tanks do wayy too much damage for their tankiness

why play single damage dps like lancer if pld/war can do pretty much same amount of dmg, maybe lil lower but offfer wayy much more beef and get 2 blm for the dps and aoe?

Err what ?

I'm not quite sure what you're talking about with Paladins, with Wars I feel about the same. How do you even know they're doing more damage than you?

I've got a Dragoon as well but if you have a solid rotation I feel like I'm putting out waaaay more damage than my warrior does so long as you're flanking and disemboweling correctly. If you feel like the Warriors are out damaging you, I can only be led to believe you have a bad rotation.

Warriors and Paladins do not do "maybe lil lower" damage. They do roughly half the DPS in most fights that a true DPS does. Even if I geared fully for damage I wouldn't be able to touch a job that is designed for damage. Their skills are far better for it than a warrior or paladins skills. Combined with the fact that strength ring drops aren't readily lootable by tanks making the gear required annoying to get.

I mean no offense, but you're either a bad dps, or you only play with bad dps. In my experience tanks never come close, and are always last in dps (not including healers).

Now, a warrior off tank can put up some respectable numbers, but that's when they're focusing on dps, not tanking. If they use their tanking skill (Defiance?), their dps goes way down.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

why play single damage dps like lancer if pld/war can do pretty much same amount of dmg, maybe lil lower but offfer wayy much more beef and get 2 blm for the dps and aoe?

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O_o.............? If i ever see a tank doing more than me i will /wrist

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

Warriors and Paladins do not do "maybe lil lower" damage. They do roughly half the DPS in most fights that a true DPS does. Even if I geared fully for damage I wouldn't be able to touch a job that is designed for damage. Their skills are far better for it than a warrior or paladins skills. Combined with the fact that strength ring drops aren't readily lootable by tanks making the gear required annoying to get.

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On a dummy I'll get 220DPS in Sword Oath(400STR) and 250DPS out of Defiance (437STR).

I don't even... Those are either some terrible tanks are some terrible damage dealers.

http://static4.fjcdn.com/comments/36...f68d1dc959.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

why play single damage dps like lancer if pld/war can do pretty much same amount of dmg, maybe lil lower but offfer wayy much more beef and get 2 blm for the dps and aoe?

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Bad rotation is bad.

Check your rotation. (Also you're wearing full Artifact Armour, I'd consider investing in some darklight gear purchased in Mor Dhona)

The damage difference in gear for level 50 is MASSIVE.
Note: What you have now isn't considered decent gear for a level 50 player.

ok give me example of lvl 50 lancer rotation.
lemme see if i do ir ight

thats exactly what i do except heavy thrust
and by off gcd you mena stuff like life surge and blood by blood?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

thats exactly what i do except heavy thrust
and by off gcd you mena stuff like life surge and blood by blood?

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taking your word for it, if that is the rotation you do, then the only problem is upgrading your gears.

Soend some time in the roulette and by Darklight Gear while also farming up the Mythology tomes for Myth gear. A good place to upgrade quickly are the jewelry slots. Upgrade those with Darklight

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seifu

On a dummy I'll get 220DPS in Sword Oath(400STR) and 250DPS out of Defiance (437STR).

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and? I'm assuming there was some purpose to posting numbers that you'd never actually see in a real battle. Also those numbers are considerably lower than a real DPS would put out in the same situation.

Its your gear Erza. An i90 tank might beat you in dps, but once you get better gear they never will.

i guess thats true
i onlty have obelisk as my weapon
maybe thats why

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tiggy

and? I'm assuming there was some purpose to posting numbers that you'd never actually see in a real battle. Also those numbers are considerably lower than a real DPS would put out in the same situation.

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Average 200 on Titan Ex, which is higher than a hell lot of the DPS I've seen in there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

thats exactly what i do except heavy thrust
and by off gcd you mena stuff like life surge and blood by blood?

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You NEED Heavy Thrust. It's an extra 15% damage boost.
Yes I mean BfB and the sort for off GCD too.

Also, after checking Lodestone again, please... REPAIR YOUR GEAR AS YOU WONT GET ANYTHING OUT OF YOUR GEAR IF IT'S BROKEN.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

i guess thats true
i onlty have obelisk as my weapon
maybe thats why

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You also should fire who ever melded STR to your accessories. Most stats are already capped that exist on the accessory. It's best to look up stats you can add to your accessory and start with the most expensive ones first.

Troll thread, nothing to see here. Moving on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

thats exactly what i do except heavy thrust
and by off gcd you mena stuff like life surge and blood by blood?

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Internal release, blood for blood, and life surge. I generally use Internal release before true thrust, life surge before full thrust, and blood for blood before chaos thrust.

Also, off GCD abilities that you can throw in during and between rotations include leg sweep (unless needed for specific stun timing), jump, spineshatter dive, and dragonfire dive, with power surge used to buff up jump or spineshatter dive.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KupoNuts

Troll thread, nothing to see here. Moving on.

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I think you're the troll. The OP is clearly still learning, and wants to get better.

And OP, your obelisk is currently your best piece (poor melding aside). Dont be blaming that for your low dps. You need to get out of your AF gear ASAP. Get some Darklight and CT gear. Your accessories are okay for now as well. Get some ilvl 70 armor, it will make a huge difference.

Don't waste your philosophy tomes on accessory pieces. What you have now (besided bracelet) is better than DL, and will be even better if you ever decide to meld what you have.

are you guys lookign at my equip?
how?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

are you guys lookign at my equip?
how?

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It's magic.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

are you guys lookign at my equip?
how?

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I searched your character name here:
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/

You can do accessories like my gear if you're rich or have a lot of time to SB gear. Or just wait for i90 accessories to drop or buy with meth to replace them.
http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/2162877/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pseudopsia

-buy with meth to replace them.-

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Sounds like a solid plan.

http://static3.wikia.nocookie.net/__...romo_pic_4.jpg

OP, please listen to me. Don't mind these people telling you to upgrade your accessories, they obviously haven't seen your gear on the Lodestone. Get out of all 5 pieces of AF before worrying about any other equipment.

whats AF? i like dont know all these abbreviations yet

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Odd

OP, please listen to me. Don't mind these people telling you to upgrade your accessories, they obviously haven't seen your gear on the Lodestone. Get out of all 5 pieces of AF before worrying about any other equipment.

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They'd need to repair their gear before even attempting to get Darklight.

Step 1: Repair your gear
Step 2: Duty roulette High Level
Step 3: ?????
Step 4: Darklight!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seifu

Average 200 on Titan Ex, which is higher than a hell lot of the DPS I've seen in there.

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That doesn't mean you have high damage. It means you play with a lot of players who still have a lot more to learn about their class than you do. If skilled they would trounce you. I'm not talking about individual differences between players here. I'm talking about the job when performed well has no chance of doing the same damage as a dps who performs the job well. You aren't on an even playing field. You're personal skill being more than another players will naturally happen, and of course sometimes that might mean a tank can out damage a dps. That doesn't make it the rule, or even remotely the ideal situation.

Dragoon AF is not great equipment.

Your accessories could benefit from a few proper melds, but most of all your weapon is considerably weak.

I would suggest looking here for developing and understanding your rotation: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...otation-Reborn

Gather some dungeon gear and build your Relic - you'll see your damage output rise.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

whats AF? i like dont know all these abbreviations yet

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Artifact. The Drachen gears you have are Dragoon's Artifact armors that you gain from the quests at level 45 and 50. Those are entry-level gears and any dungeon gears at endgame is better. So it's just a matter of gears for you since you have very low stats. Also you should watch for stats caps on the items and do not meld if the materia gives you +0 or +1 stats. Rule of thumb is if an item is High Quality, the stats on it are most likely maxed out but there are exceptions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pseudopsia

They are talking about that i90 meth gear.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-and-meth-gear

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No.

Artifact Armor or AF is the il50-55 gear you receive from completing your Job quests.

Dungeon Armor - Vermillion/Hetairos etc. is il60-65 with Darklight Weapons dropping il55

Philosophy Tome gear - il70 includes Darklight Armor, also used for crafted sets Vanya/Gryphonskin

Crystal Tower gear - il80

Mythology Tome gear - il90 this is a recolored and vastly more powerful version of AF.

Primals HMs give ilv60-80 Weapons: Ifrit>Garuda>Moogle>Titan

Relics are il80, Relics upgraded are il90.

Primal EX give il90 accessories and il90 Weapon vouchers.

Coil gives il90 Gear and il95 weapons.


OP you're currently il60-63 or lower correct? - Upgrade to Dungeon gear or Darklight gear. Ask for help properly melding your accessories. Upgrade your weapon as soon as you can.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

why play single damage dps like lancer if pld/war can do pretty much same amount of dmg, maybe lil lower but offfer wayy much more beef and get 2 blm for the dps and aoe?

---

Upon closer examination of your gear on Lodestone...I'd say it's because you're in full AF. You also want more accessories that focus less on Dex and more on Critical hit, Strength, Determination, and Accuracy. Get rid of the AF. Get your hands on Darklight Gear, then once you've got full Dark Light, invest in gear that you buy with Mythology Tomes, and Allagan Gear. You're probably playing with tanks that have item levels way higher than you....that AF is certainly holding you back.

So, it's not that tanks are doing too much damage, but it's that you're not doing enough damage. As my DRG I land crit jumps up to 1000 damage and everything else ranges from 500-700 damage.

Also, I have a PLD item level like..76 or so. I mainly use it just with my friends when we go into hard mode dungeons and just want to farm tomes real quick. I dish out about 150 - 200dmg on my pld with Shield Oath on. If that's in the range of the damage you're doing on Dragoon...yeah. You need to invest in gear better than your AF. Lol

If anything Paladins need a damage increase. We are no where near what a Dragoon is capable of.

But I'm not surprised at his reaction. He's likely unaware that many of the people in groups at lv50 have about 40 item levels on him. They might as well be lv90 characters.

ah ok so its basically my gears
well, those darklight stuff will take a while...

If I had my way Paladins would hit like Cecil from FF4. But then why would you need any other DPS? :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

ah ok so its basically my gears
well, those darklight stuff will take a while...

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You also need to repair your gear, there's one in every city.

Currently your gear is at 0% durability rendering it useless.

Please go find a gear repair NPC (non-playable character) ASAP (as-soon-as-possible)

Example : NEW GRIDANIA :

http://i.imgur.com/iwwT05x.png

woah heavy thrust is OP

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shioban

You also need to repair your gear, there's one in every city.

Currently your gear is at 0% durability rendering it useless.

Please go find a gear repair NPC (non-playable character) ASAP (as-soon-as-possible)

Example : NEW GRIDANIA :

http://i.imgur.com/iwwT05x.png

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Oh, geez, yeah, this for sure... I didn't even think to explain this XD I didn't realize you weren't aware of repairing your gear....

Also, ErzaScarlet77, Darklight Gear is so much easier to get since Patch 2.1...just run a bunch of Castrum / Praetorium runs, and once you have a few, you can start running Amdapor Keep and Wanderer's Palace. Then you'll be getting Philosophy Tomes as well as Mythology Tomes. Then when you're about full Darklight, you can run Haukke Manor (Hard) and Copperbell (Hard) to get 50myth tomes in each of those per run to start getting gear obtained with Mythology Tomes.

Also, don't forget to do your Duty Roulette daily.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ErzaScarlet77

woah heavy thrust is OP

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...Assuming you're unaware of Dragoon attack rotation...I'm going to find my explanation from another thread and post it here.

EDIT: Here it is~

Make sure you're weaving abilities that aren't on your normal cooldown. For instance, this is how I start my fight:

Heavy Thrust > Phlebotomize > Impulse Drive > Disembowel > Chaos Thrust > True Thrust > Vorpal Thrust > Full Thrust

That's the cool down combo, but inbetween attacks, you can throw in some job abilities (where it's safe to do so). So, anywhere in between there, preferably when Heavy thrust is active, you can do something like this : Impulsive Drive > Power Surge > Disembowel > Jump > Chaos Thrust

That's essentially how "weaving" your abilities work. You use abilities that aren't on the cool down while the rest of your abilities are so that you're continuing your damage with minimal downtime.

And I see this mistake a lot....Power Surge is ONLY used for Jump and Spineshatter Dive. People tend to think it's a damage buff for all attacks, but it only affects those two jump abilities. It immediately wears off after you use a jump. Be aware however, that Power Surge does NOT affect Dragonfire Dive.

Which reminds me, I know plenty Dragoons that don't even know what their abilities do. So please, make sure to study what each ability does. Please. I had a guy in coils doing only True Thrust > Vorpal Thrust > Full Thrust because "None of the other abilities seemed useful" and he could "perform these abilities and get the combo from any direction on the mob." Please don't be that way. I almost had a hernia. You are not outputting your potential damage by doing something like that. Especially if you don't even know what the abilities do and you're just pressing buttons and watching what happens.

Be aware of your aoe abilities. Yes, Ring of Thorns combos off Heavy Thrust, but that doesn't mean you should use it. Keep to the combo above. Ring of Thorns and Doom Spike are useful during fights where you need to kill masses...like the Feather Plumes in Garuda Hard Mode. Also, I've found that Doom Spike appears to be more effective than Ring of Thorns in aoe damage. Remember that Doom Spike is a straight line aoe,(Albeit a very wide line...) and Ring of Thorns is a circle aoe.

Also, keep in mind that Dragonfire Dive is affected by Blood for Blood and Internal Release. Useful.

And as always, be mindful of your stun abilities. When stunning isn't important, you can weave Leg Sweep and Spineshatter Dive into your cool downs. In fights where it is very important that only the off tank stuns (ie. Ifrit Hard Mode), be very aware of the abilities you are using and do NOT weave Leg Sweep and Spineshatter Dive.

Lastly, remember to use Elusive Jump. A lot of people try to say it's useless, but it will definitely save you if you're in too deep. You'll lose a huge amount of hate, so you help the tank get hate back, if they lost hate for whatever reason or died, and it's very good for escaping aoe's that are just took big and you know you can't get out of quick enough...Like Tail Drive from Anatoboga, the last boss of Amdapor Keep, or the "blue" aoe lines that take up a majority of the room in the fight with Ash, the mid boss of Haukke Manor Hard.



..And then there's Feint. People say this ability is useless. There's no combo off of it or anything really. so what I do is test and see if the mob you're attacking can be slowed. If it can, Then put Feint into your rotation right after Phlebotomize. If the mob resists slow, you can ignore Feint entirely.



I can not stress it enough please study your abilities and be very aware of what each of them do.

EDIT: My rotation is heavily based off of Mrhappy1227's Dragoon rotation, found here. Though that video is now a bit outdated, it's still very helpful.

Hope this helps.