Dive Bomb Question

So, my static recently underwent some personnel changes that allowed us to easily get to the second set of dive bombs almost every attempt in T5, whereas previously we were hanging on by a thread at that point, losing 1 or 2 people to missed dodges on the first set, or being weakened from a conflag killing someone.

I am now being challenged as the strategist/leader of the group with the second set of DBs, the first one we are at about a 95% dodge rate, no issues whatsoever, but the second set seems to come faster, and there seems to be one or two instances in the second set (every time) wherein Twin will appear BEHIND us, and shoot us all out across the map. We are using the "Run up the hill" method, by the by.

Anyroad, my first reaction is that someone isn't stacking tight enough into the hole, causing a position change for Twin. I have NOT been able to substantiate that claim, either through internet research, watching videos, or through identifying someone specific in my group that I see doing that.

Can anyone explain exactly what would cause Twin to dive from a different angle? She is appearing in the same place, just facing a different way. Someone said its horrible RNG luck, but most of the videos I watch she swoops in from in front of and slightly to the left of the group, which is where each and everyone one of our dive bombs come from in the first set of 3.

Does it have to do with the way a player is facing, how deep they are into the hole, what color shoes they are wearing?

I have so much confidence up to that point, and I have a large amount of confidence that we will do well after that point, but we have gotten only a few real shots at practicing snake positioning and using the caster limit break on the snakes to move into twisters. We are yet to get Asclepius murdered before twin comes down.

Something that occurs to me: Are we perhaps moving TOO quickly, and causing Twin to turn up the hill after her appearance?

It is wrong positioning of the targetted member. If you move way too early or not standing properly in the pit, it fucks up. Thats the simple reason.

Pretty much make sure everyone is stacked tight on that ugly purple line. Dodging as soon as you see that green circle. Everyone should see themselves moving ahead of the group on their screen in order to dodge properly. If you have BLMs separated from the group make sure they are far enough from the group that if they get marked they aren't accidentally mpking you with their divebomb. If someone is super fail at dodging just make them stand in the other dip. It is unlikely that they will get marked twice and one divebomb won't kill them unless they get knocked into a wall.

Set up a macro that has a 28 sec wait and calls out to be ready for dive bombs and hit it after the 3rd DB in the first set. This will ensure you're on time. As long as everyone is ready and moves when the green mark appears you should be good.

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Originally Posted by Grotesque

It is wrong positioning of the targetted member. If you move way too early or not standing properly in the pit, it fucks up. Thats the simple reason.

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Positioning wise:
During divebombs I target myself and walk until the front of my target circle goes slightly over the purple line.
http://i.imgur.com/RdUvloW.png

Also, only move when the green circle has appeared over the head of the target and preferably have the targeted person move last.
(At least not first)

Lastly, anyone that gets hit by not the last divebomb should move away from the party and if he is the next target move into a large C.
(With practice it's pretty easy to avoid bombs even when not hiding in the alcove.)
Unless it's a tank holding the snakes there should be nothing else hitting him so healing that person is second priority.

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Originally Posted by Grotesque

It is wrong positioning of the targetted member. If you move way too early or not standing properly in the pit, it fucks up. Thats the simple reason.

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Yeah this has got to be it, we just aren't stacking tight enough. I am going to have everyone turn off spell effects so they can see and get in position correctly. I'm assuming its someone trying to hit the snakes at melee range and not being far enough down.

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Originally Posted by Lani

If someone is super fail at dodging just make them stand in the other dip. It is unlikely that they will get marked twice and one divebomb won't kill them unless they get knocked into a wall.

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Thanks for the tip - we seem to be doing pretty good but that's a great idea.

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Originally Posted by Lithera

Set up a macro that has a 28 sec wait and calls out to be ready for dive bombs and hit it after the 3rd DB in the first set. This will ensure you're on time. As long as everyone is ready and moves when the green mark appears you should be good.

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Why the hell didn't I think of this? I've been counting in my head after snakes spawn, lmao. I am just going to set a Macro that will ping off @ 20s left, 10s left, 5s left. Its 45 seconds from spawn time to 2nd set, correct?

I use this Macro as soon as the 3 snakes spawn.
/p Next set of Divebombs in 45 seconds! <se.2> <wait.35>
/p Divebombs in 10 seconds! <se.2> <wait.5>
/p Divebombs in 5 seconds! <se.2> <wait.2>
/p Divebombs in 3 seconds! <se.2> <wait.2>
/p Get ready for Divebombs! <se.2>

I find the problem is usually because someone's standing out to DPS behind the snakes and forgets to move back in before dive bombs come.

For dodging, I try to put Twintania on focus at the start of the fight. During dive bombs, as soon as her focus bar appears it's safe to run. I find it a bit easier to see than the green circle or listening to the sound when people are killing the snakes and spell effects are going off.

I still wonder how people can clear T5 in duty finder because not everyone has the proper experience regarding the mechanics in this boss fight.

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Originally Posted by Lani

If you have BLMs separated from the group make sure they are far enough from the group that if they get marked they aren't accidentally mpking you with their divebomb.

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There's no reason to have BLMs separated from everyone else. They can stand in the hole and Manawall the last set of divebombs. Eat the first two (assuming none of them target the tank with the snakes) and run out on the 3rd.

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Originally Posted by Orophin

There's no reason to have BLMs separated from everyone else. They can stand in the hole and Manawall the last set of divebombs. Eat the first two (assuming none of them target the tank with the snakes) and run out on the 3rd.

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I've always stood outside(somewhere in the middle of the arena) and never once had a problem. The advantage I can see standing outside is that the group does not need to move if the DB is on you and less people stacking in the pit makes db easier to see. Also I am able to tag the 2 snakes and aetherial profusion to the OT making the lb and everything die that much faster. The only problem I can think of with this method is if twin targets you 3 times in a row, but thats highly unlikely and never happened to me before. (the most I got was 2).

The positioning is very tigh on dives, especially for the hill method. You have to be really close to the purple fire, or else she'll appear behind you and blow all your team away. :)

But key is : Do not panic. I've seen groups succeeding even after the entire group has been blown out in 1st set, struggling to get back in positions. They didn't panick, they took snakes, and managed to win :)