Interest in the war of the magi

First of, Hello and this is my first post in the lore forums. Please bear with me.

Lately I got really into the war of the magi(and FFXIV Lore in general I guess). I'm a sucker for magic so naturally this picked my interest by a lot. However, while I was trying to search for more details, I could barely find anything. I did find out that 2.2 was explaining a lot on it but at that time I was barely interested in lore as much as I was in gameplay and progression (Which I highly regret by now). I didn't skip the conversations but I also really didn't try to understand and I fear I might have really skipped some great details. NOTE: I might be wrong in many things I'm saying now, apologies if I upset some lore maniacs.

Here is what I know so far.

Starting with the 5th Umbral era, an Ice age, man discovered magic for the first time which then lead to the 5th astral era.
Only to use this magic to survive in this Ice age wasn't enough and man was learning, stronger, more destructive magic. Black magic was born by the hands of Shatotto.
Shatotto, being a powerful sorceress brought down a meteor and formed staffs/rods out of it's fragments. Worthy of being mentioned is the Stardust rod. (And I guess dark matter in general?)
To keep everything in balance the elementals gave birth to White magic, magic to succor rather than destroy. (?).
White mages started abusing their powers for their own good.
Since magic was first discovered in this era I am assuming the art to call by a fairy and the scholar arts where also first discovered in this era.
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Here is where I lack details. The war of the magi happened before calamity if I am not mistaken but what was it that it triggered it ?

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The White mages have Amdapor, their City-state. (? Is it a city-state?)
The Scholars have the floating city of Nym, their City-state.
The third nation of Black mages, we do not know. However they play a big part in forming Belah'dia. Proto Belah'dian you might call them (?)

BLM's fight WHM's.
BLM's fight SCH's.
WHM's fight SCH's.

It's an all out war.
The third nation of the Black mages also do summon voidsent and let those attack Amdapor. A voidsent worthy of being mentioned, Diabolos. Diabolos bringing utter destruction to the City of Amdapor, driving the WHM's to an edge. The WHM's do end up sealing him away at a great cost (?)
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What cost ? Is the info even right ?
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WHM's and SCH's form an allegiance for a short time.
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The elementals being utterly disappointed with man and their actions, summon forth a flood. The calamity that brings the 5th Astral era to an end. Washing away the magic that befell the land and ending the all out war of the magi. Amdapor seemingly completely destroyed. A tragedy befell Nym, an illness that turned their people into tonberries (Or was this prior to the calamity). Belah'dia was formed by the BLM's that survived the calamity.

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I guess this is where my knowledge ends, or at least is all I remember right now. For the love of god, please correct me and/or add stuff that I don't know yet or missed. I heard 2.2 had some info on it but I couldn't find out what exactly it was that 2.2 had in store for us and I'm too lazy to play everything again lol. I'd like to try to edit the post and add/correct information about the war. I'd greatly appreciate any help. Sorry for my bad grammar. /bow

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Originally Posted by Cherub

Starting with the 5th umbral era, an Ice age, man discovered magic for the first time which then lead to the 5th astral era.

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From their perspective, they "discovered" magick; but this was far from the first time magick had been used. Consider it an independent re-discovery.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

Black magic was born by the hands of Shatotto.

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Correct. To elaborate a bit, magick was limited to using the aether within you at first. Shatotto developed methods of pulling aether from your environment, far more than you could ever channel from within, and using it for great destruction.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

I am assuming the art to call by a fairy and the scholar arts where also first discovered in this era.

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Aetherial coalescence (calling aether into being as an entity) has a complicated history. Two eras prior to the War of the Magi, the Allagan Empire faced those who knew how to summon primals, and in turn their mages used arcanist powers to summon Egi using defeated primals' essences. In our current era, arcanist mages use mathematical formulas to shape temporary brings from local aether and return it to the stream when finished. During the War of the Magi, however, Nymian arcanists created fairies as we do carbuncles, but instead of relying on behaviors built by mathematical formulas and summoning them anew each time, they created an essence that had an aspect "of the sun" and aspect "of the moon" that could be evoked at will, and then they bound that essence to the soulstone so that it could grow and learn with the scholar for all time. In the event that the soulstone passed from one to another, the same fairy would be passed from one master to another, as well. There are a lot of ways to use arcanima.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

The war of the magi happened before calamity if I am not mistaken

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The War of the Magi took place in the 5th Astral Era, which means after the 5th Calamity but before the 6th Calamity, which the war led to.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

What was it that it triggered it

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Vaguely? Rivalry. At first, the city-states shared information and profited and built their new Astral Era on a spirit of healthy competition, but that was soon soured by envy, jealousy, and greed, leading to very unhealthy competition, and eventually all-out war. It was a long and brutal war in which many alliances were made and broken in an attempt to exert power and control. Specifically? Please look forward to it!

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Originally Posted by Cherub

The White mages had Amdapor
The Scholars had Nym
The third nation of Black mages, we do not know. However they play a big part in forming Belah'dia.

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Correct, correct, and correct.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

The third nation of the Black mages also do summon voidsent and let those attack Amdapor.

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They're the primary suspect, but who knows who summoned what to attack who, you know?

Between our assumptions and history written by victors, I wouldn't be sure of anything just yet.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

Diabolos bringing utter destruction to the City of Amdapor, driving the WHM's to an edge. The WHM's do end up sealing him away at a great cost

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Correct. If you look at the names of the rooms in the dungeon, they tell a story. Many died trying to seal him in the Tower of White.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

The elementals being utterly disappointed with man and their actions, summon forth a flood.

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Yeah, they were pretty pissed. I believe the elemental who ushered it in was named Oha-sok, the elemental of nihility, but I'll need to brush up on my 1.0 White Mage arc.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

Amdapor seemingly completely destroyed.
A tragedy befell Nym, an illness that turned their people into tonberries
Belah'dia was formed by the BLM's that survived the calamity.

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Hard to say what happened in the Calamity and what they did to each other but in the end, destroyed is destroyed.

Keep in mind, Loremasters Banri Oda and Koji Fox (aka Fernehalwes) have been incredibly tight-lipped about the War of the Magi. They've got something up their sleeves, and before we go banging on doors for information, they need their chance to tell us everything they plan on telling us at their own pace. Of course, if they skip anything we're excited to know, we'll make sure to go back and get some answers.

That said, you seem to know everything there is to know, so far!

I'm hoping the War of the Magi will either tie in to the Dragon Song War in Courthas in 3.0 or have part of the expantion dedicated to it. As some one who RPs as a decendent of Amdapoor and Sil'dih it was a nice RP moment for me to return to Amdapoor and fix my ansestors mistake by (Presumably) destroying Diablos. It'd be even cooler to be able to find not only Sil'dih's remains but also what happened to the belah'dians as well as who their original 5th astral nation was.

A bounus is my RP states that I was born in Xelpotol so I'm verry excited about seeing that place as well in 3.0.

I would also hope to see more exposition on the War of the Magi in Heavensward. Given the hinting about a certain "floating continent," and that sharing a common source with the War of the Magi, perhaps there's a connection? This may just be wishful thinking, but if Diabolos wasn't really destroyed, perhaps it would even be one of an Eorzean version of the Warring Triad?

Thanks for the great reply Anonymoose. Feeling honored to get a reply from a master of lore.

The information about the aetherial coalescence is greatly appreciated! While I know how white magic and black magic worked, I had less clue about this.

I'm really excited to see how this will continue. I'd die for some detailed information on what happened back then. Personally I hope the war of the magi gets some big spotlight in the expansion.
I actually had no clue about Oha-sok so I tried to look her up. The results were slim.
However-
[...]

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Raya-O-Senna: “Show unto me the face of the sixth sun, that I might weigh the deeds of her children.”...Apparently, this phrase echoed in his mind without cease.

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[...]

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Raya-O-Senna: As I related to you before, it is by her keening that the elemental of nihility unleashes cataclysm.

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this was said in the WHM story line in 1.0. >Level 45 quest mentioning Oha-sok< aaand >Level 50 quest mentioning Oha-sok<.
Pretty intriguing and this could imply that Oha-sok is indeed the elemental who summoned the flood. (I'm not sure though so I say "imply" :3)

The urge to want to know more has risen by 100% :( So many questions and no answers!!!

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Originally Posted by Quintalian

I would also hope to see more exposition on the War of the Magi in Heavensward. Given the hinting about a certain "floating continent," and that sharing a common source with the War of the Magi, perhaps there's a connection? This may just be wishful thinking, but if Diabolos wasn't really destroyed, perhaps it would even be one of an Eorzean version of the Warring Triad?

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Well the War of the Magi has alot of strings and they have alot of strings dangling with Qarn as well same for the Sil'dih dig site. But we now have an npc/npc group with the vested interest.

Also the twins mentioned tonberrys when talking about Qarn even though the relation should be little if any and not well known. While this is maybe just a flavor drop it is interesting they chose that specific wording with the twins.

But I hope that when the time/if the time comes its much more elaborate and less fleeting then what we recieved with Amdapor township.

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Originally Posted by Cherub

I actually had no clue about Oha-sok so I tried to look her up. The results were slim.

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I have a memory of writing a pretty detailed post on this once-upon-a-time, but I can’t find the damned thing. Could it be that I never posted it? I remember hearing some of the things Oha-Sok said about the War of the Magi and thinking about how it sounded eerily similar to the ravings of Bahamut and the Ascians.

So here we go. Take two!

As the VIIth Legion invaded Eorzea, the elementals grew fearful and angry, and their rage was given form as Oha-Sok, who hid herself within a staff in hopes that it would find its way into the hands of man that she might weigh their actions and judge them worthy or unworthy of destruction. The staff immediately fell into the hands of Raya-O-Senna, and knowing that her presence would be sensed, Oha burst forth from the staff and lied about being trapped within it. Upon learning of the coming war with Garlemald, Oha warns Raya that conflict leads to nothing but suffering and use of magick in battle will violate the Pact of Gelmorra that allowed man to live above ground in the Sixth Astral Era.

As Oha-sok goes quiet, Raya-O shares some history history of magick - its (re)discovery at the end of the Fifth Umbral Era (Ice), how at first man was content to keep warm but soon started to develop strength for glory, how this desire led to black magick and in turn white magick to act as a counterbalance, and how the War of the Magi broke out as a result and the elementals wrath summoned Oha-Sok, whose keening led to the Sixth Umbral Era (Water).

As Oha starts to be overcome by her kind's rage, she starts to make some pretty specific threats, and Raya realizes that Oha-Sok is the same elemental that was said to have ushered in the Sixth Umbral Era. The player does their best to pacify the elementals' rage, and though they are still angry, Oha-Sok resists them and decides that there is hope in humanity, staying her hand and becoming the final piece of WHM AF in order to help the player on their path.

So, here are some interesting quotes from the storyline.

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Originally Posted by ”Raya-O-Senna”

Oha-Sok is the collective fury of the elementals given form. Their suffering summoned her forth, and in her turn she stokes the fire of their rage with her keening.

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Sounds kinda like a primal, but that's probably among the more paranoid things I've ever said.

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Originally Posted by ”Oha-Sok”

When the fifth sun gave way to the sixth moon, my kind was set free from the shackles of men.Yet our freedom was not to last. Like their forebears before them, the men of this age seek to gain by our torment, and we are made to suffer once more.

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It sounds like the over-use of magick and the over-consumption of aether pains the elementals very being and makes them feel enslaved. It's kind of a chicken and egg thing, though, and Oha-Sok's name hasn't come up in connection to any other Calamities, despite the fact that...

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Originally Posted by ”Furious Elementals”

By our grief the Wrath is wakened, by her keening is our deliverance wrought. Such is the covenant of rebirth since time immemorial.

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...the Elementals make it sound like this has been going on for longer than the Sixth Umbral Era.

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Originally Posted by ”Oha-Sok”

Thou mayest silence the keening of men and beasts, but that of my kind shall not be so easily quelled. I am nihility incarnate,* though thou knowest me first as Oha-Sok. Where all things end, so too do I begin.* In joining light and shadow, ever do I ensure their eternal separation.** Long have I watched thee. Through thine eyes have I gazed upon the children of the sixth sun. I am wrath incarnate. By my kindred's rage am I given life, by their keening roused to wakefulness. Even as I mourn the departure of light, I grieve the coming of shadow. Gentle child of man... Thy heart knoweth no vice, thine intentions being righteous from the first. Yet thy strength knoweth no purpose but conflict. And in conflict, there is naught but suffering. Hark! The keening of my kind riseth now to a crescendo! The new moon loometh nigh, and with its coming, woods shall wither and seas shall roil. When the end of days is come, I pray that thy soul shall know true peace.

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* “I am nihility incarnate … where all things end, so too do I begin.” In the German version of the game, when Nael van Darnus was possessed by Bahamut, the elder primal said, “I am catharsis incarnate. I am the beginning and the end. All are equal before me. All becomes nothing in my burning light.” Coincidence? English inspiration of German? Connection? No idea… but both Oha-Sok and Bahamut are aetherial beings who’ve ushered in Calamity…

** “In joining light and shadow, ever do I ensure their eternal separation.” Ascians have called Calamity the joining... Hmm...

Honestly, though, I have a habit of making FFXIV's loremasters start sentences with the phrase, "Well, it's nothing that exciting, but...", so I'm not sure if I'd get tooooo excited for whatever they're planning about the War of the Magi being tied into concepts are huge as the joining of light and shadow, the elementals' role other calamities, or any of that... but still... should be pretty interesting...

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

* “I am nihility incarnate … where all things end, so too do I begin.” In the German version of the game, when Nael van Darnus was possessed by Bahamut, the elder primal said, “I am catharsis incarnate. I am the beginning and the end. All are equal before me. All becomes nothing in my burning light.” Coincidence? English inspiration of German? Connection? No idea… but both Oha-Sok and Bahamut are aetherial beings who’ve ushered in Calamity…

** “In joining light and shadow, ever do I ensure their eternal separation.” Ascians have called Calamity the joining... Hmm...

Honestly, though, I have a habit of making FFXIV's loremasters start sentences with the phrase, "Well, it's nothing that exciting, but...", so I'm not sure if I'd get tooooo excited for whatever they're planning about the War of the Magi being tied into concepts are huge as the joining of light and shadow, the elementals' role other calamities, or any of that... but still... should be pretty interesting...

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That does seem like an interesting connection explore. Are there any other instigators of the umbral eras and if so what do we know of them?

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Originally Posted by Quintalian

I would also hope to see more exposition on the War of the Magi in Heavensward. Given the hinting about a certain "floating continent," and that sharing a common source with the War of the Magi, perhaps there's a connection? This may just be wishful thinking, but if Diabolos wasn't really destroyed, perhaps it would even be one of an Eorzean version of the Warring Triad?

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The Fiend statue?

Anyway, I'm rather disappointed that neither Wanderer's Palace (Hard) or Amdapor Keep (Hard) touched up on the War of the Magi/Sixth Umbral Cataclysm. Hopefully Heavensward will correct this.

Some things on my mind about the war of the Magi. I saw a pic of Sil'dih where its described to be a mirage from a cutscene in the desert. Was that a 1.0 thing? Is there a link between Belah'dia and the invisible city? E

Even in the Thm/blm lore has them fighting voidsent and closing rifts, even trapping one in an urn at some point. Cnj/Whm is more tree hugging and purifying things. Sch was more or less consumed by their own rancor. If the Black mages really came out on top then where did their city go?

Unless the black mages moved or hid their city there's a chance it was destroyed and Belah'dia was formed out of its ruins. Assuming the Black mages are indeed deeply involved in it's formation. The floating city of Nym is blocked off, with only the wanderer's palace being accessible. Despite the tonberys, that place to me looks like the equivalent to Amdapor Keep. In Amdapor they have those roaming gremlins instead. Does anyone remember what they occasionally start saying when attacking players?

I've only been assuming that if the Ascians are involved with every era change. Then the story of Amdapor being brought down by voidsent from their enemies might not be entirely accurate. Heck for a while now I've been equating Amdapors back story to something along the lines of this song. It could be something like what is being hinted with Isengard and the Ascians. Amdapor keep (hard) suggests there's an open gate somewhere. So killing voidsent there wont do much to stop them from just coming back.

There's a lot of old ruins now so hopefully apart from future main scenario, they can expand more on the past lore. In particular all the empty gaps in the war of the magi. The 5th to 6th era cant be that long ago that no records would be left of it.

Yeah, it's disappointing that there weren't more lore regarding Amdapor and Nymians this patch, oh well.

However, I do find it very odd that the voidsent are running rampant in Gridania (Haukke Manor, Amdapor Keep/Township, Tam Tara...FATEs and more) It's pretty clear to me that the Elementals were the one's keeping voidsent away, but now they've grown weak. I personally think they may have won (at great cost) the War of Magi by resorting to a Covenant with the Voidsent ala Emperor Xande.

I do recall seeing a tonberry in BLM atire during the sch quest; so who knows? Maybe Wanderer's Palace was the last safe bastions to the might of amdapor. Afterall the the amdapori's were able to "alter the very fabric of exhistence"

It'll be nice to find out how dark the white mages could be. Instead of BLM=Destruction= evils

I wonder if we already have a Warring Triad...

We have three Realms;

1. The Physical Realm.
2. The Aetherial Realm.
3. The Void.

1. In the Physical Realm, we have a Goddess called Hydaelyn
2. The Aetherial Realm is a sort of afterlife where Primals, powerful Fiends, reside.
3. The Void you can obviously liken to Hell as it is full of Demons.

Perhaps the Warring Triad in Final Fantasy XIV is;
Goddess = Hydaelyn.
Fiend = Zodiark.
Demon = ??? Cloud of Darkness? Diabolos? Ferdiad?

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Originally Posted by Nalien

Perhaps the Warring Triad in Final Fantasy XIV is;
Goddess = Hydaelyn.
Fiend = Zodiark.
Demon = ??? Cloud of Darkness? Diabolos? Ferdiad?

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This got me thinking. What if the "rejoining" the Ascians are attmepting is meant to literally rejoin the physical realm with the aetherial. This would not only bring Zodiark to our world but allow the ascians to exist here as well, primals and "gods" too. If you were stuck in the spirit world, aside from an occasional possession, would you too not try and perform a ritual which would allow you to return to the world of the living?

This doesn't have much to do with the War of the Magi, but, yeah...

This is all awesome information, the lore behind Amdapoor is pretty cool. One question regarding Diabolos: Do we know exactly which faction actually summoned him?

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Originally Posted by Bushido_Brown

This is all awesome information, the lore behind Amdapoor is pretty cool. One question regarding Diabolos: Do we know exactly which faction actually summoned him?

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They didn't specify, but I speculate it was proto-Belah'dians.

It's possibly proto belah'dians. As far as know black magic quest line talks about being responsible for holding the "key" to the void or something like that. The diabolos fight having doors that temporarily allows you to go into the void world and out the other door, so it could've been the black mages.

Who know how the Nymians were like, but I just can't see them as aggressors. Its been stated that they're a small nation that used their scholars to defend itself from larger invader. That they also traveled around the world (like their patron deity) to heal people. We can atleast extrpolate how proto-belah'dia was using Qarn.

Though not much is known regarding Amdapor and their patron deity

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Originally Posted by Zohar_Lahar

They didn't specify, but I speculate it was proto-Belah'dians.

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I think I remember something about Black Mages summoning him. Mentions he was summoned by Amdapoor's enemies and the was either Nym or the Proto-Belah'dians of the two Nym is said to be Under attack by Amdapoor and a "The Nation of Black Mages" which makes me think Nym wasn't a 100% willing participant in the war. So I say the Black Mages called Diablos, "The King Amoumgst Voidsent", to attack Amdapoor. After all we know that THM and BLM can summon voidsent any way.

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Originally Posted by myahele

Yeah, it's disappointing that there weren't more lore regarding Amdapor and Nymians this patch, oh well.

However, I do find it very odd that the voidsent are running rampant in Gridania (Haukke Manor, Amdapor Keep/Township, Tam Tara...FATEs and more) It's pretty clear to me that the Elementals were the one's keeping voidsent away, but now they've grown weak. I personally think they may have won (at great cost) the War of Magi by resorting to a Covenant with the Voidsent ala Emperor Xande.

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The elemental of nihility doesn't seem to stem from any Voidsent help. Anonymoose has pretty much all the info on the big bad girl that brought the Flood. I personally don't think the Voidsent have anything to do with Oha-Sok, the elementals, the great flood in that regard it is. However that the great flood weakened the elementals power is very well possible. We could also link their growing weak with how Hydaelyn is currently really weak. But maybe you're right and they really had Voidsent help. Until we get to know why the elementals have grown weak there is no answer. MAYBE the elementals don't even care about -it-. The Shroud itself is free from Voidsent, the only free roaming ones in my mind are near haukke manor and in Central shroud- Spirithold and over Tam-Tara deepcroft. All ruins of mankind. They did extremely piss of the elementals and even in the 6th astral era they were still pretty pissed until Oha-Soks anger was quelled. So I wouldn't be really surprised if they don't really care anymore about mankind or are still kinda mad at us. At least majority of them. But that seems too far fetched imo. I honestly think that there is something weakening the elementals. Some dark power is involved, I FEEL IT.


It's hilarious how the Hildibrand questline was closer to the war than AK/WP hardmode. It was some nice lore on Belah'dia and Sil'dih but nothing earth shattering. I guess the part where it was said that "Remaining mages gathered up" could imply that the nations got mixed up after the flood is very likely. Being driven out from their own city also supports that statement. I still think Belah'dia was built by the third nation of BLM's but that there were a few other mages mixed in it as well.

Also I'm having some extreme hopes that in the far future the city of amdapor will be restored and we can actually enter it. It looks just amazing in there.

Man first the allagan empire and then Belah'dia. It's like the loremasters don't want this world to flourish lol.

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Originally Posted by Kotemon

Some things on my mind about the war of the Magi. I saw a pic of Sil'dih where its described to be a mirage from a cutscene in the desert. Was that a 1.0 thing? Is there a link between Belah'dia and the invisible city? E

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In 1.0 the Miner quest line. Nenekko wanted to study up on Sil'dih instead of getting married, we met her outside Ul'dah to the south east of the city and it was overlooking the Sagoli desert (way larger than what we see near Forgotten Springs) and we see a mirage of a similar looking city to Ul'dah and naturally it would be similar in style. Sister cities after all. Sil'dih would be buried by all the sand shortly after it's collapse. Though it's funny how Sil'dih burrowed under Ul'dah in it's search for water.

As for the War of the Magi, like Anonymoose said they're clearly not tipping anything off yet. I'm looking forward to seeing how they reveal more of the story line.

As for Diabolos, Ferne (I believe, might hve been a different Dev) stated that that wouldn't be the last time we see him, his special death scene hints to that in-game. A Lost City of Amdapor (HM) perhaps?

I have a theory that Amdapor worshipped Althyk : Represents earth and power over space/time.
I say this because all the precursor of the modern city states worship a god of the same element. In this case gridania has Nophica and Amdapor probably had Althyk as the patron diety.

We can also kinda guess the cultural beliefs of these city states based on their patron dieties. Nymians were wandering scholars, belah'dians were big law order and judgment, but the Amdapori?

Additionally, Althyks prayer stone is located not on too far from amdapor keep.

Ancient Amdapori practiced magic that "alters the fabrics of existence" and given that their deity controls space/time then perhaps their magic did something similar. Maybe some Amdapori pulled a Loisoix and teleported others into the future maybe even in some kind of hibernation?

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Originally Posted by myahele

I have a theory that Amdapor worshipped Althyk

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I agree, for pretty much the same reasons. The prayer stone says a lot.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

I agree, for pretty much the same reasons. The prayer stone says a lot.

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There is a motif on the floor that constantly reappears in Amdapori structures as well, which involves the Sun and Moon (so, time). Off the top of my head it's where you fight the boss before Diabolos in Lost City and in the hallway before Demon Wall. It's pretty much the only motif I've noticed in their architecture and it's time related, so yeah, Althyk.

Anyway, Warring Triad reveal? There's certainly three things;
https://i.imgur.com/K9Y47zC.png
The area also reminds me greatly of the zone in Final Fantasy VI before reaching the Espers world.

Also noticed something in, what I'm calling, the Allagan Floating Fortress. Look at the back;
https://i.imgur.com/Ixz5QOf.png
Do you see three large statues?

Middle one is hard to see, but feathered wings. I'm thinking Goddess there. Left appears to be a Dragon. No idea on the right. So the Warring Triad goes all the way back to Allag? Certainly an interesting revelation. Wonder if the War of the Magi was a result of the three nations finding the Warring Triad and Floating Continent?

Hmmm the first picture doesn't look a lot Allagan like however but I know exactly which place you mean. It makes me wonder what connection the allags have to the warring triad. I do like the theory that this is the reason on why the war of the magi started. I'm not a VI expert but I think it was the same reason back then.

Frankly, I'd have never thought the allags have anything to do with the war. It just seems so weird to me. Wouldn't be the nymians first to discover the triad because apparently it's somewhere in the sky. Nymians having a clear advantage with their floating technology. It also makes me wonder if the warring triad has anything to do with primals... more like what power does it hold.

That's to say IF it truly is the warring triad.

Actually there is one thing I'm uncertain about.
Gelmorra was built before/during/after the floods ?

I'd say Gelmorra would have been build in the wake of the floods since trying to live underground while the lands above are flooding wouldn't work too well. I would suspect that after the floods receded those who survived suddenly found the forest had turn on them and in the while trying to hide discovered that they were safe as long as they stayed below the surface.

Perhaps that structure dates to the Fourth Astral Era, and had something to do with the Fifth Umbral Calamity?