3k TP in Single Hit Question & Light Thrust v. Heavy Thrust

So, At rank 49, I would hit stuff. I would get, sometimes, up to about 2k TP in a single hit. I rank to 50, and now I get 3Ktp per hit sometimes. The problem is, I can't figure out WHY. At first I thought that it happened as a follow up to Chaos Thrust, except that I ruled that out (it happened several times before I used Chaos thrust). So I thought maybe it was the introduction of Comrade in Arms 2 that cause it; only some times it happens when CiA2 isn't being used.

So I tried to see what would happen if I didn't use any abilities; and of course I could not get 3k TP in a single hit. When I started adding abilities back into my cycle one by one, I would reach a point where I would start getting 3kTP per hit, and then I would remove that ability from my cycle and... still get 3ktp per hit.

I'm frustrated because for the life of me I cannot figure out what is causing it. All I know is that it happens and every time I think I figure out why, I try prove it by removing a skill from my cycle... and I still get 3kTP.

So. Anyone know what the actual skill combination is that lets you get 3k TP per hit? I see it most often when using CiA2, Moon2, Vice, normal attack (3k TP), chaos thrust Moon 2, normal attack (3k TP), CiA2, Moon2, Vice, normal attack (repeat whole cycle).

Also, I have a question regarding Heavy Thrust. In the description of HT, it says something about "increasing TP." Is that referring increasing YOUR TP or the Mobs? And is it actually a higher amount than say, light thrust?

Invigorate II + Comrade in Arms 2 + Heavy Thrust = I'm drowning in TP


Heavy Thrust increases your own TP per hit. The tradeoff is that Heavy Thrust does less damage.

edit: "Full Thrust", not heavy, hehehe *brain fart*

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

Heavy Thrust increases your own TP per hit. The tradeoff is that Heavy Thrust does less damage.

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Full Thrust?!

Heavy Thrust binds the target.

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Originally Posted by Shyd

Full Thrust?!

Heavy Thrust binds the target.

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Did I say Heavy? I meant "Full" lol :p

Except that the 3kTP per hit comes very frequently without Invigorate. So much so that aside from the initial use when entering battle, I don't even bother with it any more. I've reached a point where I have more TP than I know what to do with. I can cycle through all my WS (lnc specific) faster than the cool-down timers allow for, and still have 3k TP at the end - Without Invigorate. I assumed at first that it was that exact combo that causes the obscene and oft repeated 3k TP hits, however, without Invigorate and with Light Thrust, I still get just that; more TP than I know what to do with. Hense, my question regarding WTF is causing this? If I knew, I could attempt to maximize the occurrence.

As it is, I have CiA2, Moon2, Vice, Chaos in my cycle. Whittled down to these four I am able to maintain a TP lock with vice as well as a full DD output with Chaos, and Moon2 in there to lower TP regen in the off chance I miss Vice. Still, would be nice to figure out for better battle planning (especially if by some miracle SE manages to make raids that seriously require strategy).

CIA2 + Full Thrust + INV2, i usually get around 1400-2150 but mostly around 1750~, but i believe it varies with mobs and level.

TP gained per hit is varies greatly depending on mobs level compared to yours. On NMs and r65+ mobs you won't be getting 3k per hit even with comrades and full thrust.

hmmm sounds like you may have found a bug, even with CiA2, Invig2, and full thrust you will not get 3k tp with that one hit, Chaos thrust, Twisting Vice, and Moonrise wouldn't have anything to do with it as none of those abilities increase the TP you receive, CT will use up all your TP, TV will wipe your targets TP, and MR will decrease the TP gain of your target, so none of them enhance your TP gaining ability.

question might be what are you fighting, and how much defense does it have. because based tp is damage based. go fight something really hard and see when your tp spikes.

I first noticed it in R40 leves almost immediately after dinging 50. That change in TP generation is what clued me in to the fact that something had changed (I hadn't even noticed that I had ranked, it was so anti-climactic. I can't say that I've paid any specific attention to when fighting higher ranking stuff like the buff or dodore, I just assumed that it was normal and have taken it for granted since. I will pay more attention to the level of mobs, etc., and what exactly I'm fighting. See if I see any different results on R60+ mobs.

Regardless, I'm aware of what TV, CT, and MR2 do, which is part of my confusion. As far as I can tell, NOTHING that I am using is significantly different than other LNC. I should point out, however, that another LNC 50 I frequently duo with has an almost identical action bar setup and cycle as I do, as well as nearly identical stats and gear and he experiences the same free-flowing TP that I do. If I can find my old copy of FRAPS, I'll see about posting a video of it but no promises. It might have been on my HDD that (literally) ground to a halt.

I mean i get TP super fast but I have never gone from 0 to 3K in one hit and you shouldn't be gaining any TP from using a weapon skill in fact you should only be loosing it, none of the lancer I know have experienced this that I know of

Pooka, just enjoy the gift from the TP gods. It'll be taken away from us soon enough.

hmm I dunno, Lancers are gonna be the new hotness now with speed surge increasing auto attack rate

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Originally Posted by Honz

TP gained per hit is varies greatly depending on mobs level compared to yours. On NMs and r65+ mobs you won't be getting 3k per hit even with comrades and full thrust.

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I've gotten 3k TP per hit quite some times in Buffalo NM... But somehow almost always after Simian Thrash, always with Invigorate II and maybe CiA active, I think...
Think it's just a bug so never really payed much attention, thought a lot of people already knew of this lol

Usually happens after Chaos Thrust and having Cia2 active. Must be a bug as it doesn't always happen but is quite frequent.

How in hells name where you getting 3ktp in one hit? XD

So today, fighting Ura. Used Chaos Thrust. Hit 0TP. Used Heavy Thrust. 3kTP. No CIA2 icon on Ura at the time. Also happened on buff, this time after I died, ran /back/ to the fight, unloaded a Chaos Thrust, regular attak, 3kTP. No idea which buffs/debuffs were on buff at the time. Wicked stuff.

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Originally Posted by origamikitsune

No idea which buffs/debuffs were on buff at the time.

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I love this sentence by itself.

Aside, Chaos Thrust is ridiculous. You really don't need any buffs or debuffs up most times I've found to hit 3k TP with the hit after it.

hmm if we can narrow it down to chaos thrust then i would be wiling to bet it has something to do with the ability being multiple hits.

Possible Bug: first hit of chaos thrust drains all available TP each additional hit adds TP but said TP is not applied until the next non TP consuming attack is used.

That seems to be going on; except that it is related more to the character than the mob. You can use CT one mob, kill it, then attack another mob. You still benefit from the rapid TP gain. Perhaps it has to do with the fact that only the first attack on CT is considered the weaponskill? What I mean by that is if you use something like Bloodlust, you only gain HP off the first attack. I assume that your buffs for more damage work the same way (I haven't actually investigated, I assume that since it works that way with bloodlust, it works that way with he others). But for whatever reason, if that is the case, it explains what is going on.

Question is... is it a bug? Or is it working as intended? If it is a bug... how is that going to affect multi-hit weapons when we have them? I would be very interested to know how a PGL gains TP. Anyone want to do some testing on PGL to see if TP gain is for one or two hits? If there is a coloration to multi-hit (as opposed to the WS itself).

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Originally Posted by origamikitsune

That seems to be going on; except that it is related more to the character than the mob. You can use CT one mob, kill it, then attack another mob. You still benefit from the rapid TP gain. Perhaps it has to do with the fact that only the first attack on CT is considered the weaponskill? What I mean by that is if you use something like Bloodlust, you only gain HP off the first attack. I assume that your buffs for more damage work the same way (I haven't actually investigated, I assume that since it works that way with bloodlust, it works that way with he others). But for whatever reason, if that is the case, it explains what is going on.

Question is... is it a bug? Or is it working as intended? If it is a bug... how is that going to affect multi-hit weapons when we have them? I would be very interested to know how a PGL gains TP. Anyone want to do some testing on PGL to see if TP gain is for one or two hits? If there is a coloration to multi-hit (as opposed to the WS itself).

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Same happens sometimes with PGL after using Simian Thrash, as I stated in this thread before.

Well, indications are that this has been fixed as a bug in the new patch notes. The didn't mention Chaos Thrust + CiA2 in particularly, however it certainly fits. Hope I don't become known as the Asshat That Killed TP for bringing it up! XD

Pooka, it's all your fault.

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Originally Posted by origamikitsune

Well, indications are that this has been fixed as a bug in the new patch notes. The didn't mention Chaos Thrust + CiA2 in particularly, however it certainly fits. Hope I don't become known as the Asshat That Killed TP for bringing it up! XD

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yeah must of been a mix of CiAII, multi attack, normal attack. Oh well we still build up the TP faster then anyone, and as long as lances weapon delay isn't obnoxiously long speed surge will add to it as well.