DPS related questions, mostly SMN.

Hello, I've just hit level fifty with my main job of BLM, this would be the second MMORPG I've played, and, while not extremely knowledgeable about the genre in general, or this game, I have a fairly good grasp of what I'm doing, and my BLM is equipped with ilevel90 gear, minus a ring and my weapon, which I've been grinding Titan Hard to get a better one. I have never done a raid in any game, and, although I understand is end game, I really don't have an idea what the coil is. I do have a basic understanding on what are the strengths and weaknesses of the BLM and SMN.

That info is provided to help you know what I know and will tend to understand. I appreciate your replies and assistance.

So I have a 50 BLM, I like the design of the job a lot, but I don't like the RNG aspect of it, so much I've been leveling my SMN as well, whom is now level ~40. I have no interest in playing a DOW class (although Archer is not bad)

I actually don't much care for the summon concept, although I am familiar that its really not about summoning, more about the DOTs. When I play the SMN I feel fairly weak, now I understand that a well geared BLM (at least OK) will deliver more damage than a much worse geared SMN, even against similar level's but when I evaluate the jobs and class, it seems like the SMN is actually weak.

Because of my strong preference to the DOTs over the summon, I first evaluated if the Arcanist would be a viable end game DPS unit. My first question is this:

Do you think there is a class out there that is viable in its role at end game?

In my evaluation, I noticed the SMN has 6 things going for it naturally over the ACN. The 5 spells and the damage increase to the summons. The ACN has access to all of the other classes cross class skills, least the ones it can use, and access to five more. In my evaluation, I ignored skills from THM and ARC, since the SMN can access them as well.

So the SMN has extra summon damage, a 10 point increase. This is minor in my opinion.
Summon 3, which is, as I have read, less useful than Summon 1 (after the upgrade).
Fester, an extremely powerful spell with a power of 300.
Tri-disaster, fairly useless in most places, although of course is useful.
Spur, a huge 40% increase in damage to summon.
Enkindle, of course powerful, but with a 5 minute CD, it seems fairly useless except saved for when you require the extra burst.

Question 2: Is the power of the SMN really so closely tied to just spamming Fester? I know there is more power there, but it seems a little simple, other than when you want to spread the infection, and need mana or HP, is this really what the SMN does to deal damage, just uses it as much as possible? (of course it requires Aetherflow).

In contrast, the ACN gets access to quite a few useful spells, but like I've said, this is for the DPS role only (so we would ignore useful things like protect and the like). There are 3 spells with would be added that the SMN would not have.

Aero, which is in line with the liking of DOT spells, I understand this is not the most powerful spell but I believe, after you read what I've considered, that this may be viable.
Blood for blood. I've read that the summoner is about 75% of the DPS and the summon is 25%. If we compare this directly to Spur, the 40% increase, we would see this comparison:

X is the DPS of your summon, therefore your DPS is estimate to be about 3X, the SMN would use Spur and the DPS would change to: 3X (yours) and 1.4X (summon), total DPS would be 4.4X
If you use Blood for blood, that would change to: 3.3X (yours) and 1X (summon), total DPS of 4.3X

Blood for blood also has 2/3 the CD.

Lastly there is the PUG spell of Internal Release, which, as DOT can crit each time, would mean there is a lot of potential to crit. Based on what I've read and done the math for, the most crit you can achieve alone is about 20%, and this would increase it to 24%*

*huge note, I made this comparison when I thought it was a 10% increase, as I've just read, its actually a 20% increase. I won't do the math right now, but with only a 60CD, that makes it very useful, especially since Contagion is on 60 seconds as well, and the spells would last at least 30 seconds (the second one cast of either Aero or Bio 1, enhanced), means that its realistically up for each fight.

If you had 3 targets, and you used Internal Release (blood for blood and raging strikes are opinion here of course), you would have 6 DOT spells targeting 3 different things, over 3 seconds, as well as a ruin from you and about 2 attacks from your summon, that means that you would have an average of 7 spells that could crit every second, with a crit of 24%* that means that would crit each second probably about twice, in theory of course.

Question 3, is this viable do you think? If not, why please.

Why only 1000 characters? So short.

Edit your starting post TC, the 1000 character limit is ONLY for when you first post it. You can edit to bypass it.

Ah thank you for the advice. Since there are so many posts already it would seem to be useless unless I can also delete posts?

Do you think there is a class out there that is viable in its role at end game?
- All classed have their own weak and strong points. Currently they are balance and viable in dps role.

Question 2: Is the power of the SMN really so closely tied to just spamming Fester? I know there is more power there, but it seems a little simple, other than when you want to spread the infection, and need mana or HP, is this really what the SMN does to deal damage, just uses it as much as possible? (of course it requires Aetherflow).
- DoTs alone already powerful in damange and by pass bosses' mechanic (ticking while you are dodging aoe),
DoTs contributed around 50%, Fillers like Ruin I,II, Fester around 25% and Pet around 25% of your overall damage

Question 3, is this viable do you think? If not, why please.
- SMN has no access to Blood for Blood and Internal Release but only Raging Strike. Your theory is invalid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tOnni3

Do you think there is a class out there that is viable in its role at end game?
- All classed have their own weak and strong points. Currently they are balance and viable in dps role.

Question 2: Is the power of the SMN really so closely tied to just spamming Fester? I know there is more power there, but it seems a little simple, other than when you want to spread the infection, and need mana or HP, is this really what the SMN does to deal damage, just uses it as much as possible? (of course it requires Aetherflow).
- DoTs alone already powerful in damange and by pass bosses' mechanic (ticking while you are dodging aoe),
DoTs contributed around 50%, Fillers like Ruin I,II, Fester around 25% and Pet around 25% of your overall damage

Question 3, is this viable do you think? If not, why please.
- SMN has no access to Blood for Blood and Internal Release but only Raging Strike. Your theory is invalid.

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My third question was a comparison between the Arcanist Class, equipped with Blood for Blood, and Internal Release, and the Summoner Job, with the normal stuff available to them.

There is actually no class which is better without the job crystal equipped. The job benefits more from the gear's stats (has been proved by theorycrafters) and this is far better than keeping 3 cooldowns.
Furthermore in the case of SMN, the fester and contagion spell are powerfull, playing without them is a great loss, and you still have access to Raging strike and Swiftcast...

Just as a reminder, with keeping the same stuff, you'll earn between 5% and 10% dps from your gear only with job's equipped, and a Blood for Blood gives 10% for 20s every 80, same as constant 2.5%.

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Originally Posted by Ejell

There is actually no class which is better without the job crystal equipped. The job benefits more from the gear's stats (has been proved by theorycrafters) and this is far better than keeping 3 cooldowns.
Furthermore in the case of SMN, the fester and contagion spell are powerfull, playing without them is a great loss, and you still have access to Raging strike and Swiftcast...

Just as a reminder, with keeping the same stuff, you'll earn between 5% and 10% dps from your gear only with job's equipped, and a Blood for Blood gives 10% for 20s every 80, same as constant 2.5%.

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Could you explain what you mean, why does the job get more power from the same items? The current ilevel115 weapons and armoretc 110 stuff can be used on the ACN and the SMN equally and provide the same stats. Does the SMN get more?

I would agree with you 100% if Contagion was not usable, but you actually can use it, it just has the level requirement of 40 to use.

No party would take a ACN just fyi. Not only do you lose 10% of all stats, losing fester is like losing a 1/4 of your damage.

Only class that is situationally better then job is maradar in pvp, and its not even by much.

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Originally Posted by NightReach

No party would take a ACN just fyi. Not only do you lose 10% of all stats, losing fester is like losing a 1/4 of your damage.

Only class that is situationally better then job is maradar in pvp, and its not even by much.

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Oh I understand now, I was not aware that the crystal would increase your stats by 10%, that makes sense. That would mean, like you said, there really isn't a viable class for end game. Thank you!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NightReach

No party would take a ACN just fyi. Not only do you lose 10% of all stats, losing fester is like losing a 1/4 of your damage.

Only class that is situationally better then job is maradar in pvp, and its not even by much.

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You lose about 20 INT / Fester / Spur and Enkindle.

I'm not sure you can recover the DPS loss from that with just internal Release and Blood for Blood.

Not to mention the loss of some potency off of your pet's main attack. It's a 10 potency difference between Wind Blade and Gust I think it was?

It's been proven many times that ACN is inferior to SMN at DPS many times everytime somebody comes up with the idea.

The buffs you get don't make up for the int or skills from the soul crystal.

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Originally Posted by ICEFANG13

My third question was a comparison between the Arcanist Class, equipped with Blood for Blood, and Internal Release, and the Summoner Job, with the normal stuff available to them.

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if so, the reply is same as others, B4B, IR can't make up for loss of stat point, Fester, Pet dmg, Pet skills.