EX Primals and ragequitting

Question....why do so many people rage quite after one wipe on an EX primal? Or hell, a HM primal for that matter.
Does nobody intend on ever taking advantage of the echo buff? And what makes people think that if a pt wipes once that they're going to magically find the right pt the next time? Chances are you're going to run into the same situation again. It boggles my mind how people think they're being efficient sometimes....

I don't mind taking advantage of the buff, but you can't fix people that can't dodge landslides/plumes/bombs. If the same people die every time you're better off just cutting your losses and trying another group.

True, I guess it's just annoying when so many groups wipe one time and are like "nope nope nope"

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Originally Posted by Kajidourden

True, I guess it's just annoying when so many groups wipe one time and are like "nope nope nope"

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To play devil's advocate; if I see people eating multiple plumes and landslides pre heart, I know the party is doomed for failure. No echo buff is going to save someone eating 5 stacked plumes, bombs or landslides.

Yesterday i did relic for MNK , and got in DF party that was unable to beat Titan HM even with 5stack echo lol , today i got DF pt that won with only 1 stack & 6/8 ppl's Alive including me :D
In yesterday's wipe party was only 2 exp'd ppl's (can't call my self too exp'd cuz i play HM's atm only when "relic calls") , but this 2 players was stick with PT that doomed to fail till very end .
I glad that players that actually want to -->PLAY<-- and don't mind help other ppl's still exist in FFXIV . They are truly Warriors Of Light lol ! Not that fake abandoners , that dropping duty if see "New player" in chat list or after 1~2 wipes .

Echo buff is awesome. It makes Stoneskin soak as much damage as adlo and makes Mountain Busters tickle. It also helps me have enough HP to tank one weight of the land(two if with Stoneskin) or survive a bomb blast.

But Echo can only help you so much. People still need to know the mechanics. When and how to dodge, how to kill adds, tank rotations, Searing Wind for healers in Ifrit etc

If your party has not made it past Titan Heart phase even once and are dying from random plumes/landslides then it's probably time to go.

That said, leaving after 1 wipe is a bit of a stretch. Give people more room for error. I've practically memorized Titan EX, running it for two weeks, and also helping FC mates get their clears and I still derp from time to time.

One thing you must realize is that some player (like myself) have big delays (location Africa 4MB/0.5MB).
No matter what I do (dodge) I will get hit. Sure you going to say move early, tried that and what that does is create uneven weight of the land and makes it harder for other player to dodge.
On several occasion I would be clear off landslide and still would get pushed off.
Whether it's my ISP or they server that's the issue I don't know, the fact is it's not the same for everyone and players and SE need to understand that.
I have done EX titan with FC and DF, lost count but I have yet to beat

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

To play devil's advocate; if I see people eating multiple plumes and landslides pre heart, I know the party is doomed for failure. No echo buff is going to save someone eating 5 stacked plumes, bombs or landslides.

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No echo buff will help if the DPS die to landslide on Titan...

I wouldn't leave to avoid the echo, and I think point of wipe and pt advertisement have a lot to do with it.

If you put in pt finder "must be exp, farming pt be über!!" And we wipe before heart in Titan or second spikes in ifrit or 3 people slide off when the rails disappear in Levi, sorry, I'm out... This is not a farm pt.

If I join a "learning" pt I fully expect some failure, but again if that lulz baddy won't listen and makes the same mistake repeatedly I'll ask he be removed or dip myself.

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

To play devil's advocate; if I see people eating multiple plumes and landslides pre heart, I know the party is doomed for failure. No echo buff is going to save someone eating 5 stacked plumes, bombs or landslides.

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The problem is you don't know if their connection is just having a hiccup that lasted for a brief period of time or not. We had a bad run earlier on the first attempt because I was lagging pretty bad for the first 2 minutes. After that first failed attempt, we had no problems, no deaths or anybody eating a plume until after the heart phase. You can't judge a run by the first attempt, it's just stupid to do that. That same group I was in managed to beat Titan EX 3 attempts later (same instance). It could very well be possible that the parties people back out of could have beaten Titan EX, but the fools who leave after one wipe will cause the party to never know. That same group also killed Ifrit EX with me and another person also new to the fight in 4 attempts.

But if you see DPS not doing what they're supposed to be doing well (BLM not using Flares, Bards not DoTing, etc), or bad healers, or horrible tanks, that's different. But if everybody is doing what they need to be doing well, give the party a chance.

You can't judge a party by one run, even if they get hit by the same mechanic (weight of the land for instance) in that one run. If they are new to the fight, they need to know the rotation, and having been hit by it before will not make them know when it is coming again. Only running multiple times will help them learn. When I ran Titan HM for the first time, multiple runs made me better, buff or no buff.

I had a PUG Titan HM run recently that finally beat the damn thing with 50% echo. There was a vote to abandon put up several times earlier, but no one flat out left, which was at least something. At the end I asked "Now aren't you all glad you stayed?" (someone still said "no" lol)

For those who are lagging getting out of landslide: there's a trick where if you move toward the center of the platform when getting hit, if you know you lag and can't get out in time, you will still get hit for big damage, but won't get thrown off the platform. Well, I know that works for HM, at least. I haven't tried EX, so I can't confirm.

This is where i think the party dismiss vote is great!
it often pops after 1 or 2 fail, i press "no" and the fight continues so most people feel like we should try more (just 1 person was irritated i guess)
But then after a few wipe you are still far from seeing the end click "yes" and you are out of that hell
You need half people to think the party is doomed for the party to stop so just press "no"
if it dismisses it means everybody agreed it was doomed and you are the only one not seeing it

I have been stuck on Garuda EX for three days now, been doing nothing but DF trying to beat her but it's impossible to find a group that will stick for more than 2 wiped. I am getting so frustrated because there are times where we show improvement, but there is always that one person who wants to abandon immediately and if he doesn't get his way, he'll leave anyway, which causes everyone to leave shortly after.

I am so grateful for the pro players who have stuck with me until the end and have been patient, explained the strategy again and again and encouraged everyone to do better. Unfortunately, it's always the ones who die first to leave... as if they're not gonna die in the next party, too.

I am trying to organize a full party with my FC but it's small and the number of people who beat Garuda even smaller. PF is useless because nobody wants to join a training party, it's always "fail=kick". It's getting very frustrating.

Make your own group in PF and declare it as training. They fill fast enough, because there are enough ppl with the same problem. Afterwards you practice with them and weed out the bad players who learn nothing during training.

People aren't going to improve without instruction or practice. If you don't want to run into parties with difficulty, then help them out and affect the change you want to see. Or get a premade so people don't have to lose out because of your ragequits.

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Originally Posted by Kajidourden

Does nobody intend on ever taking advantage of the echo buff?

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Is it unreasonable for someone to never want to take advantage of the echo buff? And wants to defeat the boss without it?

Also, before anyone says that you can click it off, you can't click it off for your teammates.

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Originally Posted by Kajidourden

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ragers will be ragers. unfortunately some players have no patience to try a second time. they have a one strike rule otherwise you're "wasting their time." even if that means that the rager ends up wasting your time because he/she doesn't even want to try a second time. personally, I think sticking it out, teaching the struggling players, and working as a team is more rewarding and fun than raging. but people tend to believe their time is more important than your time and only care about their own.

I did T5 only puging, but titan ex is another difficulty dimension for me

I suggest to nerf to the ground ex primals...

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Originally Posted by Gumiho

I suggest to nerf to the ground ex primals...

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Like they aren't already. We killed Titan EX with 1 dps and 1 healer dead before heart phase without stellar DPS. 25% Echo is huge. They're supposed to be the hardest mode of the primals. They don't need nerfing since it's non-essential that you kill them.

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Originally Posted by Vallhallix

I'm seriously about to not do Titan Ex at all anymore.

It sucks when you're a DPS class especially. Nothing like waiting 45mins + for a que to pop only to enter in a group with trolls who purposely die at the beginning. Forcing you to leave and hey another 45mins + wait for the next que that will probably be a fail group as well or people who don't dodge at all. Titan Ex is an absolute pain for DPS classes unless you have a good FC with the required amount of people on at the same time.

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Or you can just make your own Party Finder groups, labeled as kill group requiring certain experience like post-heart and progress from there.
Or you can just make friends from random Party Finder that you know they are good at dodging and make your own party when they are on.
I tank, DPS, heal this fight and I've found that it only sucks if you rely on random strangers to help you through it.

I'm seriously about to not do Titan Ex at all anymore.

It sucks when you're a DPS class especially. Nothing like waiting 45mins + for a que to pop only to enter in a group with trolls who purposely die at the beginning. Forcing you to leave and hey another 45mins + wait for the next que that will probably be a fail group as well or people who don't dodge at all. Titan Ex is an absolute pain for DPS classes unless you have a good FC with the required amount of people on at the same time.

I don't even want to bother with EX primals mainly due to how if one person leaves, your team is now gimped since you can't get a drop in replacement, which in turn has the whole team quitting.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

I don't even want to bother with EX primals mainly due to how if one person leaves, your team is now gimped since you can't get a drop in replacement, which in turn has the whole team quitting.

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It doesn't work that way... they fixed that like three patches ago. Trials can get replacements. You're not in great shape if you're looking for a healer or a tank, but if someone in your group has an FC mate who's willing to help out, you're not stuck.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

I don't even want to bother with EX primals mainly due to how if one person leaves, your team is now gimped since you can't get a drop in replacement, which in turn has the whole team quitting.

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these kinda ppl screwing everybody else over because they are too lazy to read patch notes to know this was fixed awhile ago

It's because of echo lol
Ppl forget that it takes more than 1 run to judge a party, but they see it as that if we reach 25% buff and we still fail then there's no hope.
People feel to entitled to an easy clear if they have max echo.
No such thing like a chicken wing
In ff14arr.

I'd just like to point out that sometimes, people leave because your not going to win. I've left dozens of Primal Ex groups because all it took was about 30 seconds to discover that some or most of the people in the fight hadn't the slightest clue what was going on. When only two people are stacking at the beginning of a Titan Ex fight, you know for a fact that this is not going to be a win group. That's not a goof, that's a fundamental misunderstanding of the fights mechanics.

And that's fine if its a learning group. But if its PF group that specifically stated 'Don't come if you haven't won yet/seen past heart phase/weekly win, experienced only please,' then I reserve my right to rage quit right out of there. Because not only am I not getting what was advertised, but one or more of the people in my party are dirty liars.