Mentor program, wherefore art thou?

I may be called old-school, but I firmly believe that the mentor program from FFXI needs to be re-implemented. Half of my friend list no longer has a character (need to organize that soon) because of the caustic atmosphere in regards to new players; in particular their questions. There is no sense of support on this game right now, or at least very little. If a new person asks a question, they get either get rudely rebuffed/mocked, or they get the famous "Watch/read a guide." Maybe I am one of a very few, but I would love to mentor new players; it builds a sense of camaraderie/friendship without committing the new player to a FC/LS. Granted, if such a system was implemented there would need to be ways to make sure mentors do not abuse their status, but it was a wonderful system in FFXI, and I think it will make FFXIV ARR more personable.

Questions/comments/suggestions?

I like the suggestion, but I dislike the fact that we would have a need for it. I just try to mentor new players whenever I can, but I just figured it was common hospitality. Then again, I don't involve myself in regular DF (without one friend at the very least). I just wish we didn't need it and that people just help the newbies out with either actions or words of wisdom.

That being said, I would totally sign up for the mentor program.

I can definitely understand your viewpoint Leira, and I wish we didn't have a need for it, but the actions of others are telling. Maybe it's just my server, but common hospitality isn't common here. I'm hoping that the mentor system shows people that there ARE players that will help simply for the sake of helping :)

LOL forgot all about that... the big M by peoples' names was almost inevitably a sign they didn't have a clue about anything. Good riddance to that and any kind of mentor program people can sign up for without any qualifications whatsoever.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

LOL forgot all about that... the big M by peoples' names was almost inevitably a sign they didn't have a clue about anything. Good riddance to that and any kind of mentor program people can sign up for without any qualifications whatsoever.

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Oh so you mean the blind leading the blind.

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Originally Posted by Awrini

Oh so you mean the blind leading the blind.

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Also the blind trying to lead people that actually knew what they were doing.

Well, if they implemented that it'd at least renew the concept of having an easy way to distinguish players to not associate with.

Can't speak to FFXI since I never played it, but maybe they could instate mentoring with some base requirements to make sure it's slightly less the blind leading the blind?

In any case, FFXIV was my first MMO, and I picked both main class (Conjurer) and my server on a whim without realizing that I should look for servers with larger numbers of newer players and probably pick a less important role first... My first time in Sastasha was me and three level 50 players (lord knows what they were doing there). The first "advice" I ever got from another player was "Speed up and heal better." Seriously? I would have loved to have a higher leveled player give advice on skill usage or even just remind me that being new doesn't make you cursed or something...

I think it's a nice thought, at the very least, even if it might come with its own share of difficulties.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

Good riddance to that and any kind of mentor program people can sign up for without any qualifications whatsoever.

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Granted, if such a system was implemented there would need to be ways to make sure mentors do not abuse their status, but it was a wonderful system in FFXI, and I think it will make FFXIV ARR more personable.

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As I said, there would need to be restrictions; it wouldn't be something anyone can join with no requirements whatsoever. Doing so would be begging players to abuse the system.

I would totally be in favor of something like this.

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Originally Posted by Leira_Raine

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HI TALIA! :o:):o:):o:)

but yeah, I definitely feel like something like this could work. However, I think their would need to be some prerequisites, and maybe some randomly generated, 20 question, multiple choice quiz regarding more advanced things in the game (and they have to score 90% or higher to pass). Also make it so the quiz can only be attempted every six months.

If someone wants to be a mentor, and doesn't have the patience for a quick 20 question quiz; they definitely are not cut out for the job and they should not be allowed to be one.

Oooh, that's a good idea. And having it so that during the quiz, tabbing out of FFXIV ARR is considered forfeiting said quiz. This way we prevent people from just using wiki while taking the quiz. This may be a pipe dream, but I'm hoping someone from SE reads this thread; this needs to be done.

Instead a quiz, or along with a quiz without attempting those restrictions. Adding in a series of instanced tests you can do to obtain mentor ship. Ones that will test your basic knowledge of the game where you do battles and then answer a few questions, after you beat it you earn a temporary Mentor badge. You would need to retake it later for re-certification.

The reason it shouldn't have those restrictions with tabbing out would be, those with smartphones/2nd laptop or pc can still look it up. Think of the exam as the SeeD exam from FFVIII.

Mentor program, why are you

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Originally Posted by Aarik

Oooh, that's a good idea. And having it so that during the quiz, tabbing out of FFXIV ARR is considered forfeiting said quiz. This way we prevent people from just using wiki while taking the quiz. This may be a pipe dream, but I'm hoping someone from SE reads this thread; this needs to be done.

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Agreed.

I mean, it may seem like some hoops to jump through, but being a mentor is a status symbol and it's something that requires a lot of patience. So, while I think it's a good idea, and I support it; I don't think it's something that should be handed out, like in FFXI. I say this for the same reasons voiced by a few of the other commentors.

If others just want to help people out of the goodness of their heart, that's fine, and they should do that. However, that is not equal to what's necessary to take up mentoring.

That's why I feel the requirements should be a bit rigorous.

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Originally Posted by Sayoko

Instead a quiz, or along with a quiz without attempting those restrictions. Adding in a series of instanced tests you can do to obtain mentor ship. Ones that will test your basic knowledge of the game where you do battles and then answer a few questions, after you beat it you earn a temporary Mentor badge. You would need to retake it later for re-certification.

The reason it shouldn't have those restrictions with tabbing out would be, those with smartphones/2nd laptop or pc can still look it up. Think of the exam as the SeeD exam from FFVIII.

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This also an excellent idea. I love it ^_^

Nice suggestions! Didn't even occur to me that people would simply use other devices lol, I like the idea of mentoring requiring a license that has to be renewed often via battle/questions :)

I support a mentoring system, make it so you have to have a Relic Weapon to unlock. Least this way it'll solve issues without having to be insanely difficult to achieve while the player in question should have general knowledge of the game since they have a Relic Weapon.

Meh. Tests sound boring to me.

They should make use of the achievement point system and have a certain amount of points, or certain achievements to qualify for mentorship. Sure, people who get carried through content will have access, but I don't really care that much.

How about if a mentor is bad, and a follower finds out then leaves him, the mentor suffers a penalty? The penalty could be a lockout from mentoring someone new for x amount of time or simply loosing "mentor points".

Mentor points could be just like reputation points. A certain amount gives you access to a NPC that sells mounts and etc. You earn mentor points by running dungeons with your apprentice(s) or whatever you want to call them, killing a certain amount of mobs per day with them, doing a certain amount of FATEs with them per day or something.

Dunno. Just a passing idea.

I tried to mentor and give tips to some players from time to time...and the response I've usually been getting is [/ignored] or "DON'T TELL ME HOW TO PLAY!" So I just gave up on it. I only care nowadays when it comes to a friend.

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Originally Posted by Danbo05

I try to mentor some players from time to time...and the response I usually get is [/ignored] or "DON'T TELL ME HOW TO PLAY!" So I just gave up on it. I only care nowadays when it comes to a friend.

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Yeah. I wouldn't use the mentor program because newbies can be vicious and mean. That doesn't mean I wouldn't want a program implemented. Whoever is willing to risk getting their hands bitten off should be rewarded.

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Originally Posted by Danbo05

I tried to mentor and give tips to some players from time to time...and the response I've usually been getting is [/ignored] or "DON'T TELL ME HOW TO PLAY!" So I just gave up on it. I only care nowadays when it comes to a friend.

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In this case the mentoring system would benefit that because those who would seek out a mentor aren't the same as those receiving it without seeking.

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Originally Posted by Danbo05

I tried to mentor and give tips to some players from time to time...and the response I've usually been getting is [/ignored] or "DON'T TELL ME HOW TO PLAY!" So I just gave up on it. I only care nowadays when it comes to a friend.

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Yeah, unfortunately, sometimes a gesture of kindness is rewarded with a slap in the face.

If they implement the Mentor Program here, people who achieve Mentor status here would get something attached to their name that people can see. Basically a big "ask me" mark.

Like the mark to the left of this guys name:

http://www.playonline.com/comnewsus/...0420b/im03.jpg

With that, people will just know to ask you.

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

In this case the mentoring system would benefit that because those who would seek out a mentor aren't the same as those receiving it without seeking.

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If there are benefits to the follower/apprentice/whatever outside of simply getting help from their mentor, that may not hold true. So as long as there is no extra benefits to the follower then the program might be appealing.

EDIT: For example, in some games, if you have a mentor you get a 5% experience buff. Some newbies might want a mentor JUST for the buff. Not for the actual guidance. And if the mentor tries to give them guidance they'll give him attitude. If the mentor refuses to accept them as a follower or un-mentors them, the newbie will give him attitude. All-in-all it can be a very unappealing program.

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Originally Posted by Elim

If there are benefits to the follower/apprentice/whatever outside of simply getting help from their mentor, that may not hold true. So as long as there is no extra benefits then the program might be more appealing.

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That's one thing about it I hope they keep from FFXI. Mentoring is something you're willing to do out of the goodness of your heart. There should be no tangible reward, other than the future friendships you build.

I get kinda maybe why people would want a 'mentor' tag. But really, if you want to be a mentor, make sure to recruit newer folk into your FC and assist them there. I am helping out my FC mates, new and old all the time. So I think it's more so helping new players find 'new player friendly' FC's and linkshells than handing out mentor tags....especially when you consider we can't /t in duties etc anyway.

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Originally Posted by Kinseykinz

I get kinda maybe why people would want a 'mentor' tag. But really, if you want to be a mentor, make sure to recruit newer folk into your FC and assist them there. I am helping out my FC mates, new and old all the time. So I think it's more so helping new players find 'new player friendly' FC's and linkshells than handing out mentor tags....especially when you consider we can't /t in duties etc anyway.

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You make some good points.

However, to clarify, the point of the Mentor Tag is to make the people who are willing to be helpful, easier for people who need help to identify. A lot of people are pretty nervous about asking questions, even in an anonymous online world. Also, some people can be really harsh with newer players. I haven't personally experienced this on Hyperion, but I've heard some horror stories. These Tags serve to show players who they can take their questions to without fear.

(and of course, Vets also like to test the knowledge of people with those tags to make sure they aren't a farce. Though, this comes with the territory of choosing to be a mentor).

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Originally Posted by ShinkuTachi

A lot of people are pretty nervous about asking questions, even in an anonymous online world. Also, some people can be really harsh with newer players.

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I can't agree more. Although I hate to admit it, my server (most likely due to it's legacy status) is packed full of elitists who will bite your head off if you so much as get hit once during an EX fight. If you have to ask something during a party, you may very well be kicked without warning. Sounds ridiculous, but I've seen it happen too many times for my liking. I would absolutely love for there to be a system in place that lets new players know that there ARE people to ask questions to; people who do so simply because they want to. While getting the latest and greatest loot is nice and all, I personally find far more satisfaction in helping other players and knowing I helped make this game a better experience for them.

I'd sign up as mentor with no reward whatsoever, even. Maybe I'm the odd one out, but I actually fint it enjoyable to answer peoples' questions. :/

I remember when the mentor program was first introduced in FFXI... a lot of players put it on because they genuinely wanted to help others... buuuut, there were some people who put on mentor status just because they liked the way it looked. It was a status symbol to them. So, while I like the idea, I'm not sure how effective, as a whole, it would be. I always try to help out new players if they ask for help. Unfortunately, a LOT of players do not speak up... and the reasons for this vary. One example is the player who HAS spoken up before asking for help, but was treated rudely because he asked. Another example is the player who prefers to 'learn by doing' and doesn't want fights 'spoiled for them' with explanations. Other people just don't speak up because they believe they can 'fake it until they make it'. Either way, I get REALLY frustrated if I ask, "Does anyone not know the fight?" and no one answers only to be met with a wipe due to someone CLEARLY not knowing the fight.

So what do we do about this? As a community, we should be kinder as a whole to people who DO speak up and ask. And, when you see someone being rude to someone else for asking a genuine question, speak up. When I see someone trying to bully people into skipping cutscenes, I speak up and say... "No, enjoy your cutscene. We'll clear trash while you are watching it." I'm already 'wasting' my time playing an MMO... what's two more minutes to foster a friendly community through encouraging people to enjoy the storyline?

I always try my best to say things in a non-offensive way. Most of the time, I do not impose and simply give advice if asked. Buuuuut, there are times people will get defensive and jump into the "do not tell me how to play" mentality. That helps no one. As nice as I can be, I fear these people jump into this mentality because of the way they've been treated. So, just be kinder as a whole and people are more likely to be honest. One example I can think of with this situation.. I was doing Titan Hard, way back in the day. Someone was parsing and pointed out that one of the summoners in the group was doing less damage than the tank. I tried to offer the summoner some friendly advice, and I found out he was not using fester. At all. I explained why fester is good, and how you can maintain MP without ever having to use energy drain (he believed he would go OOM and fester wasn't worth it). While I was trying to explain, other players jumped in and teased him for being 'so bad at his job'. This really frustrated me because I was trying to help this guy, and their reaction to him talking honestly with me was probably making it so he wouldn't speak up again. Not only that, but it also sort of painted me as a jerk because they were all insulting him while I was also trying to teach him.

FC's should adapt a mentor attitude. If SE ever does get around to a mentor program I don't see it happening soon. Just because they have so much on their plate.