you're still a foreigner and largely unproven in the eyes of most Ishgardians. Your patron is taking a risk just vouching for you. It makes sense you would have to start at the bottom of the ladder and work your way up again.


I do agree that filler quests are annoying and there are better ways to handle quest-leveling, but they aren't completely useless. They do make you explore the area.

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I agree with your points, but I wished they told the story better and got to the point better. first impressions are just so very important and it could've been a lot more exciting.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Really? I explored the entire region of Falcon's Nest by foot already. So you're saying there's parts of that map that I have to go back to that can only be accessed via flying? Why? What's the point of that?

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To do tedious quests to level up, duh!

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Originally Posted by Odstarva

Disappointed? DISAPPOINTED!?

Gosh, I'm anything but! So far I've been loving the expansion thoroughly! I love the new jobs, the new race, the new armor sets, the architecture and layout and lore of ishgard, the story, the characters, (...).
On another note: you love grinding (killing lots of the same over and over and over) but HATE going from point A to B? What!? For some reason this sounds horribly contradictory!

You are more than entitled to your opinion but nonetheless I think all you have mentioned are HORRIBLE reasons to hate the expansion!


Oh well!

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Grinding and killing mobs allows me to at least use my character in some capacity. Going from point A to B only requires my mouse and setting my mouse button 3 as auto run.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

5. What happened to what made the Final Fantasy franchise so great? Where is the "HOLY CRAP, THAT WAS EPIC!" part of the game? Final Fantasy 11 did a much better job with the main scenerio in that regards.

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You haven't seen the cutscene right before accessing Ravana, have you?

my thought exactly. when I start HW I thought what am I doing? climbing all these hills in a boring map (Coerthas Western, this must be the map I hate the most in FFXIV) and when I can finally fly, there's nothing to do anymore and I have to move on to the next map where I have to do even more sidequests to be able to fly.

it doesn't make sense. you have a flying chocobo, you should be able to fly right away. who cares if I don't understand the wind of the area? I don't think I'm gonna get arrested by those people from international airplane federation.

It's funny because flying mount is one of the key features they promoted to sell this expansion.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Grinding and killing mobs allows me to at least use my character in some capacity. Going from point A to B only requires my mouse and setting my mouse button 3 as auto run.

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And personally I find grinding and killing mobs absolutely mind-numbing. Perhaps you are playing the wrong game?

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Originally Posted by Evangela

my thought exactly.

it doesn't make sense. you have a flying chocobo, you should be able to fly right away. who cares if I don't understand the wind of the area? I don't think I'm gonna get arrested by those people from international airplane federation.

It's funny because flying mount is one of the key features they promoted to sell this expansion.

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My point exactly. If people are so afraid of others progressing really fast and being able to explore freely, that's just sad. Why does it matter if somebody else chooses to get to 60 faster than you? Why should other people be forced to go at your pace just because it's enjoyable for you? Everyone should be free to make their own choices and play how they want to play.

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Originally Posted by Mhikail

What do you suggest?
I think I only agree with number 1 a bit.
The story is so good that I don't even mind the fetch quest...welcome to MMO's? I meant MMO's...ALWAYS do that.
I also like we have options to speak to people, more choices always welcomed.

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It's the fact that most aren't interesting at all. Best one so far is the one Little Brother-Big Brother dragon quest line, and that's mainly because it's directly linked to events happening in the main story. Honestly do we really care about putting something on someone's grave across the large map before unlocking flying for some random old lady?

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Final Fantasy 11 did a much better job with the main scenerio in that regards.

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This is your problem right here.

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Originally Posted by seida

And personally I find grinding and killing mobs absolutely mind-numbing. Perhaps you are playing the wrong game?

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I'm definitely not playing the wrong game because I enjoyed the Relic grind. Grinding and killing mobs in FFXI helped people develop relationships and socialize with others who needed to progress. In this game, it's all about soloing and going from point a to point b, until you absolutely have to gear grind, which I enjoy when there's no lockout timers.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I must disagree with most of your points. I thought the start of Heavensward was a great way to ease us into the main story and Ishgard. I also like how SE is making us play through the story. They actually care about their lore and want people to experience it, rather then it being a novelty like in other MMO games. Frankly I never found FF11 to be that amazing when it came to story (Which was far too gated I thought anyway).

The one point I may slightly great with you is in regards to flying, but even then I am assuming flying will be of use for daily quests/future MSQ's. Even so, its nice to be give an actually reason to explore the game map now, which feels larger then ever before.

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I was thinking the same thing. I don't see them making us do all that for nothing. To the OP and those who agree I say be patient, I'm sure future content will have a lot to do with flying.

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Originally Posted by Tenku

Really? I explored the entire region of Falcon's Nest by foot already. So you're saying there's parts of that map that I have to go back to that can only be accessed via flying? Why? What's the point of that?

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Because you come back there later? You pass through the same region multiple times over the course of leveling 50-60. When you first run through Coerthas Western Highlands it's full of level 50-52 quests. Later on you come back and are treated to a bunch of level 56 quests that take place in the areas that can only be reached via flying.

Do you seriously mean to tell me that you created a whine thread without having actually reached 60 to form an educated opinion based on the entire experience?

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Originally Posted by Tenku

I wished they told the story better and got to the point better... it could've been a lot more exciting.

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Can't really start off exciting when your character was just forced to hide in Ishgard.

What would they do? Get into ishgard the suddenly another dragon attack? We just forced them to retreat not too long ago in the story. Or we get in ishgard and we're heralded as this amazing person in everyone's eyes and go fight dragons, ascians, find the scions, and clear our names at the start? That's boring.

A good story isn't always quick to start. First impressions are very important, and the first impression i got was good. They started off exactly how they should have, the party is exhausted and learning their way around new surroundings. They don't magically know where to go and what to do from the get-go. You need to build up to those events. The devs did it right in my opinion (not that the filler portions are very good, but it serves a purpose).

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Originally Posted by Strika23

I was thinking the same thing. I don't see them making us do all that for nothing. Be patient, I'm sure future content will have a lot to do with flying.

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But why do that and risk losing players? I keep pointing out first impressions. In today's society, people judge immediately in the opening moments. I'll find a way to love this game, but I wish I love it without having to try to love it.

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Originally Posted by File2ish

Can't really start off exciting when your character was just forced to hide in Ishgard.

A good story isn't always quick to start. First impressions are very important, and the first impression i got was good. They started off exactly how they should have, the party is exhausted and learning their way around new surroundings. They don't magically know where to go and what to do from the get-go. You need to build up to those events. The devs did it right in my opinion (not that the filler portions are very good, but it serves a purpose).

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How about instead of running errands for some randoms that will never be part of the story again, go straight into the part where his 2 companions were captured. It's the fillers that sucks.

It still doesn't make sense. we have a much bigger problem in Ul'dah, with all of our friends disappeared and what do we do? running around in foreign nation, feeding the dragons and helping people solve their little problems.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Because you come back there later? You pass through the same region multiple times over the course of leveling 50-60. When you first run through Coerthas Western Highlands it's full of level 50-52 quests. Later on you come back and are treated to a bunch of level 56 quests that take place in the areas that can only be reached via flying.

Do you seriously mean to tell me that you created a whine thread without having actually reached 60 to form an educated opinion based on the entire experience?

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Oh no, this is a "first experience" thread! Don't you know, you can and should complain about the whole of anything after you barely scratch the surface!






Yap! :D

OP has a single job at 51 and the 3 new jobs are not even unlocked.

I can not in any seriousness take into account feedback from such little playtime.
You might consider exploring and experiencing more before making judgement about the negatives and positive.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Do you seriously mean to tell me that you created a whine thread without having actually reached 60 to form an educated opinion based on the entire experience?

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Do you seriously mean to tell me I should force myself to play when the game is not currently enjoyable and I have friends quitting because of all the tedious senseless quests? At this point, it's faster to exp by doing these senseless quests than to grind instances.

Do you seriously mean to tell me that you replied to a whine thread with an uneducated response that said something like "form an educated opinion based on the entire experience" when the point of playing the game is to have fun? Why does anybody have to start having fun at the end of the game and not the beginning?

Even FFXI not only starts you off running errands, picking up reports from mines and fetching eggs for senators' dinners, but the NPCs even tell you that you gotta do the tedious stuff before you'll be trusted with more important things. Sort of fits with Heavensward as well since we're setting foot into a land that's had its borders closed for a considerable amount of time. You wouldn't even be there at the start were it not for your connections you made in Coerthas.

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Originally Posted by Niqote

OP has a single job at 51 and the 3 new jobs are not even unlocked.

I can not in any seriousness take into account feedback from such little playtime

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Because the main scenerio is boring so far and doing the point a to point b quests are boring. I'm having more fun reading your replies.

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Originally Posted by Wizarus

It's the fact that most aren't interesting at all. Best one so far is the one Little Brother-Big Brother dragon quest line, and that's mainly because it's directly linked to events happening in the main story. Honestly do we really care about putting something on someone's grave across the large map before unlocking flying for some random old lady?

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But that ain't part of main story and is not in line to unlock flying in Western Coerthas. Though the delivering flower to grave quest is boring but it could have been saved for later for easy xp on your other alt jobs once you unlock flying from doing the actual main quests in that area.