Will ninja be STR or DEX based or will there be a new attribute?

Will ninja be STR or DEX based or will there be a new attribute? ty

I believe it gonna be dex, whould be more fair for the loots (Bard is alone on Dex items now), but we dont know yet, SE didn't communicate yet about this (last time they did, they said they didn't know yet what stat they gonna put)

The last words from SE were "keep your melee gear for levelling", which most likely precludes a new attribute, and "we have it decided (whether it's STR or DEX), but we may change it," which means it could be STR and stay, could be DEX and stay, or could be either and they could change it last minute.

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Originally Posted by Artiste

I believe it gonna be dex, whould be more fair for the loots (Bard is alone on Dex items now), but we dont know yet, SE didn't communicate yet about this (last time they did, they said they didn't know yet what stat they gonna put)

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I also believe it'll be dex for that reason and because it doesn't require that much re-wording in tooltips to have dex affect melee strikes. ...but that's my conjecture, and the last official word says right out it was still up in the air at least at the time they said it. One thing I am sure about is that while not perfect, there's discussion that happens about how decisions will affect the game, and I'm not looking forward to a 3rd job added to the STR accessory need list while BRD remains uncontested.

My guess from what they have said is that it will be dex. I am guessing it will have cross class with bard and monk given the skills they have shown. Will be fun to see what it is.

Heard it hear folks. It will be both strength and dexterity.

BRD is already a sad enough DPS, leave us alone :(

New attribute FST for Fast

It will b agility and charisma. Charisma increase dmg of ninjutsu and agility for melee

Drg and monk only shair accesories. If they make dex effect physical dps, they don't just have to change the tool tip they have to change the stat and how it works, how damage is calculated using dex for ninja would be different then how it is for bard, since bard is designed with the singing punishment in mind. It much easier on programming to just make it use str.

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

Drg and monk only shair accesories. If they make dex effect physical dps, they don't just have to change the tool tip they have to change the stat and how it works, how damage is calculated using dex for ninja would be different then how it is for bard, since bard is designed with the singing punishment in mind. It much easier on programming to just make it use str.

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Yes, but will Square Enix choose the easy path? Actually... strike that *thinks of atma*

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

Drg and monk only shair accesories. If they make dex effect physical dps, they don't just have to change the tool tip they have to change the stat and how it works, how damage is calculated using dex for ninja would be different then how it is for bard, since bard is designed with the singing punishment in mind. It much easier on programming to just make it use str.

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There's not that much to change. Hell, if they wanted to be really lazy about it, they could just make NIN abilities count as ranged attacks with a really short range, as far as coding goes.

Perhaps they'll add a new sub-stat for Ninja like AGL (Agility)

Only problem with that is it's a lot more work than just using DEX and calling it a day. Adding AGL would mean adding that stat to every left-side piece of "disciples of war" jobs lvl 1-49. Then what? Make a whole new set of myth+coil accessories for them?

Then there'd be new synths they'd need to make for AGL potions, etc...not worth it. If they want it to not be STR, it'll be DEX.

Yoshi doesn't want to tell so we don't stockpile gear. So we just stockpile both STR AND DEX!

He did say keep your DPS gear or some sort but that doesn't help as it has both.
The data mined from patch 2.35 or 2.25 I can't remember, was NIN traits and they had DEX boosting traits, these could easily just be placeholders or just a mistake.
Most recently they did say they didn't know yet (and it could change), perhaps they wanted it to be DEX but fiddling with the programming side of things created some issues so they might be considering STR for simplicity.
Most importantly though: MNK ilv80 CT gear.. How can NIN not be allowed to wear that......

So I've seen decent arguments for it being DEX and decent arguments for it being STR and Yoshi is keeping his stupid mouth closed for god knows whatever reason, personally I don't see how us knowing what primary stat it will use could harm anything by now.

Can't see it being DEX as that's primarily a ranged physical attack based stat and from what we've seen NIN is mostly close-combat, so it can only really be STR.

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Originally Posted by Firepower

Yoshi doesn't want to tell so we don't stockpile gear. So we just stockpile both STR AND DEX!

Most importantly though: MNK ilv80 CT gear.. How can NIN not be allowed to wear that......

So I've seen decent arguments for it being DEX and decent arguments for it being STR and Yoshi is keeping his stupid mouth closed for god knows whatever reason,

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Either him or another SE rep (think it was him though) "we have decided (whether it's STR or DEX), but we may change it".

So the fact they may change it before release would be a good reason not to say what it is right now... ;)

I agree about the Fuma gear, would be odd to not have NIN on it. They could just rename it and make "fuma" another set though. The existing set is ninja-esque, but not so much they couldn't make a new set and have it look more ninja than mnk's set, or have it be the exact same model like MNK/DRG ST gear. Or they could just add DEX to the existing set.

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Originally Posted by Skyl1n3

Can't see it being DEX as that's primarily a ranged physical attack based stat and from what we've seen NIN is mostly close-combat, so it can only really be STR.

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No reason it can't be. For every single job, the Attack Power stat is equal to STR. Except BRD, where Attack Power is DEX. Second Wind (among other things) is based directly on Attack Power, so this allows for BRD to use a skill designed around a STR class (MNK) at full power.

Can very, very easily just make Attack Power = DEX or VIT or PIE or whatever they want. So it's not a great reason.

Wild card, NIN can use DEX AND STR.

The balance reasoning people seem to enjoy throwing around makes no sense to me, The expansion will be probably be within 6 months by then new jobs will come in and upset the balance once again. Then changing how DEX is described as working for one class becomes pointless.

The most logical way to look at it is from an ease of use perspective, FFXIV plays massively to the casual crowd by making things as simple as possible. This is why the stat descriptions currently work so well, using a ranged weapon? stack DEX, using a melee weapon? STR. There is no description that allows for DEX to only work with nin and brd without making it confusing.

lets say you change it to DEX is precision, okay so far it makes sense, but all of a sudden you find a monk stacking dexterity; why? Monk appeared to be a precision based job to that player so they believe that dex is the correct stat.

okay so instead we name the individual weapons on the tooltips; DEX increases the damage of Bows and Daggers, easy enough... ohh but STR has to have the same treatment for clarity sakes, Strengths tooltip then included weapons from all current and upcoming tanks and melee dps, suddenly becoming much larger than it needs to be, and having people read through a list to work out what their weapon needs.

Finally a ninja in bard gear as opposed to monk? are you serious, this is really what you want to see?

I'm sure if they decide with DEX they'll have a good reason, but so far all the reasons i'v seen on this thread seem default to the idea of change for the sake of change, and I personally believe it should be a STR class, unless they have a massive overhaul on the job system that allows for the same clarity we have now.

what if it's str+dex/2?
also i think nin weapons will have lower damage like bard ones since im pretty sure thier poisons will lower defense like acid bolts

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Originally Posted by Zoeila

what if it's str+dex/2?
also i think nin weapons will have lower damage like bard ones since im pretty sure thier poisons will lower defense like acid bolts

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Too complex, also they'd get screwed over in stat potion use.

Biggest thing this all boils down to is if SE says "we may change what we've decided it to be", then they see both sides of the argument. Nobody should be going too deep into making logical reasons it should be one or the other; it's a game.

So if anyone is going to argue "it should be STR because they're not shooting arrows", my counter is this: If you sleep a bird, it should fall to the ground.

nothing points to dex , other that ppl desire to not have yet another STR job , but who cares? ppl only bring 1 or 2 melees to full partys , so u are exchanging your monk/drg for nin.

loot wise nothing will change (yeah u will see 4 nin LF 2 tank 2 healers for a while.....) , u will find 2 nin in every dungeon , but in a month no1 will care...because ppl will go back to their mains ,because nin isnt fun , or because there are 2000 nins around...ect

good times to play ranged dps in 2-4, because queues have been 5 min for melee 30 for rdps

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

Drg and monk only shair accesories. If they make dex effect physical dps, they don't just have to change the tool tip they have to change the stat and how it works, how damage is calculated using dex for ninja would be different then how it is for bard, since bard is designed with the singing punishment in mind. It much easier on programming to just make it use str.

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They already have done that with STR anyway, STR for DRG is calculated differently than STR for MNK, so it wouldnt be too hard to change the tooltip and have a different calculation for DEX on NIN

They also did it with INT, INT effect MAgic Damage for BLM differently thabn it does for SMN in terms of Calculation for Damage per spell. so honestly, they wouldnt need to do anything more complicated than what they already do.

What Warlyx guy said.

Not everyone will stay a ninja and if anything it will only really eat into the other melee dps numbers. 95% of the people that play tank/healer/r dps will go back to playing those roles because that's what they are good at or prefer doing.

So being str based would really help that cause. Just saying.

While I think its str based, I can see a side for dex as well (as dex would be agi in most other games and agi is what a rogue/nin would require)
Think on this though: we've been introduced to a rouge since 2.0 launch, Thrancred, who was a bard in 1.0; additionaly in most fights pre2.2, is treated as a gladiator (wielding a dagger but no shield). So being that brd is dex and gld is str, is SE trying to drive us insane?
I will say, after finding that tidbit of lore; started wondering if arc was one of the xclass for nin. I've always figured LNC would be the extra for Invigorate/Blood for Blood.

It will be pie.
Guildmaster will be Chris Farley.

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Originally Posted by Urielparadox

Drg and monk only shair accesories. If they make dex effect physical dps, they don't just have to change the tool tip they have to change the stat and how it works, how damage is calculated using dex for ninja would be different then how it is for bard, since bard is designed with the singing punishment in mind. It much easier on programming to just make it use str.

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That's actually not how STR and DEX are used. STR increases the Attack Power for Axes, Swords, Lances, Fisticuffs, Books, Staves, and Rods while DEX increases the Attack Power for Bows. This is a 1:1 ratio. Physical (non-magical) attacks have their damage based on a combination of Potency, Attack Power and Weapon Damage. Yes, if you wish to increase your SCH/WHM/BLM/SMN auto-attack damage you should equip STR accessories.

Essentially every weapon in the game has a switch on it (either DEX or STR) to determine Attack Power. All SE has to do is flip the switch on a weapon to change the stat it uses. They literally just have to change the stat description to:

STR: Increases Attack Power for Axes, Swords, Lances, Fisticuffs, Books, Rods and Staves. Increases Block/Parry amount.
DEX: Increases Attack Power for Bows and Twinblades. Increases Block/Parry rate.

(Or alternatively just list the classes with a tag of "and associated jobs")

INT does not need a change as 1 INT = ! Magic Attack Potency for every class/job, even DoW (the same holds true for MND and Healing Magic Potency).

By definition abilities such as Shield Lob, Tomahawk, Piercing Talon and Howling Fist are ranged attacks. In beta the first 3 were treated as such and had their damage based on DEX. SE then saw how low the damage was and simplified all physical abilities to scale off of Attack Power instead of STR/DEX. STR and DEX are now used to give Attack Power for their designated weapon class(es) and increasing parrying/blocking rates/amounts.

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

nothing points to dex , other that ppl desire to not have yet another STR job

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A couple patches ago there were some traits data mined belonging to rogue. Among those traits were DEX increases. While they were still in development and there is a slim chance that those traits don't belong to rogue the fact remains they exist and should be accounted for in regard to their potential main stat. Of course they could have been planted by SE to throw everyone off. IIRC it went "keep your melee gear" > DEX traits datamined > "we cant say yet" > "we still can't say but we may change it last minute"

How would either STR or DEX work with their ninjutsu? Aren't those magic-based attacks, which would require INT? :S

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Originally Posted by Sammich

How would either STR or DEX work with their ninjutsu? Aren't those magic-based attacks, which would require INT? :S

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They don't have to be magic and could scale off of Attack Power. One of the ninjutsu throws a giant shurikan which should surely be physical damage anyway.

This is also assuming ninjutsu deal any damage at all. With the concept of it being "assess the situation and use the proper mudra combination as the situation demands" all of the ninjutsu could be support effects in some fashion. They could also activate various effects our DoT's have since Yoshi stated that Rogue/Ninja DoT's will work in a different way than we currently understand them to work.

What I mean by that is we might be able to put a DoT on the enemy that ticks slowly and then the big fire ninjutsu may remove the DoT and apply the remaining damage immediately will the water may spread it like bane or something.

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Originally Posted by Sammich

How would either STR or DEX work with their ninjutsu? Aren't those magic-based attacks, which would require INT? :S

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And what, second wind should require MND right?

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Originally Posted by Sammich

How would either STR or DEX work with their ninjutsu? Aren't those magic-based attacks, which would require INT? :S

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Are you calling Naruto a wizard?

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Originally Posted by Mjytresz

Are you calling Naruto a wizard?

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Ninjitisu, Taijitisu, Genjitisu.

The three Catagories which define the skills of a Ninja.

Naruto sure isnt Smart, dummer than a box of rocks, but he never quits. I would say High STA.

well some ninjas are smart but personally i think they should add a new stat Agility and Charmisa should added Agi for ninja Charmisa for future healers

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Originally Posted by Valmar

Ninjitisu, Taijitisu, Genjitisu.

The three Catagories which define the skills of a Ninja.

Naruto sure isnt Smart, dummer than a box of rocks, but he never quits. I would say High STA.

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na he would be high vitality and modernitly high str

saskue would be high int and high dexerty with meduim vituality

Sakura would be high str and high int
(do i need to go on?

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

And what, second wind should require MND right?

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It might have been an idea at one point, but they say in the tooltip it goes off attack power so you know it doesn't; is why a DoW will heal for more with it than a DoM, vs cure/physik being the other way around.

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Originally Posted by Vapor

It might have been an idea at one point, but they say in the tooltip it goes off attack power so you know it doesn't; is why a DoW will heal for more with it than a DoM, vs cure/physik being the other way around.

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He's saying that in relation to ninjutsu and Ninja and applying sarcasm. If we already have a DoW class with a magical/healing ability that scales off of Attack Power then the odds of a Ninja's Ninjutsu doing the same are high if not guaranteed. If people want ninjutsu to scale off of INT then he's telling them to think about the other classes and their abilities having to scale off of non-main stats.