It isn't *always* an advantage to pull multiple groups

I sometimes get in to parties that seem to think that pulling multiple groups of targets in dungeons like Brayflox HM should just be a standard. There are actually some parties that it really doesn't make sense for.

Example: when there are 2 melee DPS in the party.

In this example, it certainly won't speed up the rate of killing, and might even make it slower. If I am a WHM, I can contribute with Holy, but not if the tank's HP is dropping like F-bombs at a frat party. More importantly, Monks, Dragoons, and now Ninjas aren't going to kill any faster with more targets. With the tank investing enmity in more targets, they may not even be able to reach top DPS on a single target without topping enmity.

As a rule of thumb, if there is a BLM in the party and everyone is willing, I pull multiple targets. Two BLMs and it is a no-brainer. Bards are also a nice choice for pulling multiple groups, but with diminishing returns.

It's actually a huge plus to do as big a possible with any melee. MNK's AoE is competitive during Perfect Balance (only once every 3 minutes), and beyond that it's pretty bad (but still worth doing). DRG's also competitive while fully buffed and with Dragonfire Dive, but it's very TP draining and a little less strong while waiting for DFD to recharge.

Also, doing multiple pulls is really draining on TP. If a melee can spend all they have on one pull and then recover while going to a boss, it's quite a bit better than going pull by pull and having to do less AoE, or going dry.

Speed runs vary based on who you're running with but the general rule of thumb is, ideally, it's better to group up than do multiple small groups.

^ That. As long as there's at least one group with 3+ mobs, I'm going to PB and spam Rockbreaker at some point anyway. You might as well give me as many mobs to hit with it as you can. I can afford the TP to do that once, maybe twice before each boss in most dungeons. I can't afford the TP to go AOE mode for long on each individual pull, even though Rockbreaker would be good for every 3+ pack.

So yeah. Big pulls, pls.

It would be stupid to not having multiple pulls when you KNOWS the WHM is up for it, your tanking gear can take multiple hits and there are a BLM and a BRD/BLM in the party. Though, always ask first before you pull or you will have angry mobs coming at you raging :)

Aoe damage is worth doing when there are 3+ targets, and it doesn't get more expensive to AOE more things at once.

I remember back when BrayfloxHM was farmed for Myth...

Healer: pull more
me(tank): *pulls everything between first and second bosses*
Healer: *panic* not everythiiing
Me: don't bitch, you got what you asked for

Ninja seem to AoE quite adequately and can heal the tank's TP. It is not to say I always enjoy it when people mass-pull, but I am happy to swiftcast a shadow flare as an icing.

Unless the tank is way undergeared for that. Good grief them heals. I never thought I'd ever go nearlt oom as a scholar.

Two stories.

1. Quarn HM. Had a BRD and a BLM to go along with a WHM. I asked "big pulls?" Heals said yes. So I pull everything to the locked door.I swear to you if that door wasn't there I would have kept going. Mobs got melted as you'd expect. In Quarn HM, the doors suck and slow us down.

2. Snowcloak. I was on BLM this time. NIN, SCH and PLD in the group. PLD says nothing and decided to run and gather everything to the first door, no protect, SS, nothing. We all follow like sillies, cause I know what is gonna happen, and reach the door. I start on my rotation and bam he is dead. Next is the NIN, at this point I am packing up shop and sprinting coz I am next. We all die. Tank says, heals and dps sukk. My only response to that, which the rest of teh group understood was; apparently so. waited teh 15 and vote kicked.

Some have the expectation others don't, as a tank be mindful of who is in your group. Pull small them work from there. If they can handle it get moar!!

if you were a paladin? yeah maybe

but if you're a WAR and Unchained/Berserk is off CD, it's always worth it to pull a large group. Hell, I think it's worth it any time you can afford to spam OP for >=75% of a large pull.

But sometimes the DPS you get are a little special =\

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Delorean

if you were a paladin? yeah maybe

but if you're a WAR and Unchained/Berserk is off CD, it's always worth it to pull a large group. Hell, I think it's worth it any time you can afford to spam OP for >=75% of a large pull.

But sometimes the DPS you get are a little special =\

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Amen to that...

So I can look at this from all sides of the equation, so let's get this started!

As a tank: I like big pulls, and I cannot lie. (Okay, that was bad) However, that being said, I base my pulls off of who is in my party and how much life my healer has. I don't care about their mind stat -- base gear raises life. If they've got at least 4500 HP, I'll do just fine with a pretty decent pull. If I have a BLM in my party, you can bet I'll be pushing my healer to their limits. But the problem with this is that it wipes out the healer's MP, especially if they're a WHM. So I wait. This is apparently something rare enough that brings me to...

As a healer!: I'm decently geared. I'm i99 and working my way up (My PLD is like ...i106). I know what I can heal and I know what I can't, and I still try to push myself. My biggest problem, believe it or not, is the higher-lifed Warriors that think they can pull a whole room and expect me to be able to heal it. In the new Ex roulette dungeons, this can be pure hell. So I still try, but more often than not, the tank that is doing my pulling will NOT wait between mobs. I am a WHM. I do not have aetherflow to regen less than 1k of my mana in a hit. I do not have a fairy that will help me to heal you. All the healing you get is coming from my not-so-sparkly-anymore staff and my own mana pool. So as a healer, dammit tanks, pay attention. DO NOT leave me behind. I am your life, so to speak, so you better wake up and pay attention.

DPSING!!
Ranged: ...well let's be honest....bard: I will admit I am not the best geared, nor am I the best bard for the job. My focus, as a bard, is actually not my own damage, but supplementing the damage of my team and helping them. I am a support bard. That is my class and I am sticking to it. I will play whatever song you need as long as you let me know you need TP. I can see the rest. Do not expect me to be amazing with my damage. Even buffed, I can't hit the stats a WHM will.

Melee: ...I hate it I hate it I hate it o_o;; I am a mnk (eventually nin) by trade. It's my best geared DPS class. And I hate mobbing. My fingers still fumble over the buttons for my buffs (geez there's a lot...); I still question which fist to use; and AOEing is a nightmare because I forget Perfect Balance more often than not, and then keep going through a rotation of three skills so of course the monsters don't all die the same OMGBRAINMELTDOWNISUCK. lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LionKing

Though, always ask first before you pull

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This. I always type following line when doing roulettes: "Big/medium or small pulls?" and most of the time i really wait response from healer and not from the dps :P

Any DPS class will ALWAYS do more damage against multiple targets for the simple fact that even if their AoE abilities would suck, they can use DoTs on all enemies seperately, and DoTs are usually the most powerful abilities classes have.

There is. Stuff dies faster. Duh.

All of the classes have an AoE that is best when used on more than 3-4 targets. Stuff dies much faster so long as the tank can hold threat and not get hit by telegraphs, and the healer does the job right (Both geared enough, of course). Hell, even the occasional Holy/Shadowflare and Bane makes it even faster. Monk and Lancer, as many people like to disregard, actually do pretty damn well in AoE provided they know what they are doing.

Tldr: Get people that know what they're doing.