Does SE suddenly hate ACN classes?

I've played ACN classes since I started playing the game.
I find myself asking why SE hates us now?

SCH are not the greatest 8 man healers and play their first 30 levels as DPS.

In PvP they take away Cleric Stance and give OUR AoE Heal Boost skill (Sacred Soil) to WHM only as a PvP skill that's way better?

Casters are already gimped in PvP vs Melee, now the SCH is totally useless.

Now SMN are not the most desired DPS. There's a few places where they are used in strategies (often with Titan off tanking).

Yet now they've nerfed Titan to the point he can't even hold agro against dots?

SMN are slow to start dps, what we bring to a party is our pets and unique ways we can use them. Yet you take that from us too?

I rarely play SCH over WHM. Now even the solo ability of the SMN is being ruined.

What in the world does SE have against ACN?

Sounds like you need to just learn how to play. SCH can solo-heal pretty much everything in this game minus a few encounters. SMN can easily outparse every other DPS job in many encounters that have multiple targets. Ill give you that WHM is superior to SCH in pvp but thats it

Most people prefer SMN over BLM in most encounters and like sackm said, scholars can solo heal almost everything in this game. They add dps to the party for encounters and lustrate is just an amazing tool. I have no idea where anything you're saying is coming from but I think you need to spend a little more more time with the class and researching their usefulness.

Btw, SMN was never good because of Titan-Egi. And in solo pve content, my Titan egi holds hate against my dots so I dunno what your issue is. Maybe you have it on obey and not using rouse?

SCH can solo heal. SCH offers Selene which is a huge DPS gain for your raid. You can easily pull 200 DPS in raid fights if your WHM knows what to do.

SMN DPS is amazing. It's stable compared to BLM that is mainly burst. They bring extra raises. I've seen SMNs do 370+ DPS in T9. Their DPS is more than desireable.

Wtf are you talking about? SMN/SCH are great jobs.

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Originally Posted by sackm

Sounds like you need to just learn how to play. SCH can solo-heal pretty much everything in this game minus a few encounters. SMN can easily outparse every other DPS job in many encounters that have multiple targets. Ill give you that WHM is superior to SCH in pvp but thats it

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Even that last part is something many players will disagree with. SCHs were widely considered to be overpowered prior to Cleric Stance being effectively removed from PvP.

But anyway, yes, SCH is very powerful and loses to WHM in healing ability only where party-wide damage is huge, unavoidable, and fast (which almost never happens outside of something unimportant like T2 enrage), and SMN DPS is consistently high and easy to maintain; only downside is lack of immediate burst.

ACN is fine. OP just needs a little practice.

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Originally Posted by Malric

I've played ACN classes since I started playing the game.
I find myself asking why SE hates us now?
SCH are not the greatest 8 man healers and play their first 30 levels as DPS.

In PvP they take away Cleric Stance and give OUR AoE Heal Boost skill (Sacred Soil) to WHM only as a PvP skill that's way better?

Casters are already gimped in PvP vs Melee, now the SCH is totally useless.

Now SMN are not the most desired DPS. There's a few places where they are used in strategies (often with Titan off tanking).

Yet now they've nerfed Titan to the point he can't even hold agro against dots?

SMN are slow to start dps, what we bring to a party is our pets and unique ways we can use them. Yet you take that from us too?

I rarely play SCH over WHM. Now even the solo ability of the SMN is being ruined.

What in the world does SE have against ACN?

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- SCH can solo heal even extremes and raids.
- They took cleric stance away because of WHM parties spamming holy with it, was kinda broken.
- Sacred Soil HoT is useless, the only benefit we get from it is the 40% damage reduction and the skill duration isn't even long enough. Not to mention you're basically a free target since you have to stay inside that little circle.
- SCH has more survability while being attacked by melees while casters can't do anything but kite until you're dead because every attack will cancel your casts and Equanimity isn't enough, you still get stunlocked or silenced, or pushed until it runs out. It also happens on SCH but we get Lustrates while we kite, a stationary pet that heals us while we kite.
- SMN is the second class that does more dps overall in long fights after MNK, parties that don't desire SMN aren't smart.
- Several fights are SMN friendly because you can dps many targets at once while keeping your dps up on main boss, with Bane. And they have more dps increase chance in avoiding mechanics, because dots are ticking.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Casters are already gimped in PvP vs Melee, now the SCH is totally useless.

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Have you ever actually played SCH in PvP? A semi-decent scholar can just stare and laugh at the DPS who try to kill him.

Wh-what did I just read...?

https://s-media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com...6655ac42ac.jpg

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

SCH can solo heal. SCH offers Selene which is a huge DPS gain for your raid. You can easily pull 200 DPS in raid fights if your WHM knows what to do.

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Either healing class can solo heal any content with the proper use of the skill set. (inb4 needing ballad: Yes, even without ballad)
Selene offers a DPS boost but it's not "huge". It's Roughly -0.07s to -0.09s casting time reduction for 30s every minute at most. Assuming you have 2,4s casting/GCD time, it requires 28 spells/weapon skills without stopping with the buff up to even get one more spell/skill in the rotation. Which equals 2 full selene buff durations and 5s on the next selene buff. Which in turn equals 2:05 minutes to get one extra skill in - Black Mages stacking spell speed benefit slightly more from the selene buff.

One thing a white mage -can't- do as efficiently would be kiting in Turn 7. Where a scholar can do it more reliably.

SMN and SCH are pretty much among the best Jobs in pvp. Not sure what you are smoking but i want some of it.

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Originally Posted by Edeline

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- Both healers were broken in pvp, actually. Either healer could solo any other class by simply outsustaining them while doing some decent damage - Especially Scholar with 150 potency Energy drains and two instant DoTs.
- It's Black Mage that comes in second in long fights. Comes in first even without any form of aid (ie: Bards). A Black Mage has infinite resources, where any physical damage classes will run out of TP and have some down time and summoners have to use -Energy Drain at one point rather than Fester - Which is would lead to DPS loss.
-There aren't a lot of encounters that apply for this. Mainly in (Extreme) Primals. Only ones I could name off the bat would be Ifrit EX, Ramuh EX and Turn 7 second set of adds. In turn 7 it's common that the Summoner prioritises kiting, which a black mage cannot do reliably (it is possible, however)

I started this game as CNJ, when I switched to ACN at level 30 to be able to unlock WHM I didn't go back except to unlock Stoneskin until turn 5 in coil.
Ever since then I've felt the SCH was gimped in comparison.

Right now in the game, it don't matter.
Most parties are geared like successful 2nd coil groups were 4 months ago.
Duh, really have to wonder why they're easy to heal?

When I played my SCH in Bryflox speed runs (when people did those) and people wanted i90 groups I actually preferred my SCH for healing those.
However I also remember when SCH were gimped in Turn 2 or even felt helpless in Titan HM.

I've spent a lot of time healing on both classes, no way a SCH compares to WHM in healing output beyond single target.
I'd give it a close vote on 4 player content but in 8 player content where the party is not over geared, no contest.

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Originally Posted by Ashgarth

Have you ever actually played SCH in PvP? A semi-decent scholar can just stare and laugh at the DPS who try to kill him.

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Yep

Though admittingly I stopped when MNK started teleporting to me and 1 hitting me with level 1 LB pretty regularly.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Yep

Though admittingly I stopped when MNK started teleporting to me and 1 hitting me with level 1 LB pretty regularly.

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Keybind attunement, focus monks/dragoons that are attacking you to see if they cast it, or use VIT accesories. You can survive LB1 with them.

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Originally Posted by Edeline

Keybind attunement, focus monks/dragoons that are attacking you to see if they cast it, or use VIT accesories. You can survive LB1 with them.

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My favorite thing on WHM is to wear VIT accessories, take a 4300 Bravery and then immediately benediction myself. It's fantastic.

Although second only to the feeling of successfully pushing someone off a cliff with Fluid Aura.

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Originally Posted by Edeline

Keybind attunement, focus monks/dragoons that are attacking you to see if they cast it, or use VIT accesories. You can survive LB1 with them.

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Yeah I now wear crafted i90 accessories with max VIT.

I have the skills setup but when they teleport to me it's often from behind and by the time I realize it's too late.

I know they teleport (or have some insane speed) because I've seen them from pretty far away, turned and sprinted and still get instantly pounced by them from behind.

If they even sprinted they wouldn't have the TP to do anything besides LB but it's normally (when looking at log) a rear attack, a stun, then LB.

Even if I could survive though my damage without Cleric Stance is just sad.

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Originally Posted by Malric

Ever since then I've felt the SCH was gimped in comparison.

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Then you have no idea what you're talking about.

Healers were OP in PVP and having a large group of them is almost guaranteed win when defending OP.

Ill agree that they gimped the titan strat for ramuh ex.

Was there an announcement today of changes to the ACN/SMN/SCH? If not what is the "sudden" part of any of this?

Jeebus, SMN often out DPSes most of the other classes if you take into account the dmg over time dots....