If you haven't completed up to Tam-Tara Hard, spoiler warning.
So... We first meet/see Edda and her party outside of Sastasha. Avere was kind of a jerk to her.
Not too long later we see her and the team featured in an MSQ cutscene, revealing the tank died and the remnants of the group are ripping her a new one. But she seems well meaning...
A bit further along this time, we see her in the MSQ one last time... she reveals that she looks up to us, seems inspired to move on, etc etc. Perfectly good ending point that it was for a while. Still seems like a pretty well meaning gal...
Then Tam-Tara Hard comes along. I was excited for this. What had happened to poor Edda? But given the last time we saw her in MSQ... I was not expecting what we got. She wants to kill us (and her old 'friends') for Avere now? When did her evil switch suddenly flip?
I was kind of expecting maybe she got in over her head and we come to the rescue or something, not a complete 180 wants-to-murder-innocents-and-heros switcharoo.
So, I guess, did I miss something? If I didn't... did anyone else notice this? TT hard just doesn't seem to fit Edda, from what I know/have seen...
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08-22-2014, 02:25 AMRisvertasashiAnybody else... not as impressed by Edda's storyline? Did I miss a key moment?
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08-22-2014, 02:37 AMLaveah
when you find out that avere died you also learn that she's been carrying around his head in a bag. So it's not really an evil switch it's more she loves avere so much she'll do anything to bring him back.
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08-22-2014, 02:43 AMRisvertasashiBelieve me, that moment was very memorable... except that, by the final time we see her, she seems to have moved on somewhat. Now, I could understand her finding out that maybe this or that dark art could revive Avere, and then she gets in over her head or such... but deliberate, entirely of her own volition murder? Of even people she looks up to? She didn't even seem slightly remorseful about what she was about to do to you and her old companions...Quote:
Originally Posted by Laveah
That just... didn't seem at all like the Edda from MSQ. For all I could relate to her in TT hard, it seems like they might as well have just made a new NPC for the arc. :S -
08-22-2014, 02:54 AMNovaUltimatum
Personally I think most of the storyline elements of the game are bit over-hyped by some players, including this side story. It just doesn't seem that emotional or epic because we've barely got to know the NPCs all that much. I think creating an immersive story is exceptionally difficult to do though purely because this is a MMO. That, and I've probably been spoiled too much from the epic storylines of the offline FF games.
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08-22-2014, 03:10 AMRisvertasashiIn a way, I think that's it. I mean, it's a well done dungeon from a self contained point of view... But for Edda to suddenly become a remorseless killer? That's one hell of a change with so little development, opposite of where they last left off even. Or at least, that's how it seems from my PoV.Quote:
Originally Posted by NovaUltimatum
As for epic stories in MMOs... well, XI and XIV 1.0 had cutscenes pretty comparable to offline FF games; I think it could have been done. Even with the time/budget cuts to CSs in 2.0, I found a lot of stuff more immersive than this. Which... has just left me feeling like I missed out on a whole lot of background. -
08-22-2014, 03:14 AMLaveah
so I forgot about the torn folios all over the dungeon not sure if you read those or not but they seem to explain how it got to this end result we have with tam tamra hm. here's a reddit post that does a decent job of putting everything together http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen..._spoilers_all/
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08-22-2014, 03:21 AMRisvertasashiThat is an excellent post. Thanks for linking it. I think, this line in particular:Quote:
Originally Posted by Laveah
That I can see adding some plausibility... though I think I'll need to go over the cutscenes and maybe dungeon again to get a feel for it.Quote:
It is clear now. Edda has lost her mind entirely. I don’t believe she ever regarded the hero as a friend. She knew that Avere did, and that is all that mattered to her.
Anyway, thanks again. -
08-22-2014, 03:42 AMShyluv
The chick was crazy. Yeah, she admired us. So in her kookoo world, adding the arm of one of their friends, the leg of the other friend, and whatever of the player adventurer would make Avere happy cause his friends are with him forever, and so is the person they both look up to/admire.
It's not that she was evil. Just that she went crazy. -
08-22-2014, 12:43 PMWolfandre
Ehh, you're sorta right about her being nuts, but that sort of stuff should have been evident when we met her again in the main scenario. Doesn't it even say somewhere that she got rid of Avere's head? By the time we see her again, she's moved on and thanks you for being a model to follow. But then, in the torn folios, we're told that she pretty much just dug it back up again and started talking to it and going on dates. It's...kinda odd, I'll agree. Not exactly an appropriate change of pace.
I have a feeling that, since Yoshi said he wanted to give her a happy ending, that what we saw wasn't actually Edda. My guess is that it was just some voidkin that she found in her first visit to Tam Tara that took on her appearance or some other nonsense. -
08-22-2014, 02:09 PMmyahele
The only happy ending I can see is if she manages to revive Avere (albeit temporary) he tells her to stop doing what shes been doing and she kills herself to join him in the afterlife
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08-22-2014, 06:20 PMFJeromeActually even that conversation was a little worrying to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Risvertasashi
What Edda has to say about Avere;
But the one time we actually meet Avere, this is what he's like;Quote:
Edda: His name was Avere, and he and I were to be wed in the spring. You may not remember him, but to say that he remembered you would be an understatement. He would sing your praises from dawn to dusk. He saw you for what you are, you see - an adventurer's adventurer - and swore that he would be like you one day.
. . . I mean, it's possible he had a change-of-heart but I don't know if he'd be the type and he at least starts-off as a glory-hound and all-around mercenary bastard. Edda's grip on reality may just have never been the best.Quote:
Edda: <gasp> I-I’m sorry, Avere! I came as fast as I could!
Edda: I tried haggling with the merchant, but two potions was the best I could get with the money you gave me. I had no idea how expensive they were!
Avere: Ye’ve only ever been as useful as the contents o’ yer pockets─the gods know ye can barely ‘eal a scratch!
Avere: We took up the ‘venturin’ life to take on the big jobs an’ claim the big rewards. How’re we meant to do that if ye can’t even get our supplies in order?
Avere: Hm? It’s ‘er─the one Baderon was talkin’ to!
Avere: Well, we’ll see who gets the glory! This job should’ve been ours in the first place!
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08-23-2014, 12:11 AMFriendlyUncle
It's quite possible, and this is how I see it that this was un-reciprocated love. Edda stuck through the verbal abuse and harassment because she had feelings for Avere who probably did not feel the same. I think she sort of deluded herself into thinking that he had felt the same and when he died that last string sort of snapped and suddenly she could make her fantasy a reality. Her and Avere are to be wed, because who is to contest this with him gone to deny it? From that point on it was just a slow descent into madness grasping at anyway to make her dream a reality. She came across dark magics and rituals, if she couldn't have Avere in life she could pull him back from the brink as someone who may not have a will of his own. (For nerds out there, think of FMA and the Elric's increasing desperation at the loss of their mother, leading them to perform a forbidden and extremely dangerous transmutation to get her back.)
Just my take on it at least, I thought it was a good change of pace from other dungeons. It actually got me a bit interested in what happened to her from the last time we saw her to make her go so far compared to like, Brayflox HM where most of the story seems to be presented before the dungeon. This had some story presented within the dungeon which I think could have been better executed rather than mostly just bit of paper scattered on the ground.
So it's not super original, it's been done before but I still think it was a nice type of story to have in the game. I would like to see the story continued if not just to see what became of Edda. Had Avere in his last form survived? Did Edda? Will we be able to redeem her or has she gone too far? -
08-23-2014, 03:38 AMMagisKinda makes it even more dark. Avere's soul ripped from the dead and thrust into his decomposing head. His will bound to her, forced to "marry and love" her. She has show the ability to control the dead with Liavinne and all the trash mobs, so what's to say she didn't force the dead Avere to "love" her.Quote:
Originally Posted by FriendlyUncle
PS: How do you pronounce Avere? I say AH-VREY, but I could see it being AH-VEER. It looks French, Google Translate says E-VARE. -
08-23-2014, 05:46 AMPhylloQuote:
Originally Posted by FJerome
Well, you also have to count the fact that even if only a few hours passed between sastasha and tam Tara for us, for the characters it's actually been days if not weeks, not to mention the fact that you have lots of side quests and gradually become more and more famous.
When we meet avere before sastasha, it's the first time we meet so to him we're just opponents in the mercenary business and since your party is canonically the one who cleared sastasha, he might have started to look up to you since you succeeded where he failed.
Also, he could have been a jerk to Edda but been a nice guy toward everyone else.
Magis>> personally I pronounce it Ah-Vaire (vaire like fair) -
08-23-2014, 12:19 PMTerrini
Liavinne loved Avere. She says so when you meet her at the Waking Sands:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liavinne
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08-26-2014, 12:25 PMWadoka
Psychotic break. It happens.
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08-26-2014, 05:13 PMNialleLiavinne even says that Edda always struck her as weird. So you're probably right and she was a creep from the start, but the group tolerated her because she was a healer.Quote:
Originally Posted by FJerome
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08-26-2014, 08:35 PMDoctaruRavenbeExcept her control of Liavinne isn't really complete. Liavinne was able to shoot down the zombie mobs attacking us, while she is forced to fight us. Ever her last words of unlife were of her own choosing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Magis
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08-26-2014, 10:23 PMAshkendorThat's an interesting take on it. I hadn't thought of it quite that way, that she was shooting them on purpose.Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctaruRavenbe
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08-26-2014, 10:46 PMMercuryDThis. I think her dying words are "I told them there was something strange about her..."Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctaruRavenbe
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08-26-2014, 10:52 PMRickiFake02Technically she's aiming at YOU (or whichever member of the party she targets) and not aiming at the adds. You just stack the two people together and she takes them all out on accident.Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctaruRavenbe
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08-27-2014, 08:33 PMDoctaruRavenbeYeah and I kinda touched that. However she could have easily not used an AoE arrow attack when she targeted us during that fight. So I still hold to that belief somewhere inside that hunk of zombie flesh, Liavinne is fighting against Edda's control :3Quote:
Originally Posted by RickiFake02