Eldibus and Laharea

I wonder what relationship these two have. As Eldibus had suggested in 2.1, Lahabrea was blinded to truth. So, in terms of 2.3 being our lead in to the Zodiark Storyline (probably expansion), what does an Overloard of the Ascians and Emissary have to share with us story wise?

Well, this is just how I understood it while playing through the main storyline, but it just seems to me more that they disagree over their opinions of the Echo and about those who possess it (namely, Lahabrea regards the Echo as nothing but an 'anomaly' and Echo users as hindrances to his plans, where as Elidibus seems to be more of the mind "The Echo is interesting - their power is like us, maybe we can come to an arrangement with them?"). But I guess we'll see in 2.3. :)

Thread isn't tagged for spoilers, so gonna put this in a hidden block:

We learn from Minfilia that there's three "states of being" for lack of a better term: the corporeal realm, the aetherial realm, and then this state of limbo that's in between. When people die, their aether is released and goes to the aetherial realm. When people are born, aether is returned from the aetherial realm to give them life. Apparently the Ascians know a "trick" (and according to Elidibus, Echo users, when able to fully utilize their power, should be able to do the same) that allows them to float their aether in limbo until they find another suitable host in place of their physical body that was just killed. (or they just decided to transfer out of)


Anyway, not sure why I wrote all that up now. It was pretty interesting to learn, and now the Scions need to find some kind of device, like the darkness crystals, that can trap the Ascian's aether before they're able to manifest into another corporeal form.

Near the end of the main storyline we see this realm (which I assume is the limbo area for the Ascians, or the Void perhaps) where the twelve (I still think there's a real connection here with Eorzea's gods...) Ascians + Elidibus are convened to discuss the going ons of the Primals and such. With Ramuh's defeat there's only one Primal left. Until 2.4 comes we won't really know what Shiva's intentions are. Right now she's doing very little than sending out raiding parties of Ishgardian heretics, so we don't even know which beast tribe (if any) is associated with her. If Shiva is defeated, will the Ascian's grand plan come to fruition?

We also see that the Ascians appear to be running the show in Ishgard, which adds a new layer of complexity to the heretics that are devoting themselves to dragonkind's cause. The Ishgardians have all but withdrawn themselves from the going ons of the lands outside of Coerthas. Makes you wonder if the Ascians had a hand in keeping Ishgard from entering the Eorzean Alliance pre-Dalamud's arrival, or if it's been going from even long before then.

Lots of things were touched on during the main storyline this patch, but it just tends to leave even more questions. Can't wait to see what 2.4 brings us. Obviously things aren't quite tied up with the Ul'dahn Syndicate member yet. While I feel it's kind of early in the game for Omega Weapon to surface, that'll definitely be something to look out for.

see spoiler

I think you have missed their conversation that men itself can summon or make a god/primal,

At the end it seems ascians are going to teach the "holy see", how to summon halone the furry or creating a false god to combat the north. Just like Al Mighan summon their god, which may also taught by ascian and ultimately lead to the end of their nation.

Or there might be 2 faces of god can be summons like dark and light crystal, every crystals have their polar opposite side. We have seen so far might be there chaotic side.

On the note of the lesson we received from Minfillia & Co.:

We learned about how Primals differ from "souls" of men and those of ascians. We know that Primals have an "essence" that is in the Lifestream, which needs an aetheric boost to create a corporeal form in the physical plane. From the way Ramuh spoke, it seems he has been around in the Lifestream and world for a long time - particularly with his comments about darkness not being there in the beginning (were the Primals the ones alive in the 1st Astral Era? Who knows...). We got a lot of answers about the different planes, but we have yet to get one for "what is an essence" which has been a big part of the many primal discussion threads on these very forums.

I feel that perhaps Shiva might let us explore this idea of an "essence" in some way, maybe. Perhaps the "creation" of a primal rather than just a pure summoning?

Then again, I also thought she had tempered the Ishgardians! Who knows!

I didn't read it that way. I read it

that they had been influencing the Archbishop all along. Which includes withdrawing from the Eorzean Alliance. Going back a fair bit in time, at least to The Battle of Sivlertear Skies and the primals initially being unsealed. As the people following the person who is likely Shiva in Elezen form are called "particularly zealous heretics," I believe they may be using her to try and convince the Archbishop to do something like summoning Halone. I just don't think they showed up overnight, or after Dalamud fell. I believe they've been manipulating, or trying to manipulate, the big man in Ishgard for quite a while now. My thin evidence is that Ishgard refusing to help with the primal threat has been a significant blow to OUR efforts.

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Originally Posted by Saikou

What the actual <kupo!>? The spoiler tag is not actually [ spoiler ] [ / spoiler ]? Then what the <kupo!> is it!?

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[ HB ] Hidden Block [ / HB ]

Thankyou, Catapult. HOWEVER, we're talking about fricken Ascians. May we just assume that there are spoilers for everything? Is there anything of significant substance we would talk about in a thread such as this, on the topic of Ascians, would not be entirely spoilerific? A poll, submitted for your approval.

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Originally Posted by Orophin

Apparently the Ascians know a "trick" (and according to Elidibus, Echo users, when able to fully utilize their power, should be able to do the same) that allows them to float their aether in limbo until they find another suitable host in place of their physical body that was just killed. (or they just decided to transfer out of)

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In regards to trapping souls:

I am curious as to what exactly Ultima Weapon was doing with the Primal's essences -- I was under the impression it was consuming and trapping them, similar to what we now want to do with the Ascians. Therefore, could the key to imprisoning Ascian souls lie in Allagan technology?

I just can't wait for Omega. Oh wait, I'm off topic. I'll leave.

I always assumed that Ultima, through The Heart of Sabik, had imprisoned the primals that had already been summoned. Which could make it useful for what we are apparently trying to do to combat the Ascian threat.

You know before the Sabik reveal, didn't we use a crystal that granted our Garlean Reaper sentience? What if that becomes like the heart of sabik? capable of capturing the disembodied?

Mammets are like, semi-alive clockworks; that's what we used in Maggie that gave her a personality (a Mammet heart). I don't think it's a very advanced kind of magic.

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Originally Posted by Nialle

Mammets are like, semi-alive clockworks; that's what we used in Maggie that gave her a personality (a Mammet heart). I don't think it's a very advanced kind of magic.

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Yeah but all this talk of crystals and our reaper becoming sentient (to an extent) kinds screms Chekhov's gun (Granted she already pulled it once in the Praetorium).

There is another possibility. What about those corrupted crystals we used to fight Garuda and Leviathan?

I have a feeling that we will eventually come to a storyline where the magic behind Mammets is explored, but I don't think it has anything to do with absorbing distilled essence of primal. My thought, anyway.

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Originally Posted by Kyan

On the note of the lesson we received from Minfillia & Co.:

From the way Ramuh spoke, it seems he has been around in the Lifestream and world for a long time - particularly with his comments about darkness not being there in the beginning (were the Primals the ones alive in the 1st Astral Era? Who knows...)

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Just wanted to point out that:

Ramuh didn't say there was no darkness in the beginning, he said there was no duality in the beginning, meaning there was no distinction between the two. The implication here is that Hydaelyn and Zodiark did not exist to create the light/dark dichotomy in the first place.

I LOL'D at Halone the "furry." brooklynfurry.jpeg

On topic, these are all interesting theories, especially the ones leaning toward the creation of primals, rather than necessarily summoning them. Consider that, while technically not a primal, King Moogs is born into this world under the same circumstances. Who's to say that the Ascians aren't actually brought about in the same way? An earlier post mentioned the story arc in Little Ala Migo, where one of the younger citizens was beguiled into trying to summon Rhalgr. Isn't that the same thing as Moogs?