Urth

Well, I have been catching up on my side quests, which I hoped will fill in some blanks in the overall lore, however they are not as detailed as I hoped it would be. For example Urth.

Spoilers

So from quests text we know that she, i assume Urth is female, has been in contact with Odin and if i understood correctly she imprisoned him in the crystal after he was defeated by a champion of Allag. But in the same questline it was mentioned that Odin was the demise of Urth and her people

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Does anybody have any more information on who she was or which country did she rule?

Urth is short for Urthdigger. The localization team loves me :)

Speculation: Urth was the ruler of the Allagan empire, much like the sultana in Ul'dah. Odin is actually Allag himself, being a consultant to Urth. One day Urth discovers the primal Fenrir, begins utilizing his power, then becomes enslaved by him. Odin/Allag has to kill her to free her from Fenrir's influence. Which he does, despite how much he cares for Urth. So now he's imposed a self-exile and wanders the shroud as penance.

At least this story sounds a lot more entertaining to me. But it's just my theory.

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Originally Posted by portie79

Well, I have been catching up on my side quests, which I hoped will fill in some blanks in the overall lore, however they are not as detailed as I hoped it would be. For example Urth.

Spoilers

So from quests text we know that she, i assume Urth is female, has been in contact with Odin and if i understood correctly she imprisoned him in the crystal after he was defeated by a champion of Allag. But in the same questline it was mentioned that Odin was the demise of Urth and her people

.

Does anybody have any more information on who she was or which country did she rule?

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Given how Acheron (a great military hero in Allag) was immortalized in the Labyrinth, I would love to see Urth appear as a boss fight in future CT expansions given that she too is a hero in Allag lore.

From what I've gathered of Urth, she seems to have been an Allagan queen (or perhaps Amdapori, given the proximity of Urth's Gift to Amdapor Township and Keep), who she was slain by Odin and, after killing her, he was soon defeated by one of Allag's champions and sealed away in the Shroud. When the Calamity occurred, it weakened the seal on the crystal containing him and he managed to escape.

Admittedly, most of what we know of her this old queen is through Odin, but he does say something interesting should you lose the FATE:

Odin: Urth... One day, I will find thee...

The emphasis in that sentence tells me that either he believes Urth is alive (perhaps he's unaware of the passage of time?), or that she never died in the first place--perhaps both. Was he exacting some form of retribution upon her in the past? Was she a cruel ruler that he felt justified in killing? Until we get some more quests surrounding Odin, or someone from the Community Team fills us in on the Lore, we're pretty well in the dark on this.

Not much to go on, but, from the Sightseeing Log:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by #046 Urth's Gift

Ancient writings tell that in exchange for her lifeblood, Lady Urth was able to seal the dark divinity Odin in a crystalline prison beneath a bubbling wellspring. To honor her sacrifice, the land upon which she drew her last breath still bears her name.

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Yeah, I'm pretty sure an earlier quest also mentioned Urth was a sorceress who was the one responsible for sealing Odin - I just can't remember where it was exactly. I'll have a look through my screenshots and see if this is correct.

EDIT: well, I found the relevant screenshots, but the dialogue is rather vague - it mentions that Urth was slain by Odin, but as to who actually sealed him is unknown, other than a 'great hero of the Allagan'. So we're back to square one (no pun intended):

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Originally Posted by sidequest 'The Dark Divinity'

O-App-Pesi: "Odin, as the ancient writings have it, rode forth into our world, wielding a dark blade capable of cleaving earth and the heavens. By his fell blade did perish Urth herself, and countless multitudes of her people."
O-App-Pesi: "At long a great hero of the Allag did arise to do battle with the dark god. Odin was slain, and his spirit sealed within a forest spring."

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So, is Urth the actual 'hero of the Allag' mentioned, and that the order of events has simply gotten jumbled over time? Or was someone else responsible? O-App never mentions exactly who it was who did this, and given the fact that the whole story until recent times was regarded by many in Gridania as nothing but a myth, it does make the 'record of events altered over time' idea more logical, especially during that questline after returning to the Waking Sands and speaking to Urianger, he has this cryptic dialogue:

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Originally Posted by sidequest 'All You Wanted to Know About Odin'

Urianger: "Whilst you were afield, I immersed myself in the ancient scriptures. The more I scoured the words, the more I did realize that the writings draw heavily from ancient Allagan historical chronicles."
Urianger: "History is quite a fascinating beast, is it not? One nation's glory is another's suffering - one nation's great hero, another's most abhorrent villain."
Urianger: "I mean not to speak in platitudes, only to say that there is never but a single side to every story - even a story that is presented as historical fact."
Urianger: "To what end did the great hero of Allag seal Odin in a gaol of crystal? What impels the Dark Divinity to ride once again? Cast thine light on the shadows of history, friend, that we might be delivered from the darkness."

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It seems like Urianger is hinting that we should reverse our perceptions. Perhaps Odin was a hero of Allag, and Urth a villain?

From what we know of Allag, they were no heroes.

Technically advanced? Yes.
Aetherically proficient? Probably.
The Good Guys? Not even vaguely.

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Originally Posted by gornotck

From what we know of Allag, they were no heroes.

Technically advanced? Yes.
Aetherically proficient? Probably.
The Good Guys? Not even vaguely.

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Point taken.

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Originally Posted by gornotck

From what we know of Allag, they were no heroes.

Technically advanced? Yes.
Aetherically proficient? Probably.
The Good Guys? Not even vaguely.

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They're not heroes or good guys to us.

My theory:

Odin was the Allag hero, in love with Urth.
Urth actually fell to some corrupt influence, Odin defeated her.
Odin sealed himself and Urth in the crystal to preserve her life and his love.
Urth and Odin were both released by the Calamity, and Odin searches for her once again.

A take on the old Merlin / Nimue trope, Febreealle?

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Originally Posted by HaelseMikiro

My theory

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I'll take it a bit further than that.

Odin and Urth were Star Crossed Lovers (Think Romeo & Juliet or Hikiboshi & Orihime). Odin was the leader of a group of knights called the Aesir and Urth was his lover, a commoner that sired one of his sons. She was of a rival culture.

Urth was tempered by a primal as part of a plan by her people to rid them of the Allagans. Odin had to put her down.

In grief, Odin renounced his knighthood. He sought out necromancy with the aid his sons. a Barbarian (Warrior) named Thor and a Black Mage named Loki, to Bring Urth back. But each attempt failed.

continued in next post...

Loki knowing full well the dangers of necromancy and that when one gazes into the abyss, the abyss gazes also, worried about his father's well being. He tried to help Odin get over Urth to no avail. Eventually Odin decided that apotheosis was the only to see Urth again.

Loki and Thor, armed with Mjolnir and Laevateinn battled their father in an attempt to stop him from completing his ritual and eventually slain him. But Loki realized as Odin dissipated into the aether that they were too late. Odin became a Primal.

Having lost their father to that abyss that gazes, The brothers prayed to the Twelve that Odin and Urth would be reunited one day.

Sometime later, Odin resurfaced as a Primal in search of Urth, he found a sorceress of similar appearance and mistook her for Urth. The sourceress saw nothing but a godlike being that must be sealed, so he fought the primal and gave her life to seal Odin in a Crystal.

This probably doesn't mean much, but it appears that Odin has two separate quotes upon failing his FATE. For simplicity's sake, I'll list all of his quotes and FATE description, that way we have a list of battle quotes, FATE description, the Sightseeing Log entry, and the questline dialogue all in this topic:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FATE Steel Reign

Atop his mighty steed, clad in armor darker than the void, the Elder Primal Odin has returned to Eorzea to exact his brutal judgment upon the realm.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Odin

Initiating battle: "Who is it that would deny me passage?"
@ 90% HP: "Foolish mortals..."
@ 75% HP: "Canst thou hear the lamentations?"
@ 40% HP: "Here I stand--a god amongst men. Yet here I remain--a mere man amongst gods."
Zantetsuken casting: "Mine obsidian blade shalt split atwain the threads of thy future..."
Zantetsuken succeeds: "...whilst its crimson fuller shalt channel the lifeblood of thy past!"
Victory: "Urth... One day, I will find thee..."
Defeat: "Thou knowest not thy folly. Forfeit is thy waking soul..."
FATE Time Out: "Soon, Urth... Soon..."

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To add, first, when one first encounters Odin he can be seen without his helmet so long as he isn't engaged in combat. His face appeared then to be that of a pale-skinned, white-haired Elezen male (as we know, he assumes the appearance of his vanquisher--make of this what you will). Secondly, the unique weather that occurs when he spawns in the Shroud is called "Hopelessness." Since Urth, Odin, and the Allagan Champion are inextricably linked, knowing as much as we can about each of them should help us infer more about the others.

Also, I'm curious: did the Amdapori and Allagan civilizations overlap? If so, then perhaps my idea that Urth was an Amdapori queen (or perhaps a noblewoman, given her title of "Lady" in the Sightseeing Log) may be somewhat accurate. It may indicate a connection between the two civilizations, as well.

EDIT: Just checked the Eorzean Timeline, and unless the Amdapor civilization lasted over 2,000 years and survived two Umbral Eras, they never met. So what civilizations does that leave us with? The Elezens in Gelmorra?

I'm getting heavy vibes of Odin being a very tragic figure from his dialogue. How about this?

Odin and Urth are both cursed, somehow, to be Elder Primals. Immortal, yet not invincible. Gods amongst men, yet at the mercy of higher forces, unable to rest in peace. What if the lamentations he mentions are Urth's, in constant pain and suffering, unable to die and yet also unable to truly live? And what if Odin seeks Urth to bring her the peace she desperately craves, through the mercy of a blade?

Now, I'm going to take this theory, and go even further beyond. Because we already know of an Elder Primal that fits this description. Bound by the Allagan, kept alive, howling in pain. In fact, if we treat the order that quests appear in as a sort of timeline, Odin appears just after it's first massive roar in years.

What if Urth is Bahamut?

I'm pretty sure that Amdapoor spans the 5th Astral Era, given that the civilization was founded upon conventional magic, a product of the 5th Umbral era, and was buried at the 6th Umbral era when the Elementals stripped them of the right to roam the wood. Forced underground, the remnants of elezen inhabitance created Gelmorra before it was superceded by Gridania as the Hyur and Elezen peoples made peace with the Elementals.

With the Allagans being a 3rd Astral era affair, our Black Shroud timeline gap is the Fourth Astral era, where we have no idea what was going on. Nor do we know how accurately history has been retold through that time.

Hrm, well, that's unfortunate, although very helpful. Then that means Urth is either of Allagan nobility or of some as-yet-unnamed civilization. Still, the phase "...countless multitudes of her people" makes it sound like she was some sort of leader... So, that may very well mean that she's neither Allagan or noble. For all we know she was a skilled sorceress and her followers were students of her art. After all, if the Sightseeing Log tells us history as it is, that's pretty damn impressive to be able to seal an Elder Primal away (albeit at the cost of her life), and people with that kind of power tend to attract followers.

Countless multitudes of her people, eh? You know, Bahamut IS traditionally the ruler of the dragons in Final Fantasy. And the Allag seem to have some ties to the dragons.

Just sayin'.

Actually, the Allagan were simply conquerors. Dragons weren't the only thing they enslaved. They have a particular penchant for manipulating and enslaving voidkin, as LoA leads us to believe.