[dev1123] Reordering, Placing actions on bar with drag and drop

Along with seeing all 3 possible bars at once, you should be able to reorder actions on the bar with drag and drop from the bar. Additionally you should be able to drag actions from jobs menu onto the bar.

Interface should also work for Traits and crafting skills

Edit: Static abilities set by equipping main hand items and shields should also be movable by this function

Yes, please

Fully support this!

Fully support this too!

I don't see why the interface and assigning skills is so damn slow and complicated anyway. It's common sense to make it simple to swap out skills since you're going to be changing classes on the fly.

omg yes please. And while they are at it, drag and drop exchanges with retainers or other players as well.

It's also very confusing with the abilities that don't show up in the menus Guard, Light Shot, Phantom Dart and Spirit Dart. Yeah, you can change them with text commands but it would still be nice if we could drag them to new slots.

Se please do that thank u

Yes please. Is this an actual "in development" thing?

Also please conider allowing work to be done on the controls. I suppose nothing was done since changing direction and i do sincirely believe it needs work.

This is me beeing a geek. Something like a parallel PC interface which you would just plug on top of the PS3 interface. It's not as hard as a programmer would like to let it believe. It's just probably incredibly messy and a mother cat woudn't find it's kittens in there.

This is a proposed change to the current action bar changes from 1.18a, vote it up so they will implement it

When I change class, the set of abilities I was using the last time as that class need to be automatically equipped. This has to happen soon. Yes, I can make macros to do this, but I shouldn't have to - in addition, it takes forever to execute.

We'll be addressing drag and drop along with the upcoming action bar adjustments. In the future we are planning on making various adjustments and we are looking into additional features such as increasing the amount of actions displayed and being able to set items and macros directly on the bar.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

We'll be addressing drag and drop along with the upcoming action bar adjustments. In the future we are planning on making various adjustments and we are looking into additional features such as increasing the amount of actions displayed and being able to set items and macros directly on the bar.

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Why haven't these problems been addressed sooner? We heard very early on with Yoshi-P's first few roadmaps they would be revamping the action bar, UI, and class-change menus with the hope the core functionality would be brought up to speed with superior implementations in just about any MMO or even single player RPG. Now two major patches released or roadmapped and still nothing about this? Very disappointed.

To recap the main gripes I have with current implementation, and echoed by just about everyone I've spoken to or read comments from on the topic of UI/action bar:

1) Actions & Traits menu settings do not save or remember history when changing classes. This means users are constantly fumbling with a very slow and clunky UI when performing very simple core aspects of the game like switching classes. This is particularly frustrating when you swap from a higher class to a lower class, then back to the higher class as actions and traits will be bumped from your bars and you once again have to fumble around to try and remember what was switched. Macros help this situation somewhat, but I currently use 3 out of 5 macro pallettes solely for swapping out actions. This could all be solved by simply allowing users to save and set "Presets" or "Profiles" for action bar and traits settings on a per-class basis. Population of actions and traits should be instantaneous, not the current slow/clunky implementation.

2) Drag and Drop UI/Action bar. Action Bar and Abilitys should be accessible without having to interface the Main Menu overlay so that you can drag and drop or even click and cycle through abilities directly in the main UI. For example, if you could bring up actions with a single button like the new Config menu, then allow Abilities to be directly selectable with the Action Bar, this would cut out the need for having to bother with the Action/Traits Menu for changing abilities on the action bar.

3) Visibility of multiple Action Bars #1-3. Even if the other action bars aren't directly selectable when not in focus, displaying them in some kind of graphical representation allows users to keep track of vital recast timers. Implementation could be like a 3D wheel where the two non-focused bars are de-emphasized in the background.

4) Macro speed for changing gear and abilities/traits. This is still unacceptably slow, yet still no comment about this ever. Very discouraging.

Every time I see SE wasting time with non-essential changes and fixes like hiding main hand weapons/tools???? and /targetmode ABCDEFGH, but neglecting core issues like the ones above, it really makes me wonder where they are placing their priorities.

Stop breaking core functionality that people actually enjoy, fixing things no one care about, and please start addressing the main problems that have been around since Day 1. Thanks.

Definitely need an option to save abilities set on bar PER class!!! This is a no brainer... yet I've never heard a single dev comment about it :S

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

We'll be addressing drag and drop along with the upcoming action bar adjustments. In the future we are planning on making various adjustments and we are looking into additional features such as increasing the amount of actions displayed and being able to set items and macros directly on the bar.

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Thanks for the update, Bayohne! We do appreciate these updates from you, though we may have a gruff way of showing it.

Keep the info coming!!

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Originally Posted by Chiz

Why haven't these problems been addressed sooner? We heard very early on with Yoshi-P's first few roadmaps they would be revamping the action bar, UI, and class-change menus with the hope the core functionality would be brought up to speed with superior implementations in just about any MMO or even single player RPG. Now two major patches released or roadmapped and still nothing about this? Very disappointed.

To recap the main gripes I have with current implementation, and echoed by just about everyone I've spoken to or read comments from on the topic of UI/action bar:

1) Actions & Traits menu settings do not save or remember history when changing classes. This means users are constantly fumbling with a very slow and clunky UI when performing very simple core aspects of the game like switching classes. This is particularly frustrating when you swap from a higher class to a lower class, then back to the higher class as actions and traits will be bumped from your bars and you once again have to fumble around to try and remember what was switched. Macros help this situation somewhat, but I currently use 3 out of 5 macro pallettes solely for swapping out actions. This could all be solved by simply allowing users to save and set "Presets" or "Profiles" for action bar and traits settings on a per-class basis. Population of actions and traits should be instantaneous, not the current slow/clunky implementation.

2) Drag and Drop UI/Action bar. Action Bar and Abilitys should be accessible without having to interface the Main Menu overlay so that you can drag and drop or even click and cycle through abilities directly in the main UI. For example, if you could bring up actions with a single button like the new Config menu, then allow Abilities to be directly selectable with the Action Bar, this would cut out the need for having to bother with the Action/Traits Menu for changing abilities on the action bar.

3) Visibility of multiple Action Bars #1-3. Even if the other action bars aren't directly selectable when not in focus, displaying them in some kind of graphical representation allows users to keep track of vital recast timers. Implementation could be like a 3D wheel where the two non-focused bars are de-emphasized in the background.

4) Macro speed for changing gear and abilities/traits. This is still unacceptably slow, yet still no comment about this ever. Very discouraging.

Every time I see SE wasting time with non-essential changes and fixes like hiding main hand weapons/tools???? and /targetmode ABCDEFGH, but neglecting core issues like the ones above, it really makes me wonder where they are placing their priorities.

Stop breaking core functionality that people actually enjoy, fixing things no one care about, and please start addressing the main problems that have been around since Day 1. Thanks.

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Oh look another person who has absolutely no Idea what he's complaining about.. Ever Built a UI? Doubt it. Ever had to rebuild a UI someone else made? Doubt it. Get a life and quit being a Jerk. Some UIs have been known to take multiple years to make. You should be kissing their feet that they're even willing to consider it. And in case you were unaware, reading another persons code is like knowing Spanish and reading Portuguese, you'll get it done eventually but it's gonna take twice as long.

They said we are fixing it. Be happy.

Definitely agree with needing to have action bar skillsets saved for each class. Same goes for equipment. I'm really tired of needing to have 3+ macros set just to change my class once, and having to wait as each macro line executes one by one.

FFXI did this wonderfully with equipment between job switching. With custom skill equips now on top of it, we need it even MORE here in FFXIV.

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

Nice! Glad to hear it, even if it doesn't get done for 1.19 I'm happy to hear this is HOW the system will end up being. Now just get them to let us map all our gamepad/KB buttons to all sorts of crazy things!

I would wait an extra few days for this to be included in 1.19. thats for sure.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

Oh look another person who has absolutely no Idea what he's complaining about.. Ever Built a UI? Doubt it. Ever had to rebuild a UI someone else made? Doubt it. Get a life and quit being a Jerk. Some UIs have been known to take multiple years to make. You should be kissing their feet that they're even willing to consider it. And in case you were unaware, reading another persons code is like knowing Spanish and reading Portuguese, you'll get it done eventually but it's gonna take twice as long.

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Oh look another person who has no problem blindly defending the glaringly sucky aspects of XIV but has no clue what he's talking about.

Stop trying to make this overly complicated. The functionality needed to make this happen is already in place, all they have to do is make a little button for each class that says "Save Preset". After you've set all your action bars for a particular class, hitting the "Save Preset" button parses and delineates each action in text format to the same text file where your macros are saved in your Documents folder. Then when you switch to a class, the game automatically parses this text file and pulls/inputs the abilities for that class one by one for action bar slots 1-30 the same way they're input via macro. Done. Think of it as one big macro. Maybe one day if they got really crazy, they would be so benevolent to allow us 2....no.....3 of these presets for every class!!! Crazy talk...I know.

Not the best implementation but any of their l337 UI programmers could make this happen in 1 day or they should voluntarily resign, and they wouldn't even need to speak Spanish or Portuguese to make it happen. <.>

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They said we are fixing it. Be happy.

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Unfortunately this kind of blind optimism and naivity has gotten us nowhere after one year where these core issues still remain. Many of us have waited patiently hoping they would be addressed in the "mega" patches of 1.18 and 1.19 along with the other UI and battle/class changes they promised. Its obvious SE has glazed over these concerns, due largely to this "be happy they are fixing it when they feel like it" attitude exhibited by the resident fanboys on these forums. Please stop trying to defend the glaringly poor aspects of this game and allow the more creative members of the community try and make the game better by demanding more from SE and holding them to their promises. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

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Thanks for the update Bayohne and bringing this to the attention of those that can improve this for the better. This really should be a priority and implemented as soon as possible, even before 1.19 if possible. One of the cornerstones and hallmarks of FFXIV is the Armoury system and how it *should* make changing jobs seamless and easy, unfortunately, that's not the case due to the cludgy Action Bar/Trait/Abilities interface. Switching classes in SE games has always been a big draw; this should be an effortless afterthought that adds to the complexity, flexibility and fun of playing the game, it shouldn't be a deterrent that leads to frustration.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

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Wooo thanks for finally getting some info out on this :D Appreciate it^^ Even if its delayed, sounds great :)

From what I've observed, the reason this has been so tough to fix is that the server syncs abilities on every single change. This is why there's lag when you equip abilities or traits. It might be simple enough to make a UI for the functionality described, but I wouldn't expect rewriting the server-client process to add multiple abilities at once to be quick or easy.

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Originally Posted by Chiz

Oh look another person who has no problem blindly defending the glaringly sucky aspects of XIV but has no clue what he's talking about.

Stop trying to make this overly complicated
...
Unfortunately this kind of blind optimism and naivity has gotten us nowhere after one year where these core issues still remain. Many of us have waited patiently hoping they would be addressed in the "mega" patches of 1.18 and 1.19 along with the other UI and battle/class changes they promised. Its obvious SE has glazed over these concerns, due largely to this "be happy they are fixing it when they feel like it" attitude exhibited by the resident fanboys on these forums. Please stop trying to defend the glaringly poor aspects of this game and allow the more creative members of the community try and make the game better by demanding more from SE and holding them to their promises. Thanks.

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Agreed.. sad truth.
It really is better to speak up and voice our concerns consistently to get important changes done, i think it's obvious it brings results with community reps relaying our messages to the team, rather than waiting silently and hoping and then getting more disappointed when nothing happens.
Yes, surely SE has alot on it's plate, but with the way the game has taken path so far, including last year, i think they definitely need some guidance in regards to priority from a player's perspective. People do not have unlimited patience, we already saw how many have quit.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

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Thank you!
I would fully encourage delaying patch a bit for this if need be, this really is a huge frustration. I believe most people would want this ASAP.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

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Very good news! Thanks Bayohne ^^ I hope the testing goes well and it gets put into the 1.19 patch.

w00t! Along with the new class changes/ jobs this is on my top 3 of things that must be fixed.

I think should be a little more a priority, with the many calss switch you perform every day it's getting really frustrating to manage the action bar...

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

Our friendly neighborhood Japanese reps talked with Minagawa about all this setting action-related stuff.

We are currently working on addressing this so that actions for each class will be remembered when you change classes. When this feature is implemented it will remove the need to fix your action bar every time you change classes, as well as the need to set actions via text commands.

I'm sure you are all dying to know when this feature will be ready... We're currently aiming to implement this during patch 1.19, but depending on how development and testing progress, there is a possibility that it could be pushed back.

Sorry we can't make a concrete promise for 1.19, but hang in there just a bit more!

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Cant wait for this to come into place, will make setting actions alot easier!

I agree with everything Chiz has said in this thread.

Alot of people have quit this game after the 1st week of playing because of the UI. It's nice to finally hear something from Minagawa as the UI is what can make or break any game.

Bayohne you mentioned "increasing the amount of actions displayed" does that mean were finally gonna have all 3 bars on screen? pls say yes!

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Originally Posted by DoctorMog

I would wait an extra few days for this to be included in 1.19. thats for sure.

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I smell 1.19a

How about a "save this configuration" for currently set skills, having to use 3 macros to save a full set of skills for a job is a huge pain.

Been waiting for this since I first logged into beta...

This kind of touches on what we were discussing here previously, so I'll drop this post from the Japanese forums in here.

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Originally Posted by Triary

First of all, through battle reforms, we are looking to fix the issue of class specific actions such as Guard and Refill being set to action slots forcibly.

Next is the ability to customize sets of multiple actions for each class. As we previously stated, we will work towards storing actions for each class. After this, we will work towards being able to switch sets of actions according to the situation and making it possible to customize sets freely.

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Read it wrong,

Looks good!

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

This kind of touches on what we were discussing here previously, so I'll drop this post from the Japanese forums in here.

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This is very exciting. Something along a roles setup, where you can setup a role and when you switch to it, your gear (hopefully) actions, etc all pop back like you've built it to play. Something like this would make playing other classes in this game much less agonizing when switching.

(disclaimer, I don't think the game is agonizing, nor does it stop me from playing multiple classes, however, just thinking about the day when it wouldn't be such as hassle makes me happy).

This is really nice, and let me add: why dont adopt a similar system for equipment? For example, on my CON I got mainly 2 equipment sets: one for main heal (full mp... like Vintage Robe, Claret Coif, some m.acc gear etc...) and one for "blm mode" (Revolutionary Bliaud, Choker, etc)... But since I have some ideas, I'm gonna open a new thread :c

EDIT:
done, click

I'm looking forward to this. I'll briefly say "this should have been in from the start" but I'm glad they're addressing it. I just hope it's done soon.

Thanks again Bayohne for keeping on top of this. Really can't emphasize how much difference this would make in terms of day-to-day practical usage and allowing people to make the most of the Armoury System.

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Originally Posted by Moiren

This is really nice, and let me add: why dont adopt a similar system for equipment? For example, on my CON I got mainly 2 equipment sets: one for main heal (full mp... like Vintage Robe, Claret Coif, some m.acc gear etc...) and one for "blm mode" (Revolutionary Bliaud, Choker, etc)... But since I have some ideas, I'm gonna open a new thread :c

EDIT:
done, click

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Yea many people have suggested this over time with the hopes it would finally be implemented once they made all the underlying changes they said were necessary to classes and stat distribution.

The ideal implementation would allow you to have one or many presets for each class that allowed you to set which weapon/gear and action/traits you want for that preset. Then when you wanted to change to that class or even specialized build like you outlined, you would just press a single preset/profile instead of having to manually do all of this, or clunk around with 4-5 macros to accomplish the same thing.