Make a man out of me(overcoming my fear of tanking)...

I won't mince words: I am legitimately afraid of tanking. It seems like a lot of work and responsibility, but it also looks like a lot of fun. I haven't played a tank job in an MMO since FFXI, which is a completely different animal, the experience of which I doubt transfers much, if at all, to FFXIV. It was an enjoyable experience being the human shield to a group of people, but I soon got on the damage dealing train and never looked back. Secretly, though, I've always missed tanking.

After I heard Dark Knight was being released, I thought this a great opportunity to give tanking another try. So I've decided to level MRD/WAR for practice. Unfortunately, I am overcome with the feeling of dread at the prospect of essentially being the "leader" of the group. That's just not who I am... (Continued in next post because of absurd character limit)

As far as MMOs go, I am more of a casual player. I save the Expert settings for solo games. In FFXIV, I haven't done anything beyond Hard modes and Crystal Tower, pretty standard stuff. I just don't have the patience and motivation to bank victories on the possibility that eight people(myself included) have the coordination and reflexes to perform at 100% in Extremes and Coil. That's too many variables for me. I have a much more laid back attitude when it comes to MMOs, which got me thinking: maybe certain people just aren't cut out for tanking.

If I did tank, I wouldn't plan on doing any of the more intense content, but still, being in charge, setting the pace of the party, and seeing each encounter and dungeon with new eyes that require a more intimate knowledge of mechanics, it's daunting to me. So my question to you good people is: does it sound like I should just avoid tanking, or is there something I can do to break free of my phobia?

First step to overcoming any fear is to confront it.

Tanking, especially in 4 man dungeons, isn't as much responsibility in this game as in most.

Your job is to:

1.) Keep hate on all the things that everyone is hitting.
2.) Face all those things away from everyone else and keep them as still as you can.
3.) Pop CDs and pray that your healer doesn't let you die.

If you can do the above 3, then you're golden for any dungeon in the game. Raiding is another beast altogether, but since you're not interested in that I'll just say that everything you learn from tanking 4mans does transfer over well to raiding but with some extra difficulty spice thrown in.

I understand where you're coming from. I was 'afraid' of tanking for a bit because it seems like you need to know a lot more. I suppose you do, but simply telling people you've never tanked whatever dungeon you're in before let's everyone know what's going on and you can just go at whatever pace you're comfortable with. Usually there's not much more to know. If you paid any attention at all while DPSing a dungeon then you already know most of what's going on. There might be some times when you're hit with a debuff or something that you never noticed, but you pretty much deal with it or the healer removes it anyway.

It's really pretty fun, especially since you can spend more time playing and less time waiting around for DF to let you in. Rotations are simple, if you're having trouble keeping hate on a group as MRD/WAR you can simply easy button overpower spam if you get frustrated. It tends to work, and if it doesn't then there was no hope of tanking it anyway (seriously should only ever happen if you have a BLM triple flare a group immediately). Once you get used to it, it's a lot of going through the motions and watching the emnity box to make sure it's all red. Really not much more stressful than any melee DPS unless you're trying to push a healer harder than they can/ want to go.

The advantage of tanking is that you can set the pace of the encounter, so really just keep doing expert dungeons and 'knowledge' of the overall role just comes naturally.

Do you know how to hold hate and mitigate damage? If yes than the only things you have to worry about are individual mechanics for each instance which just takes a little research and practice, which everyone no matter the role has to do in most scenarios anyway.

Well, if you are a level 50 monk, you should have no problem tanking. The first job you level is the most difficult. You already know all the dungeons, and a melée DPS is the most similar to a tank, you are there close to the mobs.

I would just start leveling a tank class. The low levels are easy, you know what a tank should do, unlike a completely new player who has the solo experience or early quests that is totally different to the party experience. You will get used to a different point of view, taking care of what is happening and what is going to happen, looking a lot to the enemy list and making sure you don't lose aggro, etc. Bit by bit dungeons get a bit more difficult and you get practice and learn. With your experience it should be easy.

Of course when you know well a place as a tank everything is so much easier compared to the first times, but with practice all places end being familiar and you will be more relaxed. You cannot go as a tank to a dungeon without knowing anything about it as you find DPS who enter and say they are new to the place, have seen no guides, etc. You play with other people that deserve you make the effort to prepare yourself. Since you are already level 50 Monk, you know the places, just not from the tank point of view.

I wouldn't worry too much and just start to tank. Be prepared to making some mistakes, and to finding people that blame you even if it's their own fault. Most people are nice, but you will find a small minority of not so nice people, as you will also have found them already (some of them, tanks.) Try to learn from your mistakes and accept you may have made a mistake, listen to what people say (they may be rude but have some part of truth, or not) and try to get better, but don't feel too bad, the best players weren't that good the first day.

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Originally Posted by Quadraphenic

that require a more intimate knowledge of mechanics, it's daunting to me.

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Fear does not exist in this dojo, does it? As a leader if you don't believe in yourself, who will?

just go through the low level dungeons upto bray a few times each, nothing you cant learn in them that doesnt apply to every other dungeon in the game as far as actual base tanking goes,

don't be afraid of trying new things and if your unsure how to handle a certain dungeon in regards to pulls just roll dps and watch the tank you get, of course gear on a tank is very important in being able to do some pulls and maintain threat but not as much as skill, and that comes from practice so nothing you can not learn.

from what you said about raids and ex primals its probs best if you just stay a dungeon tank until your comfortable with it then move on,

ive only done some low raids and a few ex primals myself although i tank st and wod all the time, mainly I raid as blm though but i tank dungeons all day long, they don't take long to learn and after a few runs you can look more at combining pulls to speed things up if that's what you want to do.

its a roll that has to be learnt, and unlike dps you don't have a back up tank in a 4 man but seriously just keep rolling tank and don't be afraid to make mistakes as youll learn more that way.

Honestly, you already have the tough part down - you know how the encounters work. Now you just have to apply that to a different role. Just think of the things you like to see a tank do. Hold things still, face them away from the group, and keep hate. Use your defensive cooldowns when they're needed (otherwise your healers will hate you). There's not much else to it really. A lot of the difficulty that goes with the role is just perception. Just take it in stride. If you wipe, you wipe. You dust yourself off and try again. It's actually really fun once you get to 50 and get geared enough that you can pull half a dungeon and watch the DPS light it up as you weather the storm.

Just let people know you're new to tanking an encounter and they're usually willing to work with you. You may get a more experienced tank playing on a different role that can offer you some pointers for the dungeon. If you happen to get someone that bails, you probably didn't want to deal with their crap anyway.

Once you get to 50 (and get enough gear where applicable), try some of the easier 8 man content like Castrum, Praetorium, LotA, and hard mode primals. Let people know you're new to tanking and usually the other tank will take the lead (unless they're new too, in which case you're in for some fun :3) so just watch them. Run dungeons on your monk as well and pay attention to how the tank handles different situations.

It takes some time to ease into the role, but it won't be as hard since you already know how the game works. :3

I'll tell you I'm a terrible tank but I love to do it! Just in the last few days I've gotten to a point where I can solo tank shiva and Titan (although dps has to be decent to solo Titan) and now that Ive accomplished that I'll be working on coil, you'll get the ones that'll lol at you just laugh it off and keep going you'll get it. As far as primal a go always be ready to solo tank it that's the best advice I can give about that.

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Originally Posted by Dioptase

I'll tell you I'm a terrible tank but I love to do it! Just in the last few days I've gotten to a point where I can solo tank shiva and Titan (although dps has to be decent to solo Titan) and now that Ive accomplished that I'll be working on coil, you'll get the ones that'll lol at you just laugh it off and keep going you'll get it. As far as primal a go always be ready to solo tank it that's the best advice I can give about that.

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Probably not the best advice I've ever seen for someone who's trying to be eased into tanking.
You should NOT always be prepared to solo tank ex primals especially if you're new.
Solo tanking, especially titan and Shiva, is something you shouldn't think about doing until your gear and knowledge of the fight are to where you know where all the hard hitting abilities are and can mitigate them

Solo tanking is fine but definitely just do normal 2 tank runs until you're very very comfortable with the fight, and the same needs to be said for the healers.

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Originally Posted by Dioptase

I'll tell you I'm a terrible tank but I love to do it! Just in the last few days I've gotten to a point where I can solo tank shiva and Titan (although dps has to be decent to solo Titan) and now that Ive accomplished that I'll be working on coil, you'll get the ones that'll lol at you just laugh it off and keep going you'll get it. As far as primal a go always be ready to solo tank it that's the best advice I can give about that.

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Eh. I wouldn't advise an inexperienced tank that's insecure about his tanking ability that he needs to know how to fly solo. OP is still low level so first and foremost, he needs to learn how to tank and get more confident with his skills. There's plenty of time later to learn how to solo tank eight man content. Some people never get comfortable with it. Unlike most dungeon encounters which are generally salvageable if the tank dies, things like EX primals and Coil are very likely to fall apart in a matter of seconds if a solo tank goes down.

Basically, don't scare the poor dude; he already says he's afraid of tanking. xD

Yeah, solo tanking is only for when you're geared + experienced. Tanking @ 50 is very much about knowing the rotation of the fight and when big hits are coming - this is mitigated a bit by having 2 tanks share that responsibility. It is good to expect the worst, but don't expect to clear unless you know the fight you're doing like the back of your hand.

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Originally Posted by Eye_Gore

Fear does not exist in this dojo, does it? As a leader if you don't believe in yourself, who will?

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You sure know how to hit the nail on the head.

This turn out of helpful advice was truly unprecedented. I was not expecting so many responses and especially not for each one to be insightful. Thanks to everyone for the wise words. It is reassuring when reminded that I have run these dungeons numerous times on Monk. I guess much of my problem is just anxiety and lack of confidence. It's just that when your life has been the rear 180 degrees of the mob the entire game, switching to the front somehow feels like a completely different world. You fine people have taken some of the stigma off of it. Many thanks.

also, put all 30 of your bonus points into str
wear armor meant for gla pld med war, and use str or vit accessories, but prefer str

war is big on self heals
and more damage is more aggro and bigger self heals

Yeeeah, no. I would wait on using strength gear until you are absolutely comfortable with tanking. For now while your practicing, I would recommend full vit then swap slowly to strength once you have a good handle on all your tools. Strength tanking is for skilled players, not someone learning the ropes.

You can always use a mix of STR/VIT accessories, but points should definitely go into STR. Leveling up it doesn't really matter which accessories you use as long as you use accessories. If you find yourself dying a lot, swapping STR accessories for VIT ones will usually solve that problem.

If you are legitimately afraid of tanking, it means that you care about doing a good job, IMO. That idea alone puts you ahead of 75% of the pack.

Just practice, work hard, research your job, and work harder. Queue up for dungeons over and over and over. Be receptive to criticism, ignore insults, and learn from failure.

If you are worried about going into dungeons or encounters blind, do your homework and watch guides, but keep in mind that nothing beats hands on experience.

Also, learn to be a good OT. Generally speaking, OTing properly is the more difficult role when compared to MT.

As a new tank, I would not recommend that you go with STR Accessories or bonus points. Start out at 50 focusing on beefing up your sturdiness, then start messing around with STR. The only exception to that would be if you can afford Penta'd 110 accessories.

Learn to take damage and learn the when's and why's of cooldowns. Know how to tank, then worry about dishing out more damage. You have plenty of time to learn about hostile/offensive tanking after you master the primary functions of the job.

If you are going to stick to warrior, definitely learn how to U.B.I.R. by 50 8)

Tanking can be a major pain in the balls at times, but it really is a satisfying role in the long run. Good luck bubba and crack some skulls!

I'm also very new to tanking after a lifetime of DPS and healing in MMOs~ I feared it too, all the responsibility and that. But after going through a few runs you do tend to build up your confidence. Even when I thought I had done a terrible job, at the end I got a couple of "GJ Tank"s because no one died and I held aggro.
That's really all you have to worry about. Don't fear taking the hits. Keep a calm head and take note of what's happening around you. And yes, learn about the encounters beforehand if possible ^^

edit: tanking also let me see the front of boss models so I was like oohhh so that's what they look like lol

I would swear at you and make you feel like slitting your wrists but that is not allowed on the forums. Unfortunately this comes with the territory of tanking as you will need to develop a thick skin. I'm a seasoned tank, war since day 1 of ARR and even though I know exactly what I am doing and doing it right there will always be people who will always try to make me feel bad for no reason or just being nit-picky, be it elitists, trolls or people just out to get you. Though I know how to hold my own in an argument against my class so its no biggie for me so if you start an argument with me know that you will most likely make yourself look bad. This is especially worse during "expected" speed runs when the dps out gear you and start pulling left and right to force you to grab all mobs than you are comfortable with.

My advice:

1. If you are keeping hate away from party and staying alive with proper cds then you are right.
2. Be comfortable with the amount of mobs you can handle but slowly experiment with grabbing more when you feel you can trust your healer and your skills.
3. Always use Provoke followed by a weapon skill right after to secure hate i.e Provoke > Shield Lob/Tomahawk
4. Probably the most important, Don't let what others say get to you and know that if it wasn't for you tanking they would still be sitting in queue.

Coming from a BLM main myself, I can assure you that tanking wasn't as hard as you think. Lately I've even been doing alot of speed running dungeons with little trouble. I have even experience tanking primal exes and they weren't as hard as I thought it was before, just need to watch the debuff status on other tank, and get ready to switch tanking in-between.

atm, I just had my Excalibur yesterday, though the reason I'm working this is to facilitate myself for dungeon farm most of times since tank queue are definitely faster than dps. lol

I'm even afraid of forgetting my old main jobs since I've been doing this quite alot lately too. lol

Anyways, like what previous post says, doing low level dungeons definitely the best way for you to familiarize basic tanking. Once you have access to Shield Oath for PLD or Defiance for WAR, then you can start learn to tank group of mobs seriously, and later on, large group of mob for speed running purposes.

Both PLD & WAR have their own strength and weaknesses, and I suggest you try both. WAR/MRD are IMO best way to experience basic tanking since it's aggro management are much easier to handle, with the downside of that job having top receive bigger damage from mobs, which is why this job having the biggest HP pool.

PLD/GLA on the other hand, are slightly more suited for solo mob tanking, like bosses. This job does need few extra effort for doing group tanking, but not as weak as WAR does, since I've been doing this job more than WAR actually. And PLD has lower HP pool than WAR, but have the greatest defense stat.

And so, again I suggest OP to try both jobs, and see if tanking felt more enjoyable. Good luck and have fun! ^^

Just to chime in with my 2 cents.

I was like you at start. Slightly scared to tank heavier content. Thing is you just need to overcome it and take the plunge. It might go smooth, it might go bad, most importantly just do your best and have fun.

All it takes is some practice. At a certain point you are not afraid of tanking anything anymore. Just rotate your Defensive Cooldowns, pop an extra one when taking much damage (Healers will love you for this one), dodge AOE and get the bosses and adds in correct positions (Facing away from group etc.).

Also in regards to the Extreme modes: Do them! They are mainly about knowing the mechanics and you'll have to practice them multiple times to get it right (Do it with your FC so people don't freak out when something doesn't go according to plan). Some Extreme modes are ridiculously easy. Others are hell on earth. It's fun trying to overcome the challenges together :)

Take a few FC members with you on runs that you trust. When tanking in the beginning I always ran with a Healer friend of mine from the FC. I trusted him to keep me up, he trusted me to keep him safe. If you fail? Have a laugh about it and try again! If you do not try you will not succeed ;)

I leveled a paladin just so I could have a DoW to wear some gear/free up armory chest space (mained scholar.. I'm weird). I was pretty nervous at first, but pretty much all the parties I got in low roulette were newcomers that didn't mind taking it slow/feeling things out. Once I got to 50, I stopped tanking but geared it up with sold (had to spend it on something!).. until I got to the zodiac relic stage and healer queues sucked. I just let everyone know I was new to tanking so would be taking it easy and started slow. All you can do is have patience for yourself and try to have fun! I haven't had anyone get abusive over wipes yet (even one wipe, everyone blamed themselves.. funny run), and though there have been a few silent quits, I still kept with it.Good luck!

I've been levelling gladiator myself recently, never really tanked in MMOs before and it's pretty intimidating initially, but a lot of it is down to getting over the initial fear and just doing it. For the most part people are fairly relaxed - DPS are just happy to get in after queuing for half an hour, and healers have a fairly easy ride in low-level dungeons as long as the tank isn't woefully undergeared.

I've also only levelled to 50 as melee DPS, so for me a lot of it is basically the same only standing on the opposite side of the mobs. Being worried about not sucking is good because it means you actually care about your performance, but the flipside of it is that you have to be slightly indifferent about people giving you a hard time - ultimately, as the tank you're the one who controls the pace of the run, and if DPS are giving you crap for pulling too slowly, they can just go to hell and have fun queueing another half an hour for a replacement.

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Originally Posted by Quadraphenic

If I did tank, I wouldn't plan on doing any of the more intense content, but still, being in charge, setting the pace of the party, and seeing each encounter and dungeon with new eyes that require a more intimate knowledge of mechanics, it's daunting to me. So my question to you good people is:

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Always do what you are afraid to do.
Ralph Waldo Emerson

To do list:

1.Get mar/War as job
2.Spam overpower
3.Face the girls away from party so they wont see whats coming
4.GG #REKT

OH OH i almost forget and shout + write YOLOOO before u engage.
Welcome to the Tank Caravan my friend

In my experience the most frustrating part of tanking is people. If you're anxious about tanking, it's probably based on a fear of someone on your party calling you out when you make a mistake. Some players are like that, and those players will not hesitate to let you know you suck. (It's happened to me.)

Try to take advice as it's given and ignore the people who are just anonymous duty finder jerks. Remember that most DPS had to wait on you, so if a group is giving you a hard time because you're not speed running the dungeon, bail and queue again when you're able. There's no reason not to punish people for being rude, especially when they're picking on you because you're inexperienced. Your best bet of avoiding this until you build up your confidence is to get with some friends in your FC or whatever, rather than deal with random folks with no patience.

Also you may want to do Gladiator first. Flash, Convalescence and most importantly, Provoke make tanking a breeze.

Really love the positivity and the support in this thread. I can't add too much that hasn't already been said. Just take your time and learn a style that fits you best. Be the tank you want to be, not what others expect you to be. Wish you the best of luck, and listen to these folks. Most of them know their stuff!

Remember this, as the tank you are always right. You dictate the fight.

The healer's job is to keep you alive, obviously pull within his ability.
The dps's job is to kill stuff in the right order.

Your job is to be the man.

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Originally Posted by zatoseyes

In my experience the most frustrating part of tanking is people. If you're anxious about tanking, it's probably based on a fear of someone on your party calling you out when you make a mistake. Some players are like that, and those players will not hesitate to let you know you suck. (It's happened to me.)

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This is why i have fear to tank.
You dont fight versus mobs you fight versus your group.
But i tried all classes now and in order of fun for me its tank>dps>heal.
I like the feeling to control the enemies and to handle the hate over the dps.
But every time i queue for a dungeon my fear is to much ._.

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Originally Posted by zatoseyes

snip

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You forgot these faces we both have. It did kinda boast my confidence on my end if there's any form of trolling towards me. XD

You´re afraid of screwing up, since as a Tank you´re the Leader of the Group, sort of. Thats a good thing, because it is a Sign that you´re serious about the Job. And that is what makes a good Tank, cause they are the ones who show the highest Attention during any Dungeon run.

Most things you have to know was already said, but here is another Tip (which is mainly for Lvl 50 Stuff in DF) : Check the Gear and Classes/Jobs of you´re Party before you pull anything. Group Composition (and apparent Skill-Level of the Group, most of the Time you can guess what the Grp is capable of during the first Pull) is crucial to know for every Tank, because that decides how you have to Tank a particular Dungeon/Trial/etc. With more experience running Dungeons, you´re gonna see that at first Glance.

And rest assured, most of the Time, Tanks have the easiest Job, since they have to deal with less Mechanics than DD´s or Healers.

And of course, have Fun :cool:

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Originally Posted by Quadraphenic

I won't mince words: I am legitimately afraid of tanking. It seems like a lot of work and responsibility

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it's not

don't be

just use the right abilities at the right time. i don't look up fights. i just go with the flow and it's like whatever.

i have done world of darkness a few times and someone whined at me last night because i wasn't picking up adds. i mean, there was another tank. but i also didn't know that there were adds.

it's just something i have never had to deal with. and it's not like anyone bothered to call it out.

but i ain't even sweatin it. they was pissed off, their group was performing badly, and i didn't want to be there anyway. they the kind of people who spend more time whining than they do bossing and try to pass it off as #winning. they ain't even on my level.

so #1

never let a punk ruin your game experience. they are just lashing out at you because being good at something at a level that isn't even competitive is the only thing that they are good at.

#2 work with your party

observe your party, inspect it. respect it's limits. sometimes i pull big pulls if there is a geared healer. if we wipe, i pull less. if you have any disappointments to express, just keep them to yourself. people don't like criticism.

in 8 years of playing mmos the only players i have ever been able to extend advice to are players in a close knit group. pretty much every one else has rejected it or become offended when i have offered advice.

so if you have a wrench with a crappy grip on it, don't try to fix it. just leave it how it is. it likes it's crappy grip.

just try to work with what you have and try to make it work.

#3 Utilize Situational Awareness

Aggro management is largely made a trivial task by awareness of your DPS' capability and awareness of what they are attacking. at lower lvls some classes can be really ridiculous with their threat output but dont even worry about it. just try hard to do your job right every time you're in and it'll be cool

and if it's not, then you just be cool, because who wanna play with people who aren't cool anyway? s'like nigga i play the game to beat up dragons every week and collect blue gear not listen to a bunch of complaining lmao

there is really nothing to be scared of. its the kind of thing you do a few times, mess up, and just realize it.

Things you have to know about tanking:

1. If it's your first time in a certain Dungeon/Raid, always tell it to your party and ask them to guide you. They'll understand - it worked perfectly for myself;
2. Spam Flash if needed - don't worry about missing some DPS;
3. If you're low geared and join in some Dungeon/Raid where there are people 'overgeared', they will the aggro from you - don't panic (I suffered on this);
4. There'll be mechanics where Tank Swap is needed - be careful on this;
5. Always keep Sword of Oath - except if in a Raid, because probably there'll a better geared tank lol.