atma drop rates

either increase the drop rates or make a scaling system were every time it fails to drop its chance of dropping increases, 8 hours and counting without getting an atma (yes i have the quest, yes im in the right area, and yes i have my zenith weapon equiped) this is getting a little ridiculous, im no longer having fun, and when im not having fun i move on.

You don't have to get the atma. You can purchase a weathered tome weapon from Rowena (10 Rowena Token (Soldiery) for 130 Soldiery each), or you can use Tidal wand + shield until High Allagan.

Nobody is holding a gun to your head forcing you to get your atma.


I haven't even started getting any Atmas and I think this system is awesome. It's actually making you WORK for your high level gear

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

You don't have to get the atma. You can purchase a weathered tome weapon from Rowena (10 Rowena Token (Soldiery) for 130 Soldiery each), or you can use Tidal wand + shield until High Allagan.

Nobody is holding a gun to your head forcing you to get your atma.


I haven't even started getting any Atmas and I think this system is awesome. It's actually making you WORK for your high level gear

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Agree. People are getting a little ridiculous over this.

i have no issues working for a pieces of gear, but relying on RNG to get 12 items at a 1% drop rate is kinda retarded, as for earning the items, you know what i earned... my Allagan weapon from T5 and my primal weapons those i worked for, this is like saying someone who just won the lotery worked realy hard for there millions.

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Originally Posted by incabinca

i have no issues working for a pieces of gear, but relying on RNG to get 12 items at a 1% drop rate is kinda retarded, as for earning the items, you know what i earned... my Allagan weapon from T5 and my primal weapons those i worked for, this is like saying someone who just won the lotery worked realy hard for there millions.

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Pretty much this. It would have been fine if the entire thing was just a pure cosmetic thing like the Wind Up Tonberry, but putting RNG in quest progression, especially for powering up a weapon, is bad design.

The atma fate system is fine. Like stated previously you can get a weather weapon or get the tidal weapon if u want something quick. If there is no challenge its no fun. i grinding fates for 12 hours and got all 12.

XD, i agree to say it's just a bad game design,
and like goonie say he got the 12 atma in 12 hours, but that's it, lucky one will get it fast and unlucky one will not have it before 60 hours of fate.
This is why goonie can't understand complain when some players have 12 hours of fate and 0 atma.
The leviathan one will not be more accurate you need a rare drop to get to ilevel100 but it still a option, maybe more intersting.
also people complain about the fact it's involving low level fate, i agree too it's meaningless.
Base high level weapon on luck is not a great idea,
Yoshida is often speaking of balance of the game, well the luck is not totaly unbalanced between player ?

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

You don't have to get the atma. You can purchase a weathered tome weapon from Rowena (10 Rowena Token (Soldiery) for 130 Soldiery each), or you can use Tidal wand + shield until High Allagan.

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Not quite.
Soldiery weapons require a T6 drop, the Unidentified Allagan Tomestone. Don't forget that detail

dont forget its only less than 1 week into this patch. no need to have your atma complete RIGHT now.

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Originally Posted by Goonie

If there is no challenge its no fun. i grinding fates for 12 hours and got all 12.

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A grind is not a challenge. I can mindlessly spam flash, blizzard II, instant cast spells and just leech gold rating wins. That's not challenging. And some players have been running these for 12 hours with no drops.

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Originally Posted by Goonie

The atma fate system is fine. Like stated previously you can get a weather weapon or get the tidal weapon if u want something quick. If there is no challenge its no fun. i grinding fates for 12 hours and got all 12.

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I think the big thing is its not challenging or fun.

This RNG is terrible there's no challenge or even "work" it's just luck. It's like a 3-5% drop rate from what people are figuring people who go 12/12 in like 12 hrs won the lottery that's it. There's no guarantee that you won't get screwed, like myself going on 5 hrs with out 1 drop.

I give up until SE takes their head out from out of the hole in the ground they stuck it in. That's obviously the case because if they don't think that this is going to piss off a ton of people then you're incredibly wrong. I just want you to think about this for a second. Say you are the average casual player that isn't farming Lev EX and Coil there is no other option than to do the FATEs. Now on top of that people have multiple jobs leveled this system is broken for the game it's built on.

I'm so sick of these tired old non-engaging ideas that were tried and ultimately failed in FFXI ending up in this game because of idiots telling the game "doesn't have enough grind."

7hrs in bentbranch to get the ATMA....are people going 12/12 using their birds?

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

I haven't even started getting any Atmas and I think this system is awesome. It's actually making you WORK for your high level gear

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Exactly why you shouldn't be posting this crap, I've been farming for hours since 2.2 (34 hours & counting just logged back in)
And yea i'm pissed that after all these hours i still have nothing to show for it yet people already got 12 of those !@#!ing atma's under a day's work!

And i could care less if i wasn't re-rolling lv 5-20 fates!

Well, one solution could be that it would show you the current drop rate %, and every fate you do it slowly goes up. Actually showing what the odds are and it slowly rising would definitely boost my morale to get it. I don't mind a grind but this is just a random generation between 5 minutes and 80 years of someones time. That's not a game mechanic, thats a cheap way of a timesink.

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Originally Posted by Goonie

The atma fate system is fine. Like stated previously you can get a weather weapon or get the tidal weapon if u want something quick. If there is no challenge its no fun. i grinding fates for 12 hours and got all 12.

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If you're one of those people that has been grinding FATES for 12 hours and haven't got even 1 yet, maybe your thoughts on 'atma fate system being fine' would differ. I don't think the vast majority of people would mind getting 1 atma per hour. Congrats to you and your luck I suppose.

I have been working the fates in W La Noscea on and off for 5 days now, I have gotten somewhere north of 30k seals in that time at I estimate well over 150 Fates, still havent gotten my drop from there..

and yet one of my FC members got 7 of them tonight in like 5 hours playing. RnG sucks anyway you look at it, I would have rathered they said "go grind 100 Fates for each Atma" because at least then I could count on it being a specific goal..

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

You don't have to get the atma. You can purchase a weathered tome weapon from Rowena (10 Rowena Token (Soldiery) for 130 Soldiery each), or you can use Tidal wand + shield until High Allagan.

Nobody is holding a gun to your head forcing you to get your atma.



I haven't even started getting any Atmas and I think this system is awesome. It's actually making you WORK for your high level gear

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i just love reading this and knowing this person hasnt spent 12hours in 1 area farming over 500fates and not getting anything to show for it and then telling us Hey i love this system why are people complaining? whats worse is the area is central la noscea...Sorry i mean middle la noscea and highest lvl fates are like 15 so i get crap for seals and dont even make enough gil to cover gear repair costs with 20% FC buff. so yeah lets wait 3 weeks and buy 1 with soldiers while everyone else is getting loads of gear and doing better content, or try doing leviathan EX with 90% of groups expecting you to have said gear,weapons, and a clear to boot. I guess i just see game putting up a giant wall between people that are just getting unlucky.

Ya, I spent over 12 hours trying to get my 1st Atma, I didn't give up though. The choices are work hard for your gear or obtain it so easily. If you obtain something so easily and powerful, the work for it was just too lame. This is pretty much the same example of having to go coil every week and not getting your drop. Or spamming Primals to no end and still haven't even got your drop. People complained it lacked content, this is what you get. Made content that required time spending to obtain the equipment or items....

You lot are asking SE to make the drop rate so common, that 70-80% of the community will have it before 2.25. Relic/Zodiac doesn't DESERVE that title if it's too easy to obtain. FFXI was so successful to it's own exclusive system. You needed to work real hard for the absolute BEST equipments, this is how it should be. Turn 5 is another example of dropping the best weapons when they were updated.

still doesnt make it any less bitter when your FC mates are all getting theirs in decent time while your still just trying to get the 1.

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Originally Posted by Exitusworld

still doesnt make it any less bitter when your FC mates are all getting theirs in decent time while your still just trying to get the 1.

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You wouldn't be here complaining to SE if it dropped pretty well for you. FATE is part of the game, so it's content. I'm actually making some good money gathering all these seals and using for 2 star items. Craft them to the HQ item, sell them for good gil. You can get pretty rich playing it that way.

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Originally Posted by Exitusworld

whats worse is the area is central la noscea...Sorry i mean middle la noscea and highest lvl fates are like 15 so i get crap for seals and dont even make enough gil to cover gear repair costs with 20% FC buff.

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Central Thanalan is just as bad/possibly worse: fewer FATEs with most being ~9th level over a larger area.

Even though RNG does suck, here is a bit of probability.

To find out approximately how many FATEs you would have to do in order to be guaranteed an Atma (assuming the drop rate is 1%), first you have to find out the percentage chance of you NOT getting an Atma.

For example if you do 100 FATEs, the odds of you not getting an Atma is 0.99 (99%)^100 (or the number of FATEs attempted). This gives you 0.366. or a 36.6% chance of you not getting an Atma in the first 100 FATEs, or a 1 in 3 chance.

In order to reduce this chance of not getting an Atma close to 0, you would have to do 475 FATEs approximately per region to essentially be guaranteed an Atma (0.99^475 = 0.0084 or 0.8% chance). I certainly hope NO one is that unlucky to fall within that 0.8% chance, but if you guys want a basic number of FATEs you have to do, it will be 99.2% certain to be no more than 475 FATEs per region, or 5700 FATEs overall for all 12.

Now whether all that grinding is worth it is up to you. :p

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

The choices are work hard for your gear or obtain it so easily.

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Nobody's asking for it to be easy, we just want the RNG removed or mitigated a bit so that anyone can complete it in about the same amount of time, with about the same amount of effort. You seriously think that your 12 hours to get one drop vs. someone else's 12 hours to get 12 drops is okay? If you ask me, those lucky people got theirs way too easily and didn't have to work enough, while at least an equal amount of people are having to work 10x more, which is way too much. There is a middle ground, I just wish they'd given it to us.

What they SHOULD have done, is to make the first part of the quest, not the soul destroying fates, but a book like the 2nd part.

Do a quest line, get a book with a list of stuff to do which then leads you on to the 9 other books. No RNG, no frustration, lots of new stuff to do...win win situation.

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Originally Posted by Calyanare

Nobody's asking for it to be easy, we just want the RNG removed or mitigated a bit so that anyone can complete it in about the same amount of time, with about the same amount of effort. You seriously think that your 12 hours to get one drop vs. someone else's 12 hours to get 12 drops is okay? If you ask me, those lucky people got theirs way too easily and didn't have to work enough, while at least an equal amount of people are having to work 10x more, which is way too much. There is a middle ground, I just wish they'd given it to us.

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That's the whole point of it, SE doesn't want you to have it easy.

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

That's the whole point of it, SE doesn't want you to have it easy.

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Then nobody else should, either.

It's like you didn't even read what I said.

The way it is now, people DO have it easy (like YOU for example) while others get shafted. This should be time consuming for EVERYONE, not just people who happen to be unlucky.

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Originally Posted by Lycos

This is a game and why does everyone want the best gear on DAY1. Work for it people.

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This guy doesn't read either. SMH.

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

SE doesn't want you to spend your life on trying to get Atmas.

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Says someone who already got theirs, in a reasonable amount of time. I give up trying to reason with selfish people who don't care about anyone but themselves.

I like that they added the RNG for these items. Gives me something to do while none of my friends are online. It also gives me a happy feeling of acomplishment when i get an Atma. I am trying to get around 1 per day, and i am @ 4/12 so far. Before the last update, i had my ilvl90 and was geting bored. Now, there is plunty to do and i am not in a rush to get max gear. This is a game and why does everyone want the best gear on DAY1. Work for it people.

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Originally Posted by Calyanare

Then nobody else should, either.

The way it is now, people DO have it easy while others get shafted. This should be time consuming for EVERYONE, not just people who happen to be unlucky.

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Others are always going to get shafted, no matter what it is.... So far SE has replied nothing on doing anything, no point complaining to something that isn't even the best yet. SE doesn't want you to spend your life on trying to get Atmas. there is turn 6-9 which has the greatest weapon. You could be going there, instead of whining on the forums because of Atma drop rate. The next upgrade doesn't even come out till May... Likely won't even beat the High Allagan till 3.0 upgrade release in June...

You can get content that ends in a month or last enough for 3 months, deal with it.

So why don't we discuss some ideas on how this can be solved? Here are some ideas just at random, some of which have been mentioned:

Idea: Have a base drop rate. This drop rate increases over time / fates done in the same area.
Example: You've been farming an atma in Central Thanalan for 2 hours or you've done over 50 fates in the same area. The drop rate will then go up 1-2% every following hour or every 10 fates there after.
Why this idea? It creates a system where people feel like they have control over the situation.


Idea: Let people farm them on their alts once they've activated the quest.
Why this idea? It allows people to feel as though they're not wasting their time entirely. It allows them to progress in other avenues, to get joy out of their time. Most importantly, you feel as though you've progressed in some area after grinding for 4-5 hours instead of feeling like you've wasted your time.





What are other ideas people have?

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Originally Posted by Morphiana

Idea: Let people farm them on their alts once they've activated the quest.
Why this idea? It allows people to feel as though they're not wasting their time entirely. It allows them to progress in other avenues, to get joy out of their time. Most importantly, you feel as though you've progressed in some area after grinding for 4-5 hours instead of feeling like you've wasted your time.

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It should work like this IMO. That way at least the XP from the FATE isn't going to waste and just getting the quest in the first place is proof enough you have a Zenith weapon.

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Originally Posted by Goonie

The atma fate system is fine. Like stated previously you can get a weather weapon or get the tidal weapon if u want something quick. If there is no challenge its no fun. i grinding fates for 12 hours and got all 12.

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This is probably the worst comment for an argument I have ever seen regarding atmas. YOU got lucky and farmed it in 12 hours so you think some people spending days is ok? lol. This is zero challenge at all, it is simple low level busy work to waste your time. I honestly fell asleep the first day doing it because it was so boring. People complained about fates before and asked for dungeon exp because a lot of the community do not like fates, including myself.

There is a HUGE difference between a grind and a mindless waste of time.

Fates - doing level 3-10 fates for a atma at end game level/equip = mindless waste of time

FARMING 13000+ myth in level 50+ dungeons = GRINDING END GAME CONTENT

I have no problem farming the myth, but the fates are just plain retarded and a horrid idea/droprate for many people making it unfun and please don't tell me its a challenge, its not. Its a challenge to see how long you can stay awake at your keyboard.

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

Others are always going to get shafted, no matter what it is.... So far SE has replied nothing on doing anything, no point complaining to something that isn't even the best yet. SE doesn't want you to spend your life on trying to get Atmas. there is turn 6-9 which has the greatest weapon. You could be going there, instead of whining on the forums because of Atma drop rate. The next upgrade doesn't even come out till May... Likely won't even beat the High Allagan till 3.0 upgrade release in June...

You can get content that ends in a month or last enough for 3 months, deal with it.

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Such a dumb post your pushing back because you got your atmas easily and other don't so you think its ok? so stupid. Please its a mindless grind, not a end game grind.

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Originally Posted by Exitusworld

Snip

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It took me a little bit of research to find out the SMN Atma and the Animus don't give me the stats I want (and if upgrades continue in the same path, I'll never want a SMN relic past Zenith) which I can easily get from Leviathan book and the Book of Spades. When I start gearing up WHM with i100 crap, THEN I'll be farming Atmas, as to which really I don't care about the drop rate. I'll just set up a movie, listen to music while I farm, BS around with friends in Teamspeak, but I'll state again...

NOBODY IS HOLDING A GUN TO YOUR HEAD FORCING YOU TO GET YOUR ATMA. THERE'S ALTERNATIVES. If you don't like the grind, quit bitching and don't do it...

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

It took me a little bit of research to find out the SMN Atma and the Animus don't give me the stats I want (and if upgrades continue in the same path, I'll never want a SMN relic past Zenith) which I can easily get from Leviathan book and the Book of Spades. When I start gearing up WHM with i100 crap, THEN I'll be farming Atmas, as to which really I don't care about the drop rate. I'll just set up a movie, listen to music while I farm, BS around with friends in Teamspeak, but I'll state again...

NOBODY IS HOLDING A GUN TO YOUR HEAD FORCING YOU TO GET YOUR ATMA. THERE'S ALTERNATIVES. If you don't like the grind, quit bitching and don't do it...

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LOL, take the nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to get your atma line from how many other threads? THE RELIC IS A MAIN PART OF THE GAME

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Originally Posted by Reoin05

Such a dumb post your pushing back because you got your atmas easily and other don't so you think its ok? so stupid. Please its a mindless grind, not a end game grind.

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You can deny as much as you want, it's content. Same would be to you, people only complain because it's not going their way. It's like, I'm talking to people that think they're entitled to have something. Even if it's luck based, you're still working for it. You can call my post dumb or deny, but the fact is that.

why not post what fates you got the atma in and in which area it was found in. instead of Fate grinding 24/7. I found the atma of the archer in a Ziz fate in North Shroud

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

You can deny as much as you want, it's content. Same would be to you, people only complain because it's not going their way. It's like, I'm talking to people that think they're entitled to have something. Even if it's luck based, you're still working for it. You can call my post dumb or deny, but the fact is that.

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But it's not really work. You're rolling the dice. There's no work or skill involved at all. Being at the right place at the right time and hoping the RNG gods give you the drop you need doesn't reward anyone except those who just got lucky to snag it.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

But it's not really work. You're rolling the dice. There's no work or skill involved at all. Being at the right place at the right time and hoping the RNG gods give you the drop you need doesn't reward anyone except those who just got lucky to snag it.

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Trying to get something is working on. You're working for a Atma to to drop for you, luck always going to be involved with all loots.

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Originally Posted by NintenPyjak64

NOBODY IS HOLDING A GUN TO YOUR HEAD FORCING YOU TO GET YOUR ATMA. THERE'S ALTERNATIVES.

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If your defense is "there are alternatives" then you may as well come out and admit this content is not fun, requires no skill, and is a waste of time in its current state. Content should be challenging or interesting, not tedious and work. People often mistake "work" in an MMO for challenging. Content should be challenging, interesting, or a combination of both. It's a game first and foremost.

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Originally Posted by Undeadfire

You can deny as much as you want, it's content.

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No one is denying it is content. It's just bad content. Lets be honest, WoW's Throne of Thunder's Lightning Forge was a much better idea then whatever this "content" is supposed to be. It was challenging, it had story, it was interesting, it gave players the ability to see progress similar to the primal fights for A Relic Reborn.