What is Hard Core? What is Casual?

I might get called a troll for this... but I do mean it as an honest question since FFXIV is my first and only online game.


What is Hard Core? What is Casual?

Is the defining point between Hard Core and Casual simply a matter of how much time a person can spend playing the game?

Or does it also have something to do with mindset and goals? i.e. the reason why we play?

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Am I Hard Core? Or am I Casual? I honestly don't know.

- I've been playing for hours on end almost every single day since October (being a housewife has its perks!) because I really have a lot of fun in Eorzea.

- Yet, after all this time, I only have 1 class at R50 because I only do battle when my friends are logged in; and many times we don't even do that -- We often just sit around talking for hours.

- I don't really care about having the best equipment and have pretty much worn the same outfit since November because I like how it looks, even though some of the pieces do not even favor my main classes (I am aware of the consequences).

- I'm not a skillful player, nor is it really my goal to become so. But I really enjoy Dzemael because it requires teamwork, and I do have to play at the best of my meager ability in order to keep myself and my friends alive.


What am I? ^^;

People would call you a casual gamer you lay back play a lot of hours but don't really care about the end goal of getting the good stuff. Hardcore players at least for me would be someone who play to get the best item and be the best they can it not about how many hours you play at least not for me.

I know many people who played less in FFXI then i did and had more 75s then i did lol took me 2years to get 75 i was helping friends, talking and just siting in main city in sandy finding noobs to give them money and help them out with the game at least the very few good noobs that where nice to come up to me and ask for help and not request money so i did even better give them 10k and got them the set of gear they needed to 7.

But ya i call you casual that what i do and i play hours.

You sound very much like a casual player to me. Casual to me means someone who only plays to have fun for themselves and doesn't care about being the best they can be to help the group. Hardcore is someone who plays for progress and completion, as well as does their best for the team. I'm not saying casuals can't be really nice people, but they often need to focus and play skillfully but are unwilling to. These are just my opinions however.

I don't mean it as to be rude, but people like you are the exact reason we need required rank and class on gear. People who think that it's fine to hinder everyone else because they want to look a certain way and be a gimp. The game isn't a fashion show. Wearing what you want in town is fine but don't do it in real game play.

~Roegadyn

I would call you casual.

Most people stopped using playtime as an indicator. We all found out years ago that millions of people spend 10+ hours a day in MMO's without the slightest care for progression of any kind.

To me, your defining characteristics are that you view fun in terms of casual ideals such as: Aesthetic appeal, friendship and team based play that can be overcome without attention to extensive prep-work.

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Originally Posted by Zenaku

I know many people who played less in FFXI then i did and had more 75s then i did lol took me 2years to get 75 i was helping friends, talking and just siting in main city in sandy finding noobs to give them money and help them out with the game at least the very few good noobs that where nice to come up to me and ask for help and not request money so i did even better give them 10k and got them the set of gear they needed to 7.

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I know what you mean. I have many new player friends who have have quickly surpassed me in rank.

But I've somewhat intentionally kept classes in the R10~, R20~, and R30~ ranges so I can play with almost anyone I meet.

I also like meeting new people and helping new players, and really had no idea online games could be this much fun. ^^

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Originally Posted by Arximiro

I don't mean it as to be rude, but people like you are the exact reason we need required rank and class on gear. People who think that it's fine to hinder everyone else because they want to look a certain way and be a gimp. The game isn't a fashion show. Wearing what you want in town is fine but don't do it in real game play.

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No offense taken.

Dzemael is actually the first time I've cared about what equipment I am wearing, and I now have a Dzemael/HNM outfit that does allow me to perform better even though it only looks so-so.

When my friends' lives are on the line I do care, and I will do my best... I'm just still not very good at it. ^^;

IMO:

Hardcore:

Plays with progression and efficiency as priority.


Casual:

Plays with fun as priority.



Some days I'm hardcore, some days I'm casual.

Most days I'm hardcore so I classify myself as such.

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

IMO:

Hardcore:

Plays with progression and efficiency as priority.


Casual:

Plays with fun as priority.



Some days I'm hardcore, some days I'm casual.

Most days I'm hardcore so I classify myself as such.

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This pretty much covers it.

Thanks everyone for the quick answers.

Much of the discussion I see about Hard Core vs. Casual seems to focus mainly on how much time a person has -- often stating things like 30 minutes after work every few days, versus hours and hours every day.

But I can now confidently say that I am "casual". ^^

... of course, that doesn't mean I am against Hard Core content.

lol what about me archer lancer carpenter 50 goldsmith 42 most others at 20 play everyday got all dungeon gear played since CE release

i'd say doctor mog said it bout right, i'd like to add that you can be great at mmo and get threw things quick and need less time to play, or you can have the time to get threw your suckyness.... but u can't suck and not have time to play :)

Definition Varys but this is how I define it

Casual Player: A player playing mainly for fun. They put most RL activities above the game. They have a limited playtime usually below 20hrs a week. (So combination of Time they are playing and mentality of the player)

Hardcore Player: A player who is serious about maximizing themselves and the group. They put many RL activites on the backburner and put a ton of time into the game to be the best(Example in XI waking up at 3am to camp fafnir, camping Tiamat for 24-72hrs to get claim, not going out with friends to make a scheduled Raid). They play alot sometimes upwards of 6-10hrs per day.

I do not think there is a direct definition. You can play 60hrs a week but not be serious about the game... I would not consider you hardcore in that case. You can wake up at all hours of the night to do something, skip RL things but have a semi limited play time... So hardcore mentality but more of a casual playtime.

It's mostly about time played, because casual generally tends to cater to the people who play 2 maybe 3 days a week and no more than 2-3 hours at a time. There are details and other things that elaborate into this and many people have mentioned it. I consider someone a hardcore player in an MMO if they play 4-5 days a week and for 4+ hours at a time. Doesn't matter if they are playing for fun or progression, you are playing and accomplishing something whether it is leveling all classes or crafting. Also if you been playing since release and didn't take a 2-3 month break like a lot of people did you probably can safely say you are in the hardcore bracket.

Really there is casual and then there is 2 levels of hardcore. Hardcore players who spend a lot of time because they have all the time in the world to play games (being a housewife like you said has it's perks or being jobless or whatever else reasons there are) and then the hardcore gamers on MMOs who really most may consider to the be "Elitists" of the MMOs. They are hardcore at everything they do and like many have said play for progression and other things.

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Originally Posted by Xatsh

Definition Varys but this is how I define it

Casual Player: A player playing mainly for fun. They put most RL activities above the game. They have a limited playtime usually below 20hrs a week. (So combination of Time they are playing and mentality of the player)

Hardcore Player: A player who is serious about maximizing themselves and the group. They put many RL activites on the backburner and put a ton of time into the game to be the best(Example in XI waking up at 3am to camp fafnir, camping Tiamat for 24-72hrs to get claim, not going out with friends to make a scheduled Raid). They play alot sometimes upwards of 6-10hrs per day.

I do not think there is a direct definition. You can play 60hrs a week but not be serious about the game... I would not consider you hardcore in that case. You can wake up at all hours of the night to do something, skip RL things but have a semi limited play time... So hardcore mentality but more of a casual playtime.

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you can't say that hardcore = 60hours a week you can play 4hours and get a lot done that the point of being a hardcore lol finding a smart way of doing thing and also saying that they don't put life first somewhat seem wrong but i guess i can agree for some hardcore gamers

What DoctorMog said.

I like challenging content, but only if I can play it casually. For instance, taking my friends into a raid on the classes they enjoy playing, instead of sticking to the efficiency guidelines which might dictate Alice switching to CON and leaving Bob out altogether.

What do you call the person who wants does both? :O

In a normal MMO, the differences between hardcore and casual could be thought of like this:

The number of hours played isn't generally an indicating factor. I played just as much FFXI when I was casual as I did when I became hardcore.

Casual players generally concentrate on making the most out of their playtime, whether it be an hour a day or 18 hours a day. They don't go to great personal inconvenience to obtain prized items or fight difficult monsters for themselves or others. They are also more likely to leave pickup groups at a moment's notice to attend to real life situations, without giving notice. The thought might not occur to them when they leave that they're inconveniencing a number of other players.

Hardcore players set goals for themselves to accomplish. They want specific items to complete a "gear build", or trophy items from difficult monsters. They work in a team to complete tasks as efficiently as possible. Their aim is to obtain those sought after items for themselves and their friends (guild mates, linkshell mates, what have you), and they're willing to play for many hours consecutively for that purpose. They pride themselves on their gear and personal skill, going to great lengths to learn the mechanics of the game and how to better perform their expected role.

In FFXIV however, there's no difference. Everyone is a casual beta player. There's no competition, no sought after items and barely any challenge. This will change eventually, but for now you just have a few "hardcasuals" running around pretending they're better than the horde of other casual players.

Hope that clears it up! :)

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Originally Posted by Chocobits

They are also more likely to leave pickup groups at a moment's notice to attend to real life situations, without giving notice. The thought might not occur to them when they leave that they're inconveniencing a number of other players.

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I disagree with that part. Having a disregard for your teammates is not a defining trait of a casual player. It's a defining trait of a selfish bastard. Doesn't mean casuals can't also be bastards, just that it's not a part of their definition :)

I would consider myself a casual player... I may play alot, (several hours a day) but not toward a specific goal... more so to have fun. My sis and I are on everyday, but not to play in groups, but to explore. We get our crafting up and slowly lvl our characters or just exploring the world. I want to reach lvl 50, but to me it's ok if I take my time to do it. I know would be easy for a player to come on and surpass the lvl I've acheived on several diffent of the battle class jobs or even grinding at crafting, just becaause they are more driven to lvl. I would consider that a way to tell if they are hardcore. so I would call myself a casual player or a hardcore slacker.... either way.

Casual and hardcore imo don't depend on game time, they depend on what you have done and how seriously you take the game. When a semester starts up i'm like "eff FFXIV" and maybe log on so people know I still will play eventually but school is more interesting sadly. But when summer comes I can log on at 2-3pm and stay on till 4am and keep doing that day after day. So the play time isn't really an issue its the seriousness, I know people who have logged everyday for a period of 2-3 months and remained level 30 and I had no clue how.

I'm a casual player.
Most of the times I play for 2-3 hours a day, and 5-6 hours in the weekend, and I like to enjoy content without any care about ranking/leveling up.

I too agree with Mog. However, I will coin you the term Hardcasual. :)


I personally am Hardcore most of the time.

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Originally Posted by Naqaj

I disagree with that part. Having a disregard for your teammates is not a defining trait of a casual player. It's a defining trait of a selfish bastard. Doesn't mean casuals can't also be bastards, just that it's not a part of their definition :)

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As a casual player I've always given notice to my group that I had to leave at least 40 mins prior. That's just common courtesy, we might leave earlier then everyone else but you have to be nice about it. In XI the understanding was that you had to find a replacement before you left or informed the leader ahead of time so they could.

Casual: Spends less time with less effort on a game.

Core: Spends a lot of time with more effort.

Neither gain more or less fun than the other. It just depends on time and taste.

Hardcore is poop socking while waiting four hours for an open world NM to spawn only to lose it to a (or another) LS' claim bot.

I don't see what everyone's in a huff about, I love hardcore porn and casual dating.

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as well as does their best for the team.

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LOL... /remembers HNM LS drama, people stealing items, breaking shells, robbing LS "banks"... creating linkshells just to get a kclub then never logging on again once it drops... MPKing for sky items.... Letting friends outside of Dynamis LS inside to lot everything.

Yea the teamwork of hardcore players in XI was fascinating. Not selfish at all.

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Originally Posted by Sigtyr

Hardcore is poop socking

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Originally Posted by Belial

I love hardcore porn

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I hope I just made everyone sick.

there meaningless labels. a gamer is a gamer is a gamer

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Originally Posted by Eekiki

I hope I just made everyone sick.

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Not everyone. A few people likely pitched a tent.

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Originally Posted by Chocobits

Casual players generally concentrate on making the most out of their playtime, whether it be an hour a day or 18 hours a day. They don't go to great personal inconvenience to obtain prized items or fight difficult monsters for themselves or others. They are also more likely to leave pickup groups at a moment's notice to attend to real life situations, without giving notice. The thought might not occur to them when they leave that they're inconveniencing a number of other players.

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I know you're not saying all casuals are like this, but let's be real: casuals aren't the only players that do this. I've seen "hardcore" people leave without notice because they weren't happy with the experience they were getting in a party, a wipe, or "someone in their linkshell needs their help and they gotta go." You seem like a reasonable person, so I doubt you meant any malice anyway, but after reading your section on casuals, it just left a bitter taste in my mouth.

Inconsideration isn't a "casual" thing; it's an inconsiderate thing done by inconsiderate people.

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Originally Posted by Stockapotapoulos

I know you're not saying all casuals are like this, but let's be real: casuals aren't the only players that do this. I've seen "hardcore" people leave without notice because they weren't happy with the experience they were getting in a party, a wipe, or "someone in their linkshell needs their help and they gotta go." You seem like a reasonable person, so I doubt you meant any malice anyway, but after reading your section on casuals, it just left a bitter taste in my mouth.

Inconsideration isn't a "casual" thing; it's an inconsiderate thing done by inconsiderate people.

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That could have been bias speaking. I've seen, and even been one of those elitists that've left poorly formed groups. Once you start setting goals and guidelines for your character's development, inefficient groupings tend to make you actually FEEL yourself aging.

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Originally Posted by Chocobits

That could have been bias speaking. I've seen, and even been one of those elitists that've left poorly formed groups. Once you start setting goals and guidelines for your character's development, inefficient groupings tend to make you actually FEEL yourself aging.

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I understand, man. It's like playing basketball with your friends who are know their stuff. You play with them so much, you almost expect the offense to be smooth and automatic, and you expect your teammates to know their role and assignments on defense, even if you're playing without your team. And then, you play in a pickup game with bunch of random people where there is no communication, no teamwork, and you're losing by 26. Frustrating, it is, 'cause you're so used to good play.

So yeah, I totally understand where you're coming from. I'd be a liar if I said I didn't. But like with everything in (FFXIV) life, there are good pickup teams; there are bad pickup teams. There are great high level team players who know their stuff; there are high-level team players who are an absolute nightmare to play with. You see where I'm going with this.

To cap it off, I don't think it's reasonable to expect everyone to be an elite player, but I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect everyone to be a capable player. Listen, I like elite skills. I respect elite players. I would love to have someone like that on my team. But if there is someone who has decent, Plain Jane, but updated equipment that knows how to play their role well in a team, I would take Plain Jane ten times out of ten. No question.

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Originally Posted by Jinrya-Geki

What do you call the person who wants does both? :O

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Bi-coreous.

Casual to me means being on call to attend to my baby.
Instant she wakes up and cries, AFK.

If I may be so bold, according to the Bartle Test, those who are obsessed with obtaining elite status are considered Achiever Archetypes, not hardcore. So if you apply the title "hardcore" to the other Bartle 3 archetypes you will find you can be considered hardcore in this game, even if you aren't an achiever.

I think that anyone who becomes so involved with a game that it becomes a part of their daily life, that they have developed an emotional attachment to it can be considered hardcore, even if you aren't an achiever archetype.

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Originally Posted by Reaujien

Bi-coreous.

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I see what you did there.

It's been really interesting reading through everyone's thoughts on this topic.

I kind of like yukaru's term "hardcore slacker". That might describe me quite well! ^^

Last night -- A typical evening:

- One of my LS's made 2 speed run attempts on Dzemael -- 31 minutes to clear the first one, and then we wiped on Batraal at 23 minutes the second time after I got hit by the laser. ><
Pretty exciting stuff, requiring coordination and teamwork.

- And after that I returned to Ul'dah and just sat there for 2 hours chatting with friends.

Ah, I love my time in Eorzea. ^^

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Originally Posted by Reaujien

Bi-coreous.

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lol too shay sir!!

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Originally Posted by Mikita

I might get called a troll for this... but I do mean it as an honest question since FFXIV is my first and only online game.


What is Hard Core? What is Casual?

Is the defining point between Hard Core and Casual simply a matter of how much time a person can spend playing the game?

Or does it also have something to do with mindset and goals? i.e. the reason why we play?

-------------

Am I Hard Core? Or am I Casual? I honestly don't know.

- I've been playing for hours on end almost every single day since October (being a housewife has its perks!) because I really have a lot of fun in Eorzea.

- Yet, after all this time, I only have 1 class at R50 because I only do battle when my friends are logged in; and many times we don't even do that -- We often just sit around talking for hours.

- I don't really care about having the best equipment and have pretty much worn the same outfit since November because I like how it looks, even though some of the pieces do not even favor my main classes (I am aware of the consequences).

- I'm not a skillful player, nor is it really my goal to become so. But I really enjoy Dzemael because it requires teamwork, and I do have to play at the best of my meager ability in order to keep myself and my friends alive.


What am I? ^^;

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nothing is harcore or casual, it is a fake mind set for narcissistic individuals to judge people because they are regressed in real life and can only label people behind a computer screen and being elitist is in their heads, while they are no bodies in real life.

It is in their heads (elitists).