The Relic Weapons and justifying why the Jobmasters have them

Okay so while leveling your job to 50 you may have noticed that someone involved with the related quest-line has a distinct weapon, and that once you get to 50 you can get that weapon for your self. However once you do the relic quests some of them ae implied to be one of a kind. For now I know of two weapons (due to having earned them), Thryus and the Stardust Rod

• For Thyrus, we know that it's original wielder, A-Towa-Cant, kicked the bucket at the O'Ghomara mines, however the level 50 WHM quest has him reappear to aid in the purification of the tree. However in this case it has been stated that he is a ghost essentially and fades as soon as the tree is cleansed. If his body appears as an aethereal temporary construct, why not his staff?
• In contrast, the Stardust Rod has been mass produced. So it's wouldn't be surprising for Ququrika to have a genuine Stardust Rod as opposed to a replica or aethereal construct

Now that still leaves the other 7 (soon to be 8) relics. Are the relics truly one of a kind? Are the weapons you see their wielders use the genuine articles, replicas or counterfeits and if they are real, how did they get these weapons?

For PLD:

When the first PLD were under the service of the Sultanate, 3 swords were made from a single ore: Oathkeeper, Curtana, and a 3rd unknown sword. Oathkeeper was stolen heavily dishonoring the brotherhood of PLD. They still haven't fully recovered from the theft. Curtana was given to another PLD. Curtana is real, not mass produced or a replica. For the Holy Shields, I guess there were 3: one for Oathkeeper, Curtana, and the 3rd unknown sword. Curtana and Holy Shield are a set, they belong together. So that's why I think there were 3 shields.

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Originally Posted by Lucke

For PLD:

When the first PLD were under the service of the Sultanate, 3 swords were made from a single ore: Oathkeeper, Curtana, and a 3rd unknown sword. Oathkeeper was stolen heavily dishonoring the brotherhood of PLD. They still haven't fully recovered from the theft. Curtana was given to another PLD. Curtana is real, not mass produced or a replica. For the Holy Shields, I guess there were 3: one for Oathkeeper, Curtana, and the 3rd unknown sword. Curtana and Holy Shield are a set, they belong together. So that's why I think there were 3 shields.

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So basilay the sword we see during the Paladin quest is not Curtana but an identical sword?

for DRG: The Gae Bolg is a (somewhat) replicated but still unique relic. Only one is crafted for every generation of the Azure Dragoon and it's usually crafted by blacksmiths in Ishgard. This though conflicts with the relic weapon questline lore of where (whats her name) Dragoon took up her fallen lovers spear and drove it into the heart of the Dragon who killed him.

Source: Forgot where I saw the first half of this. Correct me if I am wrong.

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Originally Posted by LiveVoltage

for DRG: The Gae Bolg is a (somewhat) replicated but still unique relic. Only one is crafted for every generation of the Azure Dragoon and it's usually crafted by blacksmiths in Ishgard. This though conflicts with the relic weapon questline lore of where (whats her name) Dragoon took up her fallen lovers spear and drove it into the heart of the Dragon who killed him.

Source: Forgot where I saw the first half of this. Correct me if I am wrong.

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If the Dragoon who owned thw spear was the first Azure Dragoon, then it may have started Ishgardian Blacksmiths replicating the Gae Bolg as a tradition of sorts.

DISCLAIMER: This reply explores possibilities and limitations, but offers few answers.

This is a tough question to work with without making some assumptions (and I'll have to go over the story arcs again over the next few days to be sure). The game implies that one person takes up the mantle of one job from ages past, but, as an MMO, game mechanics must allow for thousands of people to be that one person. Furthermore, each of those thousands of people must be able to be the one person for each job for every job. The fact that there are lots of copies of the relic around is something we're used to ignoring lore-wise, but the job masters are something they've left a lot of open doors with if you assume that none of the weapons are quite as unique as they claim (and, as you say, may have been mass produced at some point long ago).

To start at the beginning, the story arcs suggest that the player is the first person to truly revive the job's presence in Eorzea by inheriting the soul crystal of a true bearer of that job, but it does sort of leave an open door for people to follow in your path. Maybe they don't have soul stones, maybe they made new ones, I have no idea. All of the quests work out in kind of different ways and different excuses could be found for each one. But this continues over into relics a bit.

All other things aside, I think the big hint is that Gerolt flat out tells you that the old weapon is in such bad shape that he'd be afraid to even sneeze on it, never mind take a hammer to it. Then, he takes a run-of-the-mill, contemporary weapon and has it host his restoration. One might argue that his work is more of a spiritual restoration than a literal one, and that the old weapon has been, for all intents and purposes, destroyed. Yet again, the story makes it sound like you are the first person to recover the lost weapon, solve its mystery, and bring about its recreation, but there's a wide open door for lots of similar looking weapons floating around before you have the "legitimate" heir to the one named in the quest in your possession - and furthermore an open door to assume your restoration inspired others to take on similar weapons.

In the end, I think the cleanest way to look at the lore will be to assume that one great adventurer from each class guild gets tangled up in events that led them to take up the mantle of a "job of old" on their journey to banish the darkness. These adventurers then come together as one and work together, the "canonical party," so to speak, represented by the CG Party we see in SE's big cinematic. Each one person, each inheriting one job, then takes up the historical restoration of one relic, associated with that job, and upgrades it until it becomes the same as those that the Zodiac Braves wielded (and maybe beyond, who knows. Maybe the umbral eras are like levels and, seeing as this is the final umbral era, there's a final boss and/or series of final bosses and we'll upgrade well beyond any weapons ever forged). Then, of course, you have to take into account that only one of those people is, according to the Main Scenario Story Arc, Daybreak, The Lightbringer, Eorzea's Sword in the Darkness, Hydaelyn's Champion, Breaker of Chains, and Mother of Dragons. But, this is quite a digression.

tl;dr unless Square Enix has a way to explain it without limiting themselves, or actively decides to limit themselves by trying to explain it, the answer may very well be, unless I've overlooked something (a scenario we should never discount), don't think too hard about it, and assume that many excuses might work (functionally) even if there is never an answer (canonically).

Let's explore Curtana, which I find to be the weirdest scenario. Why does Solkzagyl have a sword that looks just like it? Well, to start with, there are three swords other than Oathkeeper, Curtana, and the two unknown names (Joyeuse?). In the Job quests, we're told that Solkzagyl has Oathkeeper, but later find that it is truly in the hands of the Monetarists. In the relic quests, and you recover and remake Curtana after the Amalj'aa steal it from Tristram's tomb. Wait, so what the hell sword is Solzagyl carrying? One of the unnamed swords? A counterfeit Oathkeeper as part of playing the role of the thief? ... GEROLT, IS THIS YOUR DOING!?

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

...according to the Main Scenario Story Arc, Daybreak, The Lightbringer, Eorzea's Sword in the Darkness, Hydaelyn's Champion, Breaker of Chains, and Mother of Dragons.

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...You know as much as like the first two names, I haven't really heard/read "Daybreak outsie ST (or maybe I forgot that). Also Lightbring could be taken to man soemthing much more sinister, but I digress.

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unless Square Enix has a way to explain it without limiting themselves, or actively decides to limit themselves by trying to explain it, the answer may very well be, unless I've overlooked something (a scenario we should never discount), don't think too hard about it.

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Okay, FYI the Lore AMA thread hasen't closed yet (How long does TGS last anyway?) SO I think I'll go ask them about it.

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

I haven't really heard/read "Daybreak" outside ST

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It was mentioned one time, but it was the first time it was ever hinted that your deeds would cause the coming of the Seventh Astral Era.

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Originally Posted by Y'shtola (Patch 1.19; An Officer and a Wise Man)

But all is not yet lost. Sensing the gravity of the situation, our master—the Allseer—has arrived to begin his search for Daybreak—one of the valiant blades mentioned in the Divine Chronicles.

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Originally Posted by The Seventh Verse of The Divine Chronicles of Mezaya Thousand Eyes

Ne'er till land consumes sun can sea bear moons,
Heavens spew crimson flame, hells seep black dooms.
Stray seeds quicken in ash's gray embrace,
Valiant blades forged under the Twelve's good grace.

Seven waning moons see seven suns rise,
Divine order roils, fallen corpses writhe.
Souls from aether far, strangers from strange lands,
Yester with thine eyes, morrow by thine hands.

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Louisoix hinted at the very end of 1.23b, on his way to lead the Eorzean Alliance at the Battle of Cartenau, that you were the thing he'd come to Eorzea to find, so he knew everything will be okay - thus implying that you are "Daybreak." If you look back at the Divine Chronicles, "valiant blades forged with the Twelve's good grace" (the forces of light / good) rise amongst destruction to fight "hells black dooms ... souls from aether far, [and] strangers from strange lands" (Voidsent, Ascians / Primals, and Garleans), allthewhile seeing yester with their eyes (the Echo) and making the morrow with their hands (securing the Seventh Astral Era).

In almost every instance of people speaking of you since defeating the Ultima Weapon, you've been referred to as the "blade of light" and "bringer of the dawn" (dawn = daybreak), etc. etc. etc., which all ties back to Yoshida's New Years hint that "The Blade of Light" would meet the "Blade of Might" in A Realm Reborn, and that both blades would vie to lay the primals low. (You vs. Gaius van Baelsar and Ultima Weapon vs. The Primals).

It takes a lot of puzzling out, but it's all linked and Daybreak was the one that started it, so I always start with it when I go through the list of titles instead of just saying, "You." Lightbringer, though, that one notsomuch. That was a sword from FFXI, it just fits with the general theme and I keep throwing it in there by mistake. For what it's worth, Breaker of Chains and Mother of Dragons probably aren't in the game, either. (Yet.)

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

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Somehow this post triggered a sense of Deja Vu. Thought the Mother of Dragons would make for some interesting interactions in the expansion

In the case of both Monk and Warrior, neither Bravura or Sphairai are unique weapons, but specific styles of weapons popularized by their original wielders. Sphairai fell out of use with the fall of Ala Mhigo (as they were likely rare beforehand) and Bravura stopped being produced when the blacksmithing clan that knew how to make them died out. In these cases you are more uncovering these lost styles of weapon rather than entirely unique legendary weapons. In these instances, it would be feasible for their specific NPCs to have one of the last surviving copies. Hope this helps.

@Morningstar1337

Yes and no. The lore of the relic quest conflicts with the first part I stated. The spear, the Gae Bolg, was basically the Dragoon womans fallen husbands lance. At first it wasnt the Gae Bolg but after several years of honing and fortifying it with powerful materials and metals, it became the modern Gae Bolg and she used that to kill the Dragon. Afterwards she abandoned the weapon, leading a life of cloth afterwards. (which would explain the fact the Ixal have it.)

This could also be a theory and its largely just head cannon but she could have been discovered as that she was the generations Azure Dragoon and after she went on her journey to forge the Gae Bolg and slay the wyvern who slew her love, other newer generations of Azure dragoons could have taken it up as a sort of tradition, forging a new spear for every generation of an Azure Dragoon in order to possibly replicate or just honor the Azure Dragoon who wielded the first Gae Bolg.

Okay so far we have:

• Thyrus: Unique, but loopholed via it's wielder aiding as a spirit.
• Stardust Rod: Mass-Produced
• Bravura: Mass Produced, but the blacksmiths that can make them died out. Also actually a style
• Sparhai: Mass Produced, but like Bravura the people that can make it are all dead.
• Curtana: Unique in name but there are two identical swords
• Holy Shield: Mass Produced, at least to match the swords
• Gae Bolg: Mass Produced, but there are only one for each Azure Dragoon

That still Leaves the Omnilex (though i think is mass produces, since the trophy mentions a "a copy of" before the name) Veil of Wiyu (I think it's unique) and Artemis Bow (betting on unique). That means that out of all the relics only Thyrus and Curtana so far are unique

Omnilex was standard-issue among the Nymian Scholars, so if you have one you can have as many as you want (provided you know the secrets of the books shape as well as its contents). The Veil of Wiyu was unique, but nobody else had one, I believe. I know at least Tristan used Ifrit's Grimoire on account of Ifrit and Belias being part of his story. The Artemis Bow's story sounds unique, but it's entirely possible that Godsbows have been making similar bows in memory of Gilbert for years. The Gods' Quiver had it in their possession until one of their holdings was overrun by Ixal, who trashed the relic, so it would have been available for study and re-creation until only recently. Again, there's a functional excuse, but not a canonical answer (as far as I remember, I haven't combed over the bard story arc in a while).

Again, the stories leave a lot of open doors and mostly just make it sound like most of the weapons were of a traditional but lost design and that your character finds one of the more important examples of the traditional style.

I always thought thought generation of Dragoon were crafted armors and weapons unique to them. Sure, Gae Bolg once belonged to the legendary dragoon, but every dragoon is given a similar lance.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

In the end, I think the cleanest way to look at the lore will be to assume that one great adventurer from each class guild gets tangled up in events that led them to take up the mantle of a "job of old" on their journey to banish the darkness. These adventurers then come together as one and work together, the "canonical party," so to speak, represented by the CG Party we see in SE's big cinematic. Each one person, each inheriting one job, then takes up the historical restoration of one relic, associated with that job, and upgrades it until it becomes the same as those that the Zodiac Braves wielded (and maybe beyond, who knows.

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That's the way I interpret the lore as well.

And this seems to have been implied early in the storyline as well, when you meet the Mothercrystal for the first time. If you recall, there were other adventurers with you (or, at the very least, one other elezen and roegadyn) at the the time. So, it's not too far a stretch for me to imagine that those guys also went on to become the epitome of their respective classes and jobs.

Lately, I've also begun thinking further about some of the themes of the game, and one of the predominant motifs is the "Echo" itself. If you think about it, much of the game is about reviving old knowledge to renew the present and refresh hopes for the future, be it in terms of us adventurers recovering the skills of ancient predecessors, or delving into the depths of the Coils of Bahamut, or ascending the lofty heights of the Crystal Tower.

In a sense, we're all trying to re-create a realm that's an echo of halcyon days long past. I don't know how well this interpretation actually sits with canonical lore, but I do know that I personally like it enough to try working it into my personal "head-canon" for Lyland. :)

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Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf

In a sense, we're all trying to re-create a realm that's an echo of halcyon days long past.

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I've had this thought, myself, but never went anywhere with it because of lack of evidence aside from "It sounds really cool." You might be more right than you know. Think about it; we're trapped in a repeating cycle of eras, but only seven cycles, and the ultimate goal of most factions so far is for that wheel to end on the world's "true form." Nael van Darnus thought it would "purify the world," and though we later learned that he was a puppet of Bahamut, who had a pretty specific idea of world purification, who's to say it wasn't also a warped version of his own goals? He himself was a scholar of the Divine Chronicles, and he confirmed in the Second Coil that (despite Bahamut's influence) he really did intend to perform an all out GUNDAM "colony drop" with the Meteor Project.

Likewise, the Ascians speak nonstop about "returning the world to its true form" and how we might see eye to eye if we weren't so ignorant. If we were trapped in something unnatural and needed to return the world to its rightful state, your theory would make a lot of sense, specially if every time you failed to do so, the world was further warped and twisted, turning civilizations into beastmen, creating primals, etc. etc.

The only thing that would need some fleshing out is how the deities fit into this - The Twelve, Hydaelyn, Zodiark - when the "true world" was finally created, whose outcome is the best? I mean, probably The Crystal, knowing Final Fantasy but, hey...

Of course, again, there's not much evidence for anything at this point, but at the end of Chapter 1, when all the first theories go up, someone always has the right theory from day one, just incidentally. Wonder who it'll be for XIV ^^

I interpret the Curtana story in that you actually do find the real, legit Curtana. However over the years it degraded to such a point that it's garbage now and unusable. You take the Curtana to Gerolt who says it's beyond repair, but instead of repairing it, you transfer the....."essence" into that base weapon he wants you to get him.

All the trials you do is a way to repair/reawaken the essence and acclimate it to the base weapon which slowly takes it over and reverting it's form. I haven't done the other relics except Omnilex so I dunno if that story matches others.

The base weapons all have a piece of the relics of old and thus inherit their legacies. This IS Final Fantasy, stuff doesn't need to make sense.

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Originally Posted by Lucke

The base weapons all have a piece of the relics of old and thus inherit their legacies.

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Yup, it's essentially the same as well for the summoner's relic, the Veil of Wiyu. The original was recovered from deep within the Sylphlands, close to where its owner, Wiyu, was said to have died while fighting Odin the Dark Divinity. And just like Curtana, the original Veil was in a terrible condition, and its essence had to be transferred to a new host.

The concept of "essence transfer" isn't too hard to work around — I like to think of it as a more advanced form of materia conversion and melding. Just that, in this case, we're not working with aether-filled materia, but the raw materials of the relic itself.

And like what I said above about the "Echo" as an overarching theme in FFXIV's story, the whole business about our relic weapons really boils down to a restoration of the old to renew the present, and refresh hopes for the future. In other words, our signature weapons are literally echoes of the past.

Interesting Tidbit about the Draken Mail/armor I found for lore reasons.

Apparently, the Draken Mail is holy or sacred and is imbued with magics of Dragoon's past and a set is crafted for every generation of Azure Dragoons. The Draken mail, pending on who you ask, is a required piece to complete the power of an Azure Dragoon and it allows the user to perform Dragonfire Dive, an extremely powerful and high level technique exclusive to the Azure Dragoon and few high level Dragoon's.

My head cannon though kinda believes that a bunch of bs though. Regardless if you are an Azure or not, you should be able to perform high level techniques like Dragonfire Dive, even if you dont have or wear the Draken mail, as long as youre strong enough as a Dragoon to use and perform it. This head cannon is further enforced by the fact that you can still use Dragonfire Dive, even if you wear diffrent armor aside from Draken Mail, like Austrum Mail or the High Allagan gear.

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Originally Posted by LiveVoltage

Interesting Tidbit about the Draken Mail/armor I found for lore reasons.

Apparently, the Draken Mail is holy or sacred and is imbued with magics of Dragoon's past and a set is crafted for every generation of Azure Dragoons. The Draken mail, pending on who you ask, is a required piece to complete the power of an Azure Dragoon and it allows the user to perform Dragonfire Dive, an extremely powerful and high level technique exclusive to the Azure Dragoon and few high level Dragoon's.

My head cannon though kinda believes that a bunch of bs though. Regardless if you are an Azure or not, you should be able to perform high level techniques like Dragonfire Dive, even if you dont have or wear the Draken mail, as long as youre strong enough as a Dragoon to use and perform it. This head cannon is further enforced by the fact that you can still use Dragonfire Dive, even if you wear diffrent armor aside from Draken Mail, like Austrum Mail or the High Allagan gear.

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While the technique Dragonfire Dive and the Drachen Mail do share the same cause -which would be the Dragon Eye recognizing your valor, thus bestowing its power upon you once you best Estinien- they are independent. The Drachen Mail was not given to you because you were not ready yet to acquire it, and the moment you were ready to wear it happened to be the very same moment you were ready to master this technique.

In "monk stories" (not FFXIV monk storyline specifically) it is not hard to imagine at least one in which the master teaches a pinnacle technique to his pupil - and when the pupil masters it, he is deemed worthy to wear some sort of bandana or belt.

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Originally Posted by ColdestHeaven

While the technique Dragonfire Dive and the Drachen Mail do share the same cause -which would be the Dragon Eye recognizing your valor, thus bestowing its power upon you once you best Estinien- they are independent. The Drachen Mail was not given to you because you were not ready yet to acquire it, and the moment you were ready to wear it happened to be the very same moment you were ready to master this technique.

In "monk stories" (not FFXIV monk storyline specifically) it is not hard to imagine at least one in which the master teaches a pinnacle technique to his pupil - and when the pupil masters it, he is deemed worthy to wear some sort of bandana or belt.

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Kinda the same idea I had for the Draken mail and Dragonfire Dive. It's pretty much coincidence that the player gets both things at the same time. I digress though.