Urth's Fount aka Odin

Why is this a two tank run?
It is easily done with one tank if there is one competent healer in the group.
Besides the extra DPS would be nice for burning him down faster.

Because everything other than ST and WoD is. Do a preformed if you'd prefer one tank.

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Originally Posted by Majires

Why is this a two tank run?
It is easily done with one tank if there is one competent healer in the group.
Besides the extra DPS would be nice for burning him down faster.

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Because SE expects one of the tanks to be a noob and thus die resulting in the other tank having to tank in their place. I give them points for thinking ahead on that. ;p

You could ask the same about all of the duty-finder available coil. The answer: requires competent healers. (and tanks)

Because I had a tank with a dex ring. With two tanks, you have a better chance of one at least being skilled enough to tie his own shoelaces.

^ pretty much that. I had a tank with all dex acc too lol.

This fight seems very hard using DF. Anyone have luck with DF yet?

Can't comment on DF. My group went here after t13 and killed it first attempt -- even with several people who had never even tried the fight before.

I can see how it would be hard for DF: Gear makes a difference, comfort with each other & voice chat matters, and after FCoB this is way easier.

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

This fight seems very hard using DF. Anyone have luck with DF yet?

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It took a few attempts but I did it through duty finder

People who just quit early after one or two attempts at Odin are just a bunch of quitters. Seriously.

It's unfortunate that they have a quest for the event, and that quest requires you to use duty finder. A duty finder that doesn't allow you to substitute a useless 2nd tank for another healer. As it is the fight is pretty unplayable for healers in Item lvl 110 gear, you just cant keep up with the damage that is being tossed...or you can but you then run out of mana. Having a 3rd healer would make this fight more playable. I'm hoping the fight gets nerfed in the future, otherwise it will be one of the few things I just don't do in the game.

One shot duty finder on day 1. I guess I got lucky lol. Honestly it's not that hard just a lot of dodging aoe healing and dps.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Because SE expects one of the tanks to be a noob and thus die resulting in the other tank having to tank in their place. I give them points for thinking ahead on that. ;p

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And it will happen, too. I was in a single-tank Odin run the other day... tank died, so guess who got to tank.

At least I learned that I have enough HP to survive a Sanngetall to the face.

The mechanics of the fight are extremely simple - it's just that this fight is one big DPS check. If your DPS is high, then you will have a good time. If it isn't (which tends to be the case in DF due to the quality of players), then you are going to have a bad time (healers will run out of MP aoe healing + wipe to Zantetsuken if you somehow get there with low DPS).

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Originally Posted by Majires

Why is this a two tank run?
It is easily done with one tank if there is one competent healer in the group.
Besides the extra DPS would be nice for burning him down faster.

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Because SE doesn't expect EVERYONE to speedrun EVERYTHING.

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Originally Posted by EZ5902

Because SE doesn't expect EVERYONE to speedrun EVERYTHING.

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It's not even about Speedrunning. It's about the fact that the fight is actually easier with one decent tank than having 1 tank + spare with low dps. There's not even adds for OT to pull, in fact, there's not even an OT, just a spare tire in the case that MT dies.

The difficulty(?) of Odin lies in it's dps checks, aside that it's just aoe dodging and nothing else. And generally a competent tank should be able to avoid a few aoes and pop a cooldown during the hard-hitting skills. Having two tanks actually make the dps check rigorous for df parties.

Of course, the deeper meaning on this is probably to give the party a chance even if one tank is crap as someone said lol.

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

This fight seems very hard using DF. Anyone have luck with DF yet?

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Yeah first try, no wipes. He didn't seem that difficult in my opinion.

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Originally Posted by Majires

Why is this a two tank run?

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Because the intended mechanic is to swap tanks during Sanngetall and top off the first tank while the second tank is holding threat instead of spamming heals for a single tank.

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Originally Posted by echoica

One shot duty finder on day 1. I guess I got lucky lol. Honestly it's not that hard just a lot of dodging aoe healing and dps.

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Day 1 everyone is trying to clear it so the quality of the people using duty finder is higher than typical. After that you get what you can get which isn't always up to snuff.

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Originally Posted by Twinbros

It's unfortunate that they have a quest for the event, and that quest requires you to use duty finder. A duty finder that doesn't allow you to substitute a useless 2nd tank for another healer. As it is the fight is pretty unplayable for healers in Item lvl 110 gear, you just cant keep up with the damage that is being tossed...or you can but you then run out of mana. Having a 3rd healer would make this fight more playable. I'm hoping the fight gets nerfed in the future, otherwise it will be one of the few things I just don't do in the game.

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I've tried healing multiple times and I can keep a tank alive and aoe some Succor and whatnot no problem. The issues come when the DPS isn't high enough to down the Gungnir spears fast enough and the bleed is still rolling on too long or they just are incapable of dodging the obscene number of AoE abilities that start going off at the same time. The unavoidable damage is easy to heal through. People eating 2 or more of the avoidable ones is just not acceptable, especially if it's the tank. I swear if you can't avoid the one aoe around him I'm spending way more MP than I should to keep you on your feet. Then there are the times where before a Sanngetall and during the cast I swiftcast stoneskin on the tank and get an Adloquium up and still watch that move drop the main tank from full health. The fight just seems weird at times.

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Originally Posted by Deculture

The mechanics of the fight are extremely simple - it's just that this fight is one big DPS check. If your DPS is high, then you will have a good time. If it isn't (which tends to be the case in DF due to the quality of players), then you are going to have a bad time (healers will run out of MP aoe healing + wipe to Zantetsuken if you somehow get there with low DPS).

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The required item level is 95 to enter that fight, and I'm just not seeing how a full group in ilvl 95 is going to pull that off in random duty finder. Even telling your party that you have ~6 minutes to deal max damage before he enrages and you can't marathon the fight doesn't spur anything or get more out of a player that either isn't geared to do the necessary damage or just can't deal the necessary damage.

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

This fight seems very hard using DF. Anyone have luck with DF yet?

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Just cleared it with a DF group, five of whom had never cleared before and one of whom was brand new. It was a very close call, but we managed it even with one DPS (the BLM) dead for a good chunk of the fight.

Tried it on Df in the first days of release and wiped, then cleared with second Df party.
Back with 7/8 of my team, cleared on the first try with my mates never entered it a single time.
So it's like people used to basic raid mechanic like tank buster mitigation, heals timing manapool managing, and high dps check are better on this fight, cuz it s natural for them.
Now why a 2-tanks design, i think because if one of them not used to timing mitigation or a bit "undergeared" will keep dying so u still got a chance the other is more comfortable with this kind of mechanics or geared well to clear the duty.
Having the War as Mt, Pally as Ot is golden on this fight imo.

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Originally Posted by FranSeara

This fight seems very hard using DF. Anyone have luck with DF yet?

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Did it first day in DF after 2 wipes. Just takes a bit of luck to get a half decent group with good DPS. The extra Tank is fine in DF if one Tank doesn't use their CD's correctly and gets mauled by Odin's version of table flip then having another Tank to take over is a good thing but you shouldn't need more than one specifically. I think they had PuG groups in mind when they designed it. You don't need the extra DPS either if your DPS are good with rotations and can stay alive but it's safer to have the extra DPS for quicker nuke.

Not many people I know have even completed it yet due to not only it's high DPS requirement but also how quickly people rage quit then leave after a single or couple wipes. The queue times have got very long for it since came out, I am typically waiting well over an hour to get back in to it (if) use DF. PF takes probably around same amount of time depending on server but haven't tried that yet and will try it later. The thing about this trial is it's on par with some of the extreme trials but is nowhere near as rewarding, it's drops are pure vanity and not useful, does not drop a mount unlike the open world version or cash shop type etc. ilvl50 gear...really Squeenix for a trial that has a DPS requirement higher than quite a few EX trials?

The dps requirement for Odin is a joke. The fight itself is a joke. Dodge shit on the ground, properly deal damage, healers don't forget to cast heals, and you win. It's the definition of a tank and spank - there are really no mechanics at all.

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Originally Posted by Twinbros

It's unfortunate that they have a quest for the event, and that quest requires you to use duty finder.

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Even in a pre-made group you still have to use duty finder to enter the fight. It counts, as it always has for any fight in the game, don't get caught up on the way they phrase this.

The title of the place in DF is misleading. I mean they didn't even bother to write a "(Hard)" or "(Extreme)" next to the title. The ilvl requirement are too low.

The last 25% is impossible with i95 DPS.

3 queues, all ended in failure after multiple wipes. You can dance the AoE perfectly and survive the whole fight without a death and have the last 25% wipe you.

Mistuned.

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Originally Posted by Snugglebutt

t but also how quickly people rage quit then leave after a single or couple wipes.

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Not surprising given that the last 25% is a hard DPS check. You either can or you can't, trying a few more times ain't going to make a difference.

It took me about 4 different df parties to down odin as a sch. IMO it's a party check, as every member needs to manage to dodge, the mt needs to manage their cd's at the right times, and the healers need to be able to heal, dodge, and remove whatever statuses they can. With too many f ups I'm out of mana from too many rezzes or bleeds being up too long. Eos wasn't even an option, I always had Selene out. The i95 requirement is laughable because from what I've seen so far I don't think its entirely possible.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

The title of the place in DF is misleading. I mean they didn't even bother to write a "(Hard)" or "(Extreme)" next to the title. The ilvl requirement are too low.

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They might not call it hard mode but I am certain that is what it is. Upon completion of it (of which I have done) you will find out that fight is not the end of Odin's storyline and there is more to Odin coming in future. That new content related to the Odin trials will be surely harder than the version we currently have but what we currently have can in no way be described as easy mode by anyone with an ounce of common sense given it's not only very high ilvl requirement but also a very high DPS check surpassing even that of some EX trials.

So in my mind I am sure what we have now is the hard mode (not normal/easy mode) and the future content relating to him will be the EX mode just like most primals having an EX mode further down the line. One thing I will suggest to people is try going down the PF route of single good tank (I used one of best tanks on our server for our run), two healers and rest DPS if struggle...if still struggle and if have very good tank and can find very good healer then there is the option of boosting DPS more by going single tank, single healer and rest DPS but need a very good healer, a bard to help the MP of that healer and very good tank with DPS filling all other spots else that setup might not work for most groups.

Also people should bring food/pots to the trial even if not sure will need them, it is better have and not need such boosts than need and not have. Not a single DF group I was in prior to clearing it via PF had used any food or pots and none of them cleared it...I made it mandatory in PF listing that people carry each in case need before starting and worked out for the better and led to a clear on the trial.

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Originally Posted by echoica

One shot duty finder on day 1.

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Almost the same here (it was not day 1 but day 2...).
Really desappointing. And yes, the second tank is useless (no tank swap, no tankable adds).
If you want to farm it, do a PF with solo-tank, gonna be much more faster, definitely.

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

...The last 25% is impossible with i95 DPS...

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Just because someone is i120 or whatever doesn't mean that they do more damage than someone of say i95. I've seen full i110 players that wouldn't be able to make T5 enrage including echo bonuses. And iirc Blue Garter beat T5 with a team ilvl of something like i82. Let that sink in.

The fight is either a guaranteed win or a waste of your time. That's all.

Trying it (did it late at night when mosta static logged), joined as tank and it reminded me of when I was trying to do PLD relic in 2.0 with Titan. Holding enmity easily, timing defensive CDs for the big hit whilst watching the rest of the party die over and over and over to the exact same mechanic they died to the previous wipe. In other words, kinda frustrating XD

Gave up for the night after 4 parties. Then killed the next day, Joined as MNK, couple a wipes, tank ragequits, I leave and rejoin as tank, one shotted ^_^

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

Gave up for the night after 4 parties. Then killed the next day, Joined as MNK, couple a wipes, tank ragequits, I leave and rejoin as tank, one shotted ^_^

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Pretty much sums up the fight and why people are having issues. Everyone needs to do their role not just the Healers keeping the party alive but DPS needs to be good and Bards have to support the party damage and mana. The biggest thing is Tanks knowing to manage their CD's because that one attack hits them hard like Titan's table flip did in DL gear and Healers are dealing with a bleed debuff too so it irks me when Tanks just rage at the healers if they die. A really good Tank makes that fight super easy.

They promised Odin's Shield would be available at some point, if I recall correctly. If this version is Odin HM, maybe the Odin EX will drop Odin themed weapons, and since there's already a sword, maybe the tank drop will be the shield (kind of like how Titan HM drops a shield but not a sword for PLD).

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Originally Posted by MXMoondoggie

The biggest thing is Tanks knowing to manage their CD's because that one attack hits them hard like Titan's table flip did in DL gear and Healers are dealing with a bleed debuff too so it irks me when Tanks just rage at the healers if they die.

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Yeah, got smacked for 8k+ unmitigated on WAR. It definitely hits like a truck. That said, much like Titan's MB, it's on a rotation - so if you've made it past him you're already used to this. I'd definitely say that tanking it is the easiest job (surprise surprise), but it's overall a pretty straightforward fight. It was a pretty fun one, though.

Beat it with random DF party after a couple of wipes. Funny thing was a Dragoon who got killed in attempt #3 rage quit while dead, and the fight continued. I'm thinking 'there goes my piercing resistance debuff for Bard' when 5 secs later another Dragoon gets Join in Progress. Funny thing is we end up beating him that same attempt... I think if the Dragoon who quit had been raised with weakness instead of getting replaced with a new one, we would have gotten Zantetsukened.

Got my First and last clear using Df!

Use party finder, not duty finder. Problem solved.

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Originally Posted by EinherjarLucian

People who just quit early after one or two attempts at Odin are just a bunch of quitters. Seriously.

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And there's no way to prevent that from happening.