I suck at speedruns

I need expert pally help! I dinged 50 on my paladin a few weeks ago and recently got a high enough i level (80) that I felt comfortable speed running/ myth farming Brayflox HM.

I've done it countless times as an i94 DRG (my main class) so I know where to run and how far to pull and such.
Sometimes I'll have a perfect run, but then there are some groups I just fail miserably with. I'm now wondering if I am being carried by awesome healers and aware DPS.

Do you have to hit each mob as you run up? I usually just shield lob a few along the way to the ramp area, wait for them to catch up, use HG then CoS, then Flash a few times and Sentinel. I'll then start the Riot Blade combo and run around avoiding the cone attacks while Flashing mobs that are turning yellow on the enmity icon.

Is this correct? Sometimes it works fine, sometimes I die, sometimes I lose control of the mob and a healer or BLM dies. I've seen a video where they Flash each mob as the run by. I've tried this with the same worked fine/ failed horribly results.

Honestly I power leveled with a lot of fate parties and didn't do many dungeons besides the early ones. I still feel like a new and shitty tank.
I haven't had an "AHA!" moment and still struggle regularly. Do I just need more experience?
Thanks for any guidance or tips here.

You'll probably end up in parties that have way better gear than you. That will be one aggro issue if the DPS is really high.
Don't worry about flashing along the way as you don't want to be out of mana before the mobs are gathered.
Pop FoF before you do your CoS and Flash spam for extra enmity.

I'm a WAR so not everything I do applies. As far as pulling, so long as nobody else in the party does anything at all a shield lob at each connected group should be more than sufficient. Hell, I face pull most stuff now after doing it a million times. As I'm coming to where I'll stop I'll pop infuriate then steel cyclone followed by vengeance. At that point everyone can go hog wild. From there it's just avoid AEOs and smack random mobs with wrath builders to get another steel cyclone. In between each rotation I'll overpower. Probably overkill, but it goes faster if everything stays tight. One note, if you're seeing yellow you've already lost them. They're already heading towards someone else at that point.

1st pull: Shield Lob first 6 mobs. Flash the pack of 3 at bottom of ramp. Then pick up that last Coerl and pick your kill spot.

2nd pull: Flash the first pack of 3. Shield Lob 1 pack, provoke last pack to get them all running toward you. Then Flash spam.


Personally, I always tag every single critter in that 1st pull. You *could* skip some and Sprint, but then you are forced to rely on all group members to not cast anything too early. And what if you miss a few with the first Flash with whole group together? *Splat* ... Not tagging everything is a risk. The payout for winning that risk is the time saved by Sprinting past (can't Sprint if you're Shield Lob everything).

As for staying alive yourself, not much to say there except the obvious.
- Use your cooldowns. All of them. I like to start clicking a few secs before I stop running, so that 2-4 are up as the first volley of hits lands on me. But don't run all of them immediately. You will need something for when the first ones drop. So for example Sentinel + Foresight + Awareness. Then Rampart + Convalescence when Sentinel fades. Then Bulwark + Bloodbath later. (PS. that's not optimized, just an example)
- For the 1st pull, don't completely stop. Instead, run tight circles around the pack of enemies. Avoid some cone and circle AEs this way. 2nd pull you can stand still once they're gathered.
- If your healer didn't do it at the start, Stoneskin yourself before the pull.
- Raise your gear level. Maybe i80 is enough, I dunno. But definitely it can go up.

You're going to encounter runs that have bad healers / bad dps. Bad healers are the ones that stand in the stupid or wait until you have 1/10 of your hp and try to heal you before you die. Bad dps either don't have enough dps and the healer runs out of mp or they start a Flare / Aoe before you even get the pack into position. They also stand in the stupid as well.

Then of course we have tanking issues. Then thing about flash is it has a very limited area. If you don't round them up properly you will miss the flash a couple times on some mobs. When that happens they start molesting the dps / healer.

It seems your tactic is similar to mine. I don't lob or touch any of them at all. I just run straight through and at the last cat I pop foresight and that turns them all from orange to red. Once I get to the log close to the gate I pop FoF / HG. I run into the charging pack flash once towards the front of the pack flash another times towards the back. Then I start circling to round them up tight. I pop Soc. Then I pop Sentinel (while circling and flashing / CoS) before sentinel goes down I pop off Bulwark / awareness. Then rampart / Convalescence.

As far as flash / mp goes I spam flash until I am down to about 2 flashes left after that I just use the Riot blade rotation then flash / cos when its up. I keep the extra 2 flash mp just in case its needed but, typically it's not needed.

You basically have to learn how to recognize what the actual cause of the wipe and it's not always your fault.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cap75

I'm a WAR so not everything I do applies. As far as pulling, so long as nobody else in the party does anything at all a shield lob at each connected group should be more than sufficient. Hell, I face pull most stuff now after doing it a million times. As I'm coming to where I'll stop I'll pop infuriate then steel cyclone followed by vengeance. At that point everyone can go hog wild. From there it's just avoid AEOs and smack random mobs with wrath builders to get another steel cyclone. In between each rotation I'll overpower. Probably overkill, but it goes faster if everything stays tight. One note, if you're seeing yellow you've already lost them. They're already heading towards someone else at that point.

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i see a disturbing lack of bloodbath in this post...

there a huge different hate gen. between WAR and PLD. as PLD do not have high AOE hate move.
you do not have to shield lob the mob just run in and face pull it. (use Sprint as you will be spamming flash anyway.)

if you gear enough, grab the first 3 pack, then pop you CD to survive. if you got Coerl that walk around that fine if not just ignore him. (you do not need to kill him as you can lock him out of boss room, same way with the plant mob

I usually pop Sentinel first then HG then Rampart...... ( I pop Sentinel first to give healer time to get into position and put some regen on me, so when I use HG Healer can nuke the mob right away ( Holy or w/e SCH have ;P)
the only thing PLD has for AOE agro is Flash, you have to make sure that your flash will hit every mob. spam it till OOM then recharge with riot combo and repeat till every thing dead

Not sure why there is a character limit, now I have to make 3 separate posts.

1st pull

1.) Sprint all the way to just before the stream up the ramp
2.) As I approach the steam I stop, cast stone skin on myself
3.) flash first bunch of mobs
4.) pop sentinel
5.) flash 3-4 more times to get the remaining groups of monsters (while trying to position myself to block all attacks)
6.) cast Blood Bath and Flight or Fight followed by Circle of Scorn
7.) **once Sentinel is done cast another CD, I usually use Bulwark next.** (Remember to always have CD up and facing monsters)
8.) Flash all my mp away while continuing to cycle cool downs
9.) Fast blade target 1, Riot Blade target 2, followed by flash, Fast blade Target 3, Riot Blade target 4, followed by flash…. You see the pattern. You can do this to gather mp for the next boss, or just attack the mobs.

2nd pull

1.) flash first 3
2.) provoke 1 of the 3 monsters furthest away (to avoid raptor)
3.) shield lob 1 of the 3 at the tent closets to the entrance of the 2nd boss
4.) cast sentinel or a different CD
5.) flash 3-4 times
6.) cast Blood Bath, cast Flight or Fight, Circle of scorn
7.) Sometimes I throw a cover on the healer or blm
** During this pull usually I pull as far into the back corner as I can, and then run out of the corner so I'm standing closer to the party (if that makes sense)**
8.) Riot blade combo switching target between attacks

3rd pull

1.) Unlock the door
2.) shield lob 1 of the 2 standing out front
3.) shield lob the monster on the fence
4.) shield lob 1 of the next 3
5.) run up the ramp to the left
6.) sentinel
7.) flash couple times
8.) provoke and shield lob the dinosaur that runs from the opposite end, followed by a flash (keep the Dinosaur targeted so you can stun if he uses his frontal)
9.) cast Blood Bath, cast Flight or Fight, cast Circle of Scorn
10.) flash everything and riot blade combo to get mp
11.) Don't forget to rotate cool downs

You can bypass 1000 limit by Edit you your own post

1st and every speed run pull that ALL tanks need to know!!

CLAIM!



CLAIM!



CLAIM!



Claim claim claim claim your mobs. Youre a tank and if you dont have every single mob claimed before you stop moving then your a risk to your healer.

Some people shield lob/tomahawk all mobs me personally I flash because PLD can restore mp and warrior doesnt need mp since they have overpower.

As PLD

1st pull.
1.) Get close to raptors then sprint (before aggroing)
2.)Flash two raptors (turning both yellow name plates to red)
3.)Shield lob Coeurl, Spiritswithin Goblin
4.)Flash Goblin, Raptor (might have to shield lob one if you happen to miss one.)
5.)Target Coeurl (the one near the ramp)
6.)Move towards the goblin mob pack and provoke the Coeurl then flash all 4-5 of them (including the coeurl)
7.)Go up the ramp, turn right along the wall past the tree, before the river to get LoS interruption come back to the pack pop hallowed ground when hp gets to half or before i get stunned, whichever comes first.)

proceed to flash and dodge aoe and restore MP after it runs out. Good healers/dps should kill all the mobs before hallowed drops, Decent healers/dps before rampart/sentinel falls. If hallowed and sentinel fall then you need new dps :)

2nd pull flash everything accordingly cover healer buff accordingly

The first pull is the one that most people wipe at. (Its why i was specific/helpful.)

As WAR

1st pull.

1.) Get close to raptors then simply start running no sprint. (before aggroing)
2.)Flash two raptors (turning both yellow name plates to red)
3.)Tomahawk Coeurl, Brutal Swing Goblin
4.)Flash Goblin, Raptor (might have to tomahawk one if you happen to miss one.)
5.)Target Coeurl (the one near the ramp)
6.)Move towards the goblin mob pack and provoke the Coeurl then flash all 4-5 of them (including the coeurl)
7.)Go up the ramp, turn right along the wall past the tree, before the river to get LoS interruption come back to the pack pop vengeance before you stop. Overpower, bloodbath, inner release, two overpower (all while avoiding aoe) Heavy swing, maim, overpower spam/Infuriate>Steel Cyclone (since wrath is not longer needed to gain the healing buff) before bloodbath and inner release drop.
(can also pop berserk if you know the timing. Also even though you cant use weapon skills doesnt mean you cant keep buffing and dodgeing aoe. )
8.) Buff accordingly (Mantra, Convalescence, Foresight, etc.)(Foresight would be before taking damage mantra/convalescence after etc.)

2nd pull flash everything accordingly, then bloodbath/inner release/steelcyclone/buff accordingly

Note: There is no "one way" to do things.

What is important though is you never lose threat, and make it as easy as possible for your healers.

Having done speed runs as a healer, tank and dps it always runs much smoother and the healer can act much faster when things are already claimed. I tend to pop regen very early if the tank has everything claimed then divine seal and heal accordingly. As sch i can pop eye for an eye sooner also. (Can do eye for an eye as whm also) I like to do Eye for an Eye right before the tank pulls the last coeurl and the last set of goblins just before the ramp as that is the time it will i feel the most optimized timing. I cannot do this if the tank is not claiming as he runs past.

Hi, I don't think you need to attack each mob, I usually shield lob one of each group and flash the rest.

When I have problems, it is not because of not keeping aggro, but difficulty to stay alive until all mobs are dead. Flash a lot and circle of scorn once mobs are near you. The result depends a lot on the healer, the DPS, and how you use your cooldowns, avoid AoE, etc. If sometimes all goes well and others not, it is not only your fault, it's the whole group, you might improve something, but it's not only you. The simple fact of trying to do a speed run instead of doing two separate pulls (which I do in normal DF groups) means you are a bit more stressed and more prone to mistakes until you have a lot of experience. It's difficult to avoid AoE at the same time you struggle for keeping agro and recovering mp to be able to flash. Avoiding harm may help, at least for me it's difficult to do while occupied with other things.

In the next pull it is important that nobody pulls the raptor on the left in the bigger room. You pull the first 3 and then go completely right so that the raptor does not aggro you. All members of the group have to take care not to aggro that one. Then you shield lob one of each group and group them all near the second group.

Once I am on place I flash a couple of times, circle of scorn, flash all the mp, then riot blade combo + flash, attacking the mob that seems might lose aggro if there is one, if not, the one you want dead first. If someone gets yellow, which is not frequent, shield lob ( in case it has moved out of normal attack reach) or riot blade combo him.

As I see it, speed runs are not that easy. In a group that has practiced together you get to do it, but with new people it may not go well, at least at first try.

As a Paladin, I usually just run ahead and have all mobs aggro on me (Not claimed) and run all the way to the desinated spot to hide LOS. As seeing the mobs passing around the corner, I pop HG (First Healer does not have to heal you to avoid getting aggro,also giventhe party enough time to get into position, second, to grant myself. piece of mind and not worry about dying ), run back ward a bit to round them up and Flash spamming until all MP. After 10s of HG wear off, I usually already have pretty aggro on all of them, so the Healer can just heal me all out. As for DPS, I usually ask them to wait for 2s before go NuTs. It is just as simple as it says but it requires the coordination of the whole party, if anyone mess up just a tiny bit, it will become very difficult. And before I get to the spot, I don't need any heal or regen, as I sprint and have Stoneskin on me, they would last until I reach my tanking spot without the healer lifting a finger.

Hi, it would be interesting for people reading this thread (and for me too) tips about where to run and place the mobs in the first pull. I read somewhere there's a place where you can go to avoid the bombs of the machine boss, but I don't know where it is. This might be one of the reasons of losing life too quickly.
Thank you in advance.

Go up the ramp and stay on that side of the river right past the log that crosses the river.

I just shield lob mobs until i hit the monkey. I save HG unless I need it and I scorn with bloodbath since you get decent heal aggro off that many mobs while flashing and riot blade flash. Usually you get paralyzed 5-6 times in that pack of mobs, which is why I save HG rather than blowing it needlessly. Never have aggro issues and only die if the healer does ;) If it's roulette I always ask how far I can pull too to the healer, and if DPS doesn't look like they can handle it, I won't pull everything. If it gets sketchy you can kite while the healer catches up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cap75

Go up the ramp and stay on that side of the river right past the log that crosses the river.

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This seems to be a really good place. Then you can have someone sleep the Ochu (if someone in your party has Sleep, that is) and lock the monkey out of the room. Or you can just kill them both. The last big pull, the one with the Footman that summons Gobbie Beaks, run up the ramp and go into the left front corner. You can avoid pulling the patrolling Coeurl (let's face it, they're a pain) if your entire party tucks in far enough there.

Thanks for all the tips.
I didn't realize the FoF, Bloodbath, CoS synergy. Awesome.
Also rounding them into a tight circle is helping. I'm just whacking them all with savage blade until I get better. Its a little awkward but its working. Thanks again.

When I pull in a DF I first pull the 2 raptors the courl gob and the raptor 2 gobs this for me is a dps check to see who can do what I stat with rampart then sentinel then leave hg if the players are lacking. Depending o how this goes the next pulls are big or small I've noticed if I have one BLM + melee to not do any big pulls or brd + melee same thing but if I have brd + BLM u check gear if they look good then I go for it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dioptase

When I pull in a DF I first pull the 2 raptors the courl gob and the raptor 2 gobs this for me is a dps check to see who can do what I stat with rampart then sentinel then leave hg if the players are lacking. Depending o how this goes the next pulls are big or small I've noticed if I have one BLM + melee to not do any big pulls or brd + melee same thing but if I have brd + BLM u check gear if they look good then I go for it

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Yep pretty much what I do as a dps check - split the first pull in half and see how it goes.

Splitting the pull at the beginning if you're unsure about the party's strength or synergy is really great practice. Been doing it for a while now when I get Flox (used to dread getting it in roulettes and such when I was less geared for the same reasons you made this post) and it has made all my runs there ALOT smoother. There seems to be quite a few healers/dps who overestimate their own abilities in that place at first. XD