What will become of the "Alternate" basic physical attacks?

With the implementation of auto-attack imminent, I still have some questions left unanswered, the biggest one being what I outlined in the title. When the new battle system is implemented, will we still have the option to utilize skills such as Full Thrust, Pierce, Flurry, Heavy Slash, etc? I for one find them to be an integral part of strategy in both solo and party play, and would be sad to see them go. However, I also cannot think of a good way to adjust them for use with the new battle system. Will they possibly have a small recast timer or TP cost? And if they are scrapped completely, will we receive a refund of guild marks spent to purchase them (I believe Yoshi-P mentioned something like that in a post recently)? Here's to hoping this thread will garner enough attention for a community rep comment. And if this has been already answered somewhere, forgive me ^^;;

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...50c372373a87e4

Although you bring up some good questions I am really surprised to see no discussions of weapon delay/damage, which will have large impact on best weapons/classes etc.

The strategy for me with these skills was always when to use them in lieu of a standard attack. With timers getting added to them, it seems it'll be more like choosing to use them in lieu of another action - of which almost all of them are more useful than a slightly varied version of an attack you're already doing automatically. The only advantage these skills will have is that they don't cost any extra points to equip on your action bar and don't require TP.

I'd like hearing about weapon delay also. It could make some of the existing weapons significantly better or worse than they currently are now.

@Zhinse Thanks, I must've missed that post somehow.

Also, to the people mentioning weapon delay, it's mentioned in that same link Zhinse posted.

Weapon delay and damage rebalancing is precisely why making the jump to auto attack is an endeavor. I imagine once they implemented basic auto attack, some monsters that were at or even below your level weren't killable anymore or some monsters became too easy. Of course once 1.18 actually releases the players will find holes in the balancing that the QA team never even thought of.

Question. Does stamina recharge at the same rate across classes for light strike? With introduction of auto-attack, and then delay/weapon damage, will also make stats like ACC more important for high delay classes (presumably MRD and LNC) and crit/attack more useful for low delay classes (PUG), a la FFXI. Definitely will have impact on what weapons are best. Going to be interesting to see how it shakes out.

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Originally Posted by Gidonoidon_Sur

Question. Does stamina recharge at the same rate across classes for light strike? With introduction of auto-attack, and then delay/weapon damage, will also make stats like ACC more important for high delay classes (presumably MRD and LNC) and crit/attack more useful for low delay classes (PUG), a la FFXI. Definitely will have impact on what weapons are best. Going to be interesting to see how it shakes out.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...I-(06-14-2011)

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•The stamina gauge will be abolished with the introduction of auto-attack.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...I-(06-14-2011)

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I meant currently.

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Originally Posted by Gidonoidon_Sur

I meant currently.

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I see ^^

Then I do believe the stamina recharges at the same rate for every classes.

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Originally Posted by Gidonoidon_Sur

Question. Does stamina recharge at the same rate across classes for light strike? With introduction of auto-attack, and then delay/weapon damage, will also make stats like ACC more important for high delay classes (presumably MRD and LNC) and crit/attack more useful for low delay classes (PUG), a la FFXI. Definitely will have impact on what weapons are best. Going to be interesting to see how it shakes out.

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Currently stamina recharges at the same rate for all classes currently and all the base attacks cost the same 10~15% of stamina bar. The ability to click on the Standard attack happens about half a second after you've initially clicked it. All the animations are cancelable after about .75-1.5 second or as soon as they reach the recovery frames. That means if you que up two attacks your second attack will launch as soon your character starts to return to idle stance.

i imagine that we are going to keep the animation cancel property on all of our actions unless they decide to change properties of the actual animation itself. All the actions that took up 25-50 percent (such as taunt and provoke, disorient, etc) of the stamina bar are getting a significant buff in usefulness and will probably be toned down in actual effectiveness to combat it.

The question is what happens if we are stuck in animation/ability stun such as using Ferocity when our auto attack comes around. Will it cancel the Animation and attack? Or will it cause you to skip the auto attack? Second question is how cancelable is our standard auto attack going to be?

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

I see ^^

Then I do believe the stamina recharges at the same rate for every classes.

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Yes, it does.

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Originally Posted by CSLionheart

Yes, it does.

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I bring this up bc now it will change with each weapon now having delays and presumably some will be faster than others (ie., sword > polearm) which will also bring into the fray other stats like acc/att which I argue were less important in the past. For example, lnc probably have high delay weapons meaning acc will be very important whereas attk will be more imp for say pug, ala ffxi.

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Originally Posted by Zhinse

The question is what happens if we are stuck in animation/ability stun such as using Ferocity when our auto attack comes around. Will it cancel the Animation and attack? Or will it cause you to skip the auto attack? Second question is how cancelable is our standard auto attack going to be?

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If you go back and watch the auto-attack video, there are a few times when you can see the auto-attack damage but the visual effects are clipped because of the player using an ability. Of course this could change in 1.19.

I'll follow this pattern:

1. Try
2. Judge
3. Restart from 1
4. Complain

I can't tell anything about auto-attack and what/how is implemented. I need to try it to see if it's good or bad, then judge and complain about some things if I have to.
Even if I know things like Delay, Damage dealt,... before the auto-attack I wouldn't know how it feels because I didn't try that.

And now being on topic, they say that Heavy Swing and sh*t like that will be removed. We'll see what happens next =)

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Originally Posted by Zhinse

The question is what happens if we are stuck in animation/ability stun such as using Ferocity when our auto attack comes around. Will it cancel the Animation and attack? Or will it cause you to skip the auto attack? Second question is how cancelable is our standard auto attack going to be?

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According to the released info and Auto-Attack demo, auto-attacks will keep looping based on a weapon-specific delay, and only recovery lags following by actions will reset the delay loop. This means, auto-attacks will keep going whether players are standing/idle or moving in aggressive mode - as long as they are facing targets and within the attack-able range. Some actions, mostly weapon skills, have lags when they are executed. During those lags, players can't move freely and auto-attacks stop, then Auto-Attack loop will be reset once those actions are finished.

Seems like how it should be for auto attack.

Since most of these Normal attacks will now run on timers, I hope that the special effect properties of the actions are enhanced to counter, so we wouldn't have to spam them like we do now to get the usefulness out of them.