change the 5 gate need for MNK chakra

I understand the principle of having that skill be on GCD (Weapon skill) but i feel the need to reach 5 gate is kinda too much.. its soo long its a hassle.. at least there should be a passif that.. allow a % chance of gaining a chakra while fighting.. or maybe reduce the number.. 5 is just too much for nothing...

i accept the fact that its a gcd.. i accept the fact it cant be just 1.. but 5? why 5.. and not 3..?? would still be better..

gain one stack of chakra every time you gain a stack of GL?

Maybe they can add instant 5 Chakra per use of Tornado Kick and maybe raise the potency of Tornado kick by 20~potency.

I kinda hope they let us get a chakra stack every like 8-10sec to prevent spammable (In battle), while still give us the option to do it manual with current 1.5sec gcd.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OmegaStrongtan

gain one stack of chakra every time you gain a stack of GL?

---

YES!

Ive been thinking exactly this!

Now we have 2 abilites that does the same thing pretty much, which makes it very clunky. Let mantra be something generated through skills or proccs, which would make us focus more on move forms! Would be such a huge QoL change..

Should've just let in build passively, gonna get to use it like 3 times in a boss fight and prolly the same for Tornado as well. We clearly got the short end of the stick with buffs compared to the other melees.

Would be better to gain chakra similar to how war gain wrath

Yeah Chakra is a bit awkward to use.
In most fights, there's hardly and opportunity to charge 5 stacks, so it's used pretty much only in the opener, with stacks precharged before the pull.

I'm also baffled as to where the Chakra TP skill might be useful outside of large pull trash mobs. If a boss has enough downtime for you to charge it, chances are pretty good that you don't need the TP.

I'd like it to be an off GCD skill with 5 sec delay. Could use it regularly w/o spamming it.

Chakra feels really awkward right now. I really wish they add some damage to the builder itself and make it a skill that we actually weave into our rotation. Maybe make it do little damage on the first hit and scales slowly with the chakras stacks.

Meditation does exactly what Yoshida said it would do: it gives MNK a way to offset DPS loss in situations where attacking a target at melee range is too dangerous or impossible. Form Shift is the same way.

It's not without problems, though:

- Meditation is noisy. For the number of times we're expected to Meditate before it pays off, the same, obnoxiously loud SFX grates hard on the ears. The first four Chakra opened should have gentler SFX, and the fifth can have the current SFX to distinguish it from the rest for the sake of audio feedback.

- The Forbidden Chakra is slow. MNK skill speed is higher than ever between new item levels and new buffs from other jobs. By 56, we have four off-GCD to weave: Howling Fist, Steel Peak, Shoulder Tackle and Elixir Field--not to mention self-buffs--which all fit neatly between GCDs. The Forbidden Chakra locks out player input even with precise inter-GCD timing. Considering its overwhelming potency, however, this may be intentional. I would still welcome additional tactical value to TFC: refresh the duration of the current GL stack, if not add a new stack altogether.

maybe they can make it only 3 stacks but the cooldown is 2.5s each. so its still 7.5s total to get max stacks. just to lessen the number of key press it takes. it gets pretty tiring

Meditation is not intended to be used multiple times in a direct fight. The entire point of it is to give you a way to make up for the DPS lost when a boss jumps or becomes invulnerable - NOT to be thrown into the middle of your rotation. Hit it 5 times between pulls, or make yourself a macro to have it do it for you so you don't have to hit a bunch of buttons over and over. If you're trying to use Meditate in the middle of your rotation, you're doing it wrong and losing DPS for it.

I will agree the sound is pretty grating, though. I like it but 5x between every fight not to mention tossing my form shift in as well can be a pretty loud mess before every pull. Aside from this there is nothing wrong with the skill that you can't fix with a quick macro in between pulls / phases.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kailok

...words...

---

i think everyone understands the "purpose" for the most part, it's just the implementation that sucks.

the noise is annoying, and spamming a button 5 times between pulls just isn't fun. AT ALL.

MY SOLUTION: gain a Chakra stack for every ability used that would grant greased lightning AFTER you have your 3 stacks. the stacks don't fall off, and Forbidden Chakra gets a potency buff. 400 maybe. this would be an effective way to use the abilities in most boss encounters, AND would promote good management of GL stacks and form shift when running around in the open world, as most mobs won't take long enough to kill to actually get Chakra stacks unless you chain them together.

This Really does need a change, We get that it should be used outside of combat, but why the spamming. its been said over and over, its annoying and not fun.

Possible fix's: Passively gain stacks while not attacking an enemy.

Off globe cool down: Gain stacks of chakra while not using ability's.

just make it so we don't have to spam that stupid button everywhere we go, Hell you could even put it like Aetherflow like summoner/ Scholor. just make it only be able to use outside of combat.

Form change is also very lack luster, anyone that plays monk knows you learn how to interact in a fight to keep your stacks differently to how everyone else deals with mechanics, its a part of monk i enjoy, having to move exactly at the right time and not just going "meh il spam yet another ability to get to snap punch and not learn. personally i think Form shift would have been better suited as a single use perfect balance, again not to have to spam the hell out of a non damage annoying ability.

While the spamming between pulls is a bit much, I don't think that warrants changing its intended function in battle. People saying they don't get a chance to use it after the opener, are you absolutely sure you're not using it immediately when you can't hit anything? I've found many fights in Heavensward where I can get off 3-4 Forbidden Chakras in typical dungeon bosses, slightly more in Bismarck / Ravana (the latter especially). Even if you only get a couple of stacks during one brief bit of downtime you can finish them off at the next chance, every brief bit of downtime take advantage. I'd welcome something that stops it being spammy between pulls, maybe make it fully charge when out of combat - or gain 2 / 3 stacks when out of combat - but honestly I think the 5 stack thing IN combat is fine.

Also because Shoulder Tackle is now weave-able at all times I'm finding it's down when I'd have otherwise needed it before, but hey, more chakra stacks :P (or a Form Change to keep GL which could be more important. I like all these new situational decisions we have). Before we only had to worry about GL stacks which required a general knowledge of fight patterns, but now we need to know them more intimately to know when to Form Change, Meditate, or Tornado Kick. When people start getting more comfortable with familiar fights and know exactly when they can get away with Meditation I think this initial reaction will ease off. Also don't forget - Meditation is a supplement to our primary rotation when it's unavailable, not a be-all-end-all mechanic. In some fights it will be pretty useless (T8 comes to mind), but again - a lot of content in H/W seems to be allowing ample time to practice the new stuff on Monk. Retaining Greased Lightning with our tried and true rotations is more important than Forbidden Chakra, but at the same time I'm not finding it _that_ bothersome to attain a few times in the new fights.

But yes, please do something about the spam out of combat and/or sound effect!

Meditation | instant | 1.5s recast time

"Opens a chakra. Maximum of chakras open is 5. Shares a recast timer with all other weaponskills.

Effect out of combat: opens 5 chakras at once"

That's what I hope the tooltip would say, since when a boss jumps/is untargettable/invurnable you're still in combat so you still get 1 stack on those times, but it would reduce the noice pollution between everything else, and save time when doing quests or fates etc.

You killed the monster that you had to kill? Good, now stand there for 7.5 second spamming one button while watching as others are already halfway to the next place.

first thing i did was macro it behind ST so i could run while spamming it. NO WAY i'll stand still to do it unless waiting for a pull.

I agree on the spamming part, it gets REALLY annoying.... and theres a lot of ways SE could fix that without affecting the skill intended usage.

A very simple solution would be for it to simply open all 5 chakras when used outside battle. Doing so would remove 90% of the annoying spam, while still maintaining its core purpose during battle unchanged.

SE wanted to make downtime less painful for MNK's, and that idea is good, but they shouldn't have focused only on downtime... Elixir Field is a very nice ability, but apart from that it's all related to downtime in some way. Forbidden Chakra and Purification can only be used after getting 5 stacks of Chakra, which requires downtime(except first one). Form Shift is useless unless you can't hit anything(really think this ability is a waste), and Tornado Kick is a DPS increase if you use PB right after I think, but that's still very limited usage, and mostly used right before, you guessed it, downtime...

Even after getting those 5 stacks, you're only getting a 320 Potency attack, which is much for MNKs, but still not like extremely high.

Meditation should be usable even when there's no downtime, oGCD with short CD, or work in another way.

My biggest gripe is the 1.5 seconds. I feel like it should be faster or scale with skill speed and/or your greased lightning stacks. The constant spam and sound is kind of annoying though. Besides that I like how they added stuff to keep your damage up when their is downtime in fights.

I agree that there needs to be some QoL changes with meditation. The real problem is how bad the 50-60 skills are for Monks when compared to everyone else. Monks got two self only utility skills that are largely useless in combat, one useful dps skill on a short CD, and two mostly useless damage abilities. FC is usable only a limited number of times a fight and the dmg is just sad for the amount of effort required. I mean Ninjas and Dragoons can do that much damage or more whenever they want with regular combos. TK is a DPS loss overall since it wipes out your GL stacks. At best it breaks even assuming you can continue your combo immediately, which is not the context for which it was intended. If the boss is away long enough for you to meditate or use TK/lose all your GL stacks, your DPS is already in the toilet by virtue of the fight mechanics. The other melee classes still have 1/3 the ramp up time of Monks in any case, so I fail to see how two measly attacks are making up for it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Merielle

I agree that there needs to be some QoL changes with meditation. The real problem is how bad the 50-60 skills are for Monks when compared to everyone else. Monks got two self only utility skills that are largely useless in combat, one useful dps skill on a short CD, and two mostly useless damage abilities. FC is usable only a limited number of times a fight and the dmg is just sad for the amount of effort required. I mean Ninjas and Dragoons can do that much damage or more whenever they want with regular combos. TK is a DPS loss overall since it wipes out your GL stacks. At best it breaks even assuming you can continue your combo immediately, which is not the context for which it was intended. If the boss is away long enough for you to meditate or use TK/lose all your GL stacks, your DPS is already in the toilet by virtue of the fight mechanics. The other melee classes still have 1/3 the ramp up time of Monks in any case, so I fail to see how two measly attacks are making up for it.

---

This^

I really hate how Meditation works, and if it would just work in another way, so that it's useful even on a perfect scenario fight(no downtime), much of the problem would be solved.

What I hate the most though, is that they're making Forbidden Chakra seem like some huge damage burst... When in reality it's nothing special at all compared to other jobs. 5 hard earned Chakra stacks for a 320 potency attack with long animation lock? wow, that's sad...

Even with MNKs high buff to damage, 320 isn't that high... Demolish does more in total, and I know Forbidden Chakra is oGCD, but it's supposed to be a huge hit after all, and since there's animation lock, you're basically losing some of that potency in form of slowing down the rotation.

Most of the time I don't even notice there have been any additions to MNK at all. EDIT: except ofc Elixir Field that I love, but that's just a oGCD to use during the old standard rotation

This need to be petition. In terms of dos were r we behind lol. The dev team can take meditation and shove it unless we get the changes we ask for. This is uncalled for. I'm not that monks needs to be top dps like they have in ARR era, it just mnk feels so week for being the job that have to rely on ramp up time. Battle mechanics have not change. It's still the same like it was in ARR , boss start u attack boss and boss hides, but this time we loss much even more dps due to other dps having more utility that can bring there dps back up much faster. Either fix meditation or increase the potency on both FC and TK.

The main thing I liked about monk was how well everything flowed and I feel like it's kind of clunky now--with meditate/chakra being the main cause of it. I do like that it's an active ability and would actually hate it if they made it passive but it just takes too much time to get to your right stance and build up chakra when there's down time in fights that you basically only have the 5 stacks once or twice in a fight. Especially since most of the time you are moving from target to target you are either using shoulder tackle or you can just run to where you are going in 2-3 seconds. So if you don't need to form shift you can usually only build up one chakra stack.

So yeah, I was really hyped about the chakra system but with it working how it does right now it almost doesn't feel like it's part of their rotation or anything since you use it so infrequently and don't get any buffs from using it instead of a weapon skill.

I'd even be totally fine with something like tornado kick still removing your gl stacks but in turn giving you a full 5 stacks of chakra.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SwarleyMcSwarls

I'd even be totally fine with something like tornado kick still removing your gl stacks but in turn giving you a full 5 stacks of chakra.

---

that would just be robbing peter to pay paul... an overcomplicated pointless mechanic.

it should have just built up automatically like Wrath. the big misconception is that downtime was the problem with MNK; this is not the case. ALL DPS CLASSES accomplish basically nothing during downtime. the "issue" with MNK was a slower ramp up AFTER downtime, due to lost stacks. giving MNKs some arbitrary button-mashing to do during downtime didn't add anything to the job other than arbitrary button-mashing. adding a mechanic that reliably extended GL3 like NIN's Huton extension would have made WAY more sense to add something to the capabilities.

that said, i like the idea of Chakra, but it would be nice if it built up automatically and had a use that extended the current GL stack by 15 seconds or something.

Armor crush like move on mnk we have already. RB SP dm. formless stance give us 1 stack of gl thaats awesome right there. What needs to be fix is either how meditation is accumulated or increase pot on FC and TK will solve this issue

Monks right now feels like how it was at the start of ARR. Until we got the necessary pot increase on our rear attacks. This needs to happen again.