Ninja and using macros.

Hiya fellow NIN's out there!

I find it pretty cool that for my NIN that I can use macros with rotation actions because the delay is only at 1,99 so I can make a <wait.2> after used action, this is not something I can do on other jobs because the delay on actions is not as good as NIN and the 2 sec wait only.

Here is a example on what I do. First off I don't use macros for all stuff for sneak attack and trick attack I do it manually but for my rotation I can use it after and even use blood for blood, raging strike, jugulate and mug.. etc.. in between actions.

Why I use macros? It is easier and I don't need to press the hot-bar so I think maybe a little bit faster too.

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My macro rotation looks like this.

/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Dancing Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Mutilate" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Shadow Fang" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Aeolian Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Aeolian Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/echo Ninja combo finished, star over! <se.9> <se.11> <se.13>


By the way if a monster move around allot I do it manually if it get out of reach.


I just wanted to share and ask if you guys use macro for NIN too?

The only macro I use is one to paste a certain bear in party chat.

Using macros for DPS is bad since there is added delay and the game will not queue actions the same way it does when you press skills manually. You've taken it a step further by actually macro'ing your entire rotation... That being said you don't seem to account for Off-global cooldown skills between actions either.

I HIGHLY advise you to ditch the macros and learn to get used to playing the class manually. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but i'm telling you it will be for the best.

Gah. That sounds... Awful.

I don't use macros for anything. Mudras, skills, oGCD, it's all done manually. This gives me actual control because things won't always line up perfectly and sometimes you have to do things out of order.

If this combo is used and you just press it again afterwards, you're reapplying Mutilate too early. Taking too long to reapply Shadow Fang and Dancing Edge.

Please stop. Rotation Macro's as a DPS are extremely inefficient and gimp your damage output from the built in delays.

Please become accustomed to pressing the buttons manually if you intend to DPS seriously.

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

My macro rotation looks like this.

/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Dancing Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Mutilate" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Shadow Fang" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Aeolian Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Spinning Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Gust Slash" <t> <wait.2>
/ac "Aeolian Edge" <t> <wait.2>
/echo Ninja combo finished, star over! <se.9> <se.11> <se.13>


By the way if a monster move around allot I do it manually if it get out of reach.


I just wanted to share and ask if you guys use macro for NIN too?

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I don't know but... Maybe, just maybe... It's a bait? A trap?

I WANT to believe its a trap :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HeavensSword

Using macros for DPS is bad since there is added delay and the game will not queue actions the same way it does when you press skills manually. You've taken it a step further by actually macro'ing your entire rotation... That being said you don't seem to account for Off-global cooldown skills between actions either.

I HIGHLY advise you to ditch the macros and learn to get used to playing the class manually. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but i'm telling you it will be for the best.

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Thanks for your advise I have played Ninja allot manually pressing the hot-bars as I set them for rotation and what a NIN can use. THE only reason I made a actual macro rotation for NIN is that I can make it for a delay of 2 secs that fits to how the actions is ready so when I play the macro my NIN actually do the entire rotation with the delay of 2 secs by all for the full DPS in that rotation.

Ruddi - the Macro built in delay will always round up to the nearest whole number. I highly doubt your GCD is 2 seconds exactly, probably more like 2.38 with Huton up and depending on your skill speed. So it will delay to 3 seconds on your Macro, even without you programming that exact wait time.

You are losing a significant amount of time with each rotation by Macro'ing it, and in turn a significant loss in dps. Reddit and other sites have covered this extensively, please read them, or run the numbers using Macro and non-macro - there will be a difference.

There are many, many, many reasons why macroing any GCD skill is bad, not to mention an entire rotation. As others have said, you can only have a delay of whole seconds in a macro. Your GCD will not be exactly whole seconds no matter what you think. On top of that, your lag to the server will artificially increase your GCD.

Macros cannot know your GCD. They cannot know your skill cooldowns. The macro will literally wait the time specified, and then try to execute the action. If the action is off cooldown, nothing will happen, but after the next delay specified, the next command will be attempted. In other words, macros do not "queue" moves.

If you are using skills manually and you hit a skill that has 0.5 seconds or less remaining on the cooldown, the skill will flash and then the second it finishes cooling down, it goes off. This is called "queuing" a move, and it not only eliminates any delay due to user input, it also eliminates any delay due to latency because the queuing happens on the server. If you use a macro, it can't queue because the game has no idea what skills are being used in the macro since you can have several or none. So, even if you have a single skill macroed (something like /ac "Spinning Edge" <t>, /p "Ha! Take that, evildoer!"), if you hit that macro when a skill is 0.1 seconds from cooling down, it won't do anything. Because of this, macroing GCD skills at all is a major DPS loss.

The upshot of all this is that if you use macros like this, you might as well remove all skillspeed from your gear and stop using Huton because you are completely eliminating any benefits from those to your DPS. This macro will significantly lower your DPS in all content, especially late game content, making you a liability to your group in any DPS check scenario. In any situation where you have to move as part of dealing with mechanics, it'll be even worse as you miss parts of your combos due to positioning.


In short, don't do it. Don't use macros for rotations. Don't use macros for any GCD skill at all.

Only macro really important skill uses that your party needs to know about, like Hallowed Ground (PLD), Berserk (WAR), Raise/Resurrection (WHM/SCH/SMN), Cometeor (BLM/SMN in PvP), and so on. NIN has only two skills that fit this criteria that might be useful to announce via a macro when you use them: Goad and Trick Attack.

Macros are also good for skills you want to use on a mouse-over target, like Aetherial Manipulation (BLM) or Cover (PLD) - you can set it so hitting your middle mouse button while hovering over a person (or their name in your party list) will cast the skill on them. I don't think NIN has any for this since their movement skill is a ground target. Maybe Goad, so you don't have to deselect your current target?

So, a good NIN macro could be:

/micon "Goad"
/ac "Goad" <mo>
/wait 1
/p Goad used on <mo>

(the wait is there so if you spam the button, you don't spam your party)

Aha, so this is why I out-DPS so many NINs with my WAR in expert roulettes and WoD. :p Don't ever macro a GCD move to another GCD move, it reduces your damage output by quite a lot.

Hmmm, you should adjust <s.e>'s at the end to make a proper song, and don't forget the "/dance! /dance! Show me that you good enough!"
I also see that you don't have any CD or Mudras in there and I sincerely believe that this is the right thing to do. Because this stuff is like for pussies and as far as I can see you ain't playing no female Miqo'te so you shouldn't even use them in the first place. Keep up the good work! :D

My eyes have bleeded... Sorry for the harsh words.

Macroing your GCD is the worst idea you can come up with, and those above have already stated very well why. Not only you gimp your damage, but also greatly increase the chance of 1 or more actions not een getting executed.

Only macro I use for NIN is to let my inefficient self know when Trick Attack is back up and ready to use again.

this is probably why there's so many lolnins lately that do 150 less dps than the other dps in dungeons.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ruri

this is probably why there's so many lolnins lately that do 150 less dps than the other dps in dungeons.

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And the ones that only cast hyoton at the beginning of a fight and only doton during the fight.

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Originally Posted by m3eansean

Ruddi - the Macro built in delay will always round up to the nearest whole number. I highly doubt your GCD is 2 seconds exactly, probably more like 2.38 with Huton up and depending on your skill speed. So it will delay to 3 seconds on your Macro, even without you programming that exact wait time.

You are losing a significant amount of time with each rotation by Macro'ing it, and in turn a significant loss in dps. Reddit and other sites have covered this extensively, please read them, or run the numbers using Macro and non-macro - there will be a difference.

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My action skill delay is at 1,99 with huton up so it round up to 2 secs, I can make a video if you don't believe me but the skill speed is really fast and I have timed it also with the result 2 secs delay.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

My action skill delay is at 1,99 with huton up so it round up to 2 secs, I can make a video if you don't believe me but the skill speed is really fast and I have timed it also with the result 2 secs delay.

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Even if it were, you aren't weaving your mudras and other off-global cooldown abilities like jugulate, mug, and trick attack using that macro.

Just. Don't.
NIN's strength lies in weaving in oGCDs and mudras into a largely linear rotation... the fact you are completely ignoring all of that means your dps will be incredibly low, even if your delay is almost exactly 2 seconds.

It's like going with a "rotation" of Spinning Edge, Spinning Edge, Spinning Edge, Spinning Edge... there is nothing to stop you doing this, but there's a fair chance you will annoy every party you ever join

Tbh macros for any dps class is just gimping yourself from dps
And macros announcing Mage's Ballad is up, etc. is really not needed since it does show up on screen if people pay attention, lol
I really only use macros for scholar

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Originally Posted by HeavensSword

Even if it were, you aren't weaving your mudras and other off-global cooldown abilities like jugulate, mug, and trick attack using that macro.

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True but I can use them in between actions because they are instant, with the right timing it is easy.

I don't say macros is the way to go but I play with macros to see if it fits in.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

True but I can use them in between actions because they are instant, with the right timing it is easy.

I don't say macros is the way to go but I play with macros to see if it fits in.

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You can play with macro, we won't keep you from doing it, but if you find yourself in trouble for not pulling enough dps and people complaining about it, you will know that it's because of the macro, it does make that big of a difference.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spayd

You can play with macro, we won't keep you from doing it, but if you find yourself in trouble for not pulling enough dps and people complaining about it, you will know that it's because of the macro, it does make that big of a difference.

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I'm just super glad he's not on my data center... though I'll bet many of the times I've run with high ilvl, low DPS NINs, they were doing similar =\ Personally, I find it really frustrating to play with people who have such low DPS despite their apparent high ilvl. I guess it's just a strong reminder that ilvl isn't everything.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nyalia

I'm just super glad he's not on my data center... though I'll bet many of the times I've run with high ilvl, low DPS NINs, they were doing similar =\ Personally, I find it really frustrating to play with people who have such low DPS despite their apparent high ilvl. I guess it's just a strong reminder that ilvl isn't everything.

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Okay you guys try use macro for your selves before judging me... I have tested it my rotation many times now and I do a bit better with macro rotation vs pressing the hot-bar, it is not by much but the macro is faster than me pressing the hot-bar and it is not because I am slow at pressing it is simply a matter of delay for fingers to press the combination.

Remember you need a action delay under 2 secs for it to work.

Sorry, but if 2 seconds are not enough for you to press a button, than you have to put up with people calling you slow. No way around it.

If you really are better with that macro, thats fine, you seem to be able to clear stuff you play, all power to you, but it's very very far from optimal.

Can you tell us how you came to the conclusion that your macro does better DPS for you than manual play? any numbers? That'd be very interesting now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

it is not by much but the macro is faster than me pressing the hot-bar and it is not because I am slow at pressing it is simply a matter of delay for fingers to press the combination.

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Actually if you find the macro rotation faster then you are slow at pressing the abilities. Don't wait for the button to "light up" before pressing it. If you press the ability before the GCD refreshes you'll queue the ability and it'll go off instantly. This is why if you watch videos of other players you'll see that some spam press their buttons until the ability goes off.

Ignoring everything else wrong with macroing GCD rotations missing the GCD queuing completely destroys your dps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nyalia

Macros cannot know your GCD. They cannot know your skill cooldowns. The macro will literally wait the time specified, and then try to execute the action. If the action is off cooldown, nothing will happen, but after the next delay specified, the next command will be attempted. In other words, macros do not "queue" moves.

If you are using skills manually and you hit a skill that has 0.5 seconds or less remaining on the cooldown, the skill will flash and then the second it finishes cooling down, it goes off. This is called "queuing" a move, and it not only eliminates any delay due to user input, it also eliminates any delay due to latency because the queuing happens on the server. If you use a macro, it can't queue because the game has no idea what skills are being used in the macro since you can have several or none. So, even if you have a single skill macroed (something like /ac "Spinning Edge" <t>, /p "Ha! Take that, evildoer!"), if you hit that macro when a skill is 0.1 seconds from cooling down, it won't do anything. Because of this, macroing GCD skills at all is a major DPS loss.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by HeavensSword

Using macros for DPS is bad since there is added delay and the game will not queue actions the same way it does when you press skills manually. You've taken it a step further by actually macro'ing your entire rotation... That being said you don't seem to account for Off-global cooldown skills between actions either.

I HIGHLY advise you to ditch the macros and learn to get used to playing the class manually. Sorry if this sounds harsh, but i'm telling you it will be for the best.

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What he said.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ruddi

Okay you guys try use macro for your selves before judging me... I have tested it my rotation many times now and I do a bit better with macro rotation vs pressing the hot-bar, it is not by much but the macro is faster than me pressing the hot-bar and it is not because I am slow at pressing it is simply a matter of delay for fingers to press the combination.

Remember you need a action delay under 2 secs for it to work.

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I do not judge you, I'm just stating what Macroing your GCD will do to you and the consequence it can have. If you are still not believing what's commonly agreed, about queuing, here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czzL...utu.be&t=4m15s Look at from 4:15, you can see clearly what Macro GCD do, vs without.

I think he is trolling us at this point guys. That, or he really doesn't seem to understand what we are explaining to him.

IF (and that's a big if) your GCD is down to less than 2 seconds, then you have a TON of skill speed that should be removed in place of a crit/det build on some of your gear. I see you've switched to WHM on lodestone, so I can't check your stats, but I am curious to know what your SS amount is on your NIN.

Also can you post us some numbers that you are getting with and without your macro?

Think troll too
Either way w/e, if not, play how you like, your opinion > everyone else on this thread trying to help you

Hi. with huton up my skill speed is 1,99 it is easy to test just put mouse over a skill and it will say what skill speed is for that action.

I have done some more testing and the macro is not 100% perfect because of the cool downs on other skills not in macro. I said I was playing with macros and at a time it seamed like the macro rotation was faster but because of other skills cooldown that is not in macro it is faster to be able to click on them on hotbar.

Thank you for reply guys. Peace out.

The only macro you should ever use on a melee DPS job is:

/p Paeon or Goad please. <se.2>

I have two macros:

*BUFFS*
These are "Blood for Blood", "Internal Release", and "Keen Flurry". There are no /wait commands, so I hit the macro as needed.

*TRICK ATTACK*
While "Trick Attack" is not macro'd, the queue for it is. So, when I'm preparing "Trick Attack", only the start of it is macro'd to let DPS know it's coming. I have the other two Ninjutsu on each of their own button. On Playstation, I hold L2 then hold R2 as my main Ninjutsu bar, with Ten, Chi, Jin being SQUARE, TRIANGLE, CIRCLE, respectively while holding R2 then hold L2 is specifically used for Trick Attack's setup, in which case SQUARE is the ready macro. Here's how it goes:

Hold R2 then L2.

Pressing SQUARE has:
/em is setting up {Trick Attack}.
This allows DPS time to buff up their power. Then I just hit TRIANGLE, then Circle. I hit X (Ninjutsu) when I'm behind mob.

You need to see it in action. It's so simple.