Let's talk about Savage Coil. There are 2 big problems with it. Its too late for any changes for 2nd coil but with the Final coil coming out I hope Savage coil can have some changes this time around.
1. Incentive to run savage coil.
Our free company coil group beats the second coil of Bahamut turn 6-9 in about 1 hour each week, then we are done with end game for the week. Some people in the FC leveled alts to run coil again. Now then some people in the FC do not care about even trying savage coil because it drops the same gear as normal coil. They don't care about titles or achievements, all that really matters for the majority of the playerbase is the gear. It only takes a couple people in your FC coil group not willing to try it and makes the whole group not be able to attempt it. Ask any person who has beat T9 why they don't do savage coil its almost always because they don't want to do it because there isn't a big enough reward to do it. Personally I would do it for the titles and challenge but everyone is not like me they need that better gear motivation to do it.
Solution: I would make savage coil drop slightly higher ilvl gear, half a tier higher so 10 item levels. Also add in the bonus of having the gear look different then regular coil gear, do a recolor or make it dyeable. This would give every FC who already has normal coil on farm the motivation to step into savage coil and try it out.
2. Shared lockouts.
Having the Normal and Savage coil share lookouts doesn't work out so well. No other content in FFXIV shares lockouts for different difficulty levels. This way if some people in your FC coil group do not want to run savage coil can easily make another group with different people that are all interested. Getting locked out because you did normal mode just doesn't seem right.
Solution: Separate normal and savage coil lockouts. This will let you do both and if different groups if need be.
Problem with Savage Coil and suggestions
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10-04-2014, 10:02 AMZumiProblem with Savage Coil and suggestions
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10-04-2014, 10:35 AMCoatl
Make savage coil drop Dyable HA pieces. There..fixed!
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10-04-2014, 10:44 AMExstalExcept it's more work for the same gear. Celestial deities forbid, you need a specific piece and it never drops (like most of coil drops for anyone doing Turns 1-4).Quote:
Originally Posted by Coatl
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10-04-2014, 11:14 AMSarcasmMisser
As someone who has worked on savage turns and has clears my thoughts:
This is not farmable without it dropping a much higher tier of gear, which makes little sense when it is relevant for only 3 months, would be rng only which puts you at the mercy of our lord and savior and in all honesty would be a tier of gear for a minority of a minority. Just straight up it is hard and very tightly tuned and when the majority of the raiding population, which is still a minority of total subs, cannot do normal without overgearing it in full i110 it doesn't make sense to have it as anything more than an extra challenge. Yoshida has said in the past that he is comfortable with the current difficulty of the raids they have released and I agree with him, you may as well make raids tiered if you are going to drop upgrades in savage except the players in this game just plain aren't skilled enough to really justify harder raids.
So even if you add incentive, it would motivate more groups who are capable of doing it to do it but it is still a raid that lives up to its name; it is really damn savage and I don't see a majority of raiders being capable of pulling it off. The execution is damn tight, the timing required on the heals often has to be flawless, the DPS needs to be top class. Everyone I know who are cleared savage turns pretty much never wants to go into that instance again on the difficulty alone, farming it for RNG would be a nightmare unless we started to break the tuning.
I'd like better rewards but you can't justify it stepping outside the realm of vanity. Maybe an item with the achievement as well that gives a mount, or a vanity item to glamor on your weapon or armor. And separating lockouts is a must, they made it like a tier of progression in itself and expected people to all agree to delay their farm because of it for the same items. -
10-04-2014, 11:38 AMSapphicTotally agree, numbers for attempts on savvage, I feel, would have been much higher if they had given them seperate lockouts. Agree with keeping requirement to clear normal mode before you can access the savage version. But pretty sure I read somewhere they where thinking of seperating the lockouts for normal and savage going forwards. We, when progressing, where running 2-3, some weeks more, times a week. Now, its an hour and done. If it had been seperate lockouts we would have spent a day or 2 attempting savage also after getting the clear on normal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zumi
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10-04-2014, 11:44 AMSove92
Separate lockout is the only thing savage coil needs. That way people don't feel forced to do it, but also have an incentive to do it. Give a higher ilvl and people feel forced to do it, asking for even more nerfs in addition to the general crying for nerfs.
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10-04-2014, 11:46 AMSapphicWhich is exactly how I see the Savage versions, some who are clearing coil have asked previously for more challenging content, something to really sink their teeth and time into. Which savage (albeit it was implemented as a test to see what numbers would attempt it, and as my previous post stated, having same lockout has made those numbers lower than the expected for obvious reasons) was implemented for.Quote:
Originally Posted by SarcasmMisser
It's for those who want harder challenges, those who set games to the highest difficulty, even tho the rewards aren't any different than easier modes (talking single player games of course as an example for comparisons). Just managing to beat it is it's own reward, never mind the shinies. They are irrelevant to those who really want a challenge. -
10-04-2014, 11:49 AMSarcasmMisserIt's going to be separated when neither have a lock out anymore as in when the next raid comes out with new gear so there would be no point, you can overgear it and it isn't the same difficulty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sapphic
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10-04-2014, 11:55 AMSapphicNo, I was meaning further implementations of savage versions of content. eg third coil having seperate lockouts for normal and savage (if they implement it of course). Which would be logical to try and ascertain a truer number of those willing to try it without the present restraint of the shared lockout.Quote:
Originally Posted by SarcasmMisser
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10-04-2014, 12:13 PMSarcasmMisser
My personal hunch is that after this experiment there probably won't be any more savage. I won't complain if i end up being wrong.
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10-04-2014, 01:46 PMHavenchildIm almost 100% positive that people will farm Savage Coil if it gave Dyeable gear despite it being as you said, more work for the same gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Exstal
The sad part about this is that, there are many people that want to do Savage coil but between the shared lockout and lack of incentives, it looks like no one cares about itQuote:
Originally Posted by SarcasmMisser
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10-04-2014, 01:47 PMHeavell
@TS :
I agreed about shared lockout issues, i hope this wont happened again in the next coil. But, about drop more ilvl gear i against it, the challenge is just right with current best gear and will become easier with 3rd coil gear later. -
10-04-2014, 01:56 PMExstalNot if it shares lockouts >_>Quote:
Originally Posted by Havenchild
I've already resolved myself to complete it when it becomes unlocked because I want the achievements.　Also, this title is boss,
http://i.imgur.com/HwwnXLx.jpg -
10-04-2014, 01:59 PMCuria_RegisI don't know about that. All my friends who are into serious raiding are all doing Savage, and my group is as well (just started 2 weeks ago due to people being on vacation for the summer). I would say a good amount of people are enjoying the content, and I definitely hope they continue to add more Savage into the game as the game goes on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Havenchild
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12-14-2014, 12:32 PMcookiecutter
I hope they put savage back in for fcob and this time with slightly better ilvl gear (dye able or palette swapped version of the current gear would be fine). I know a lot of groups were lukewarm about doing it due to the lack incentives which is probably the primary reason why it was received so poorly. After you beat it one time there really is no incentive to beat it again. Here is hoping the expansion already has savage options at the get go. They mentioned two options so hopefully one of them is at the savage level of difficulty.
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12-14-2014, 01:55 PMJanhyua
So what do you do with your highest Ilevel gear now that you got it?
Stand around and show off? -
12-14-2014, 01:59 PMcookiecutterIt doesn't really have that much value to me. I'd probably just see how much more dps I could do with it and, that's about it. I mostly just like the challenge involved in it but, a lot people are need that extra gear to motivate them on top of the increased difficulty. Gear drops is one of the big reasons why people run coil every week. Basically its a virtual reward for their efforts. Basically with the way savage is set up currently it only appeals to a few types of people who are interested in difficult content. By adding better slightly different gear, the types of people who want participate go up and the desire to do that content weekly increases.Quote:
Originally Posted by Janhyua