Another silly idea flew through my head.
It has been stated that jobs will be the same level as the class they are associated with, meaning a rank 50 gladiator will be rank 50 palladin. So a question then comes into how the jobs will "Grow"
Will they simply gain abillities as you rank up? rather stale don't you think? Why not just add the skills to gladiator then.
I propose a solution to this problem
Have some sort of progression system for "Jobs" outside the current rank system, wether it be questing new skills, or preforming certain tasks to unlock abillities, or some sort of "Merit system" like in XI.
Imagine it like this.
-Shield expertise "Min rank to unlock" 5
Gain expert handeling with a shield in your off-hand blocking blows more frequently than usual "5% chance to block attacks without having sheild raised"
Goal: Block 100 attacks.
-Shield expertise II "Min rank to unlock" 15
~"10% chance to block attacks without having sheild raised"
Goal: Block 100 critical attacks
Gaining "Points" for said goals would be somewhat like "Skillups" in XI where you had to at least gain some sort of exp to "Count" Personally I think it would be a good way to inject a form of lateral progression alongside the normal progression of ranks, and a well needed time sink.
What do you guys think?
Jobs like merits
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06-22-2011, 07:32 PMJynxJobs like merits
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06-22-2011, 07:40 PMAlexiaKidd
I am hoping for a merit system to be put in place at some point but I think they will wait until FFXIV's true cap is revealed so at R75-99, then hopefully it will be put into place.
As for Jobs using a merit style system, that could be good and a way to level our jobs without levelling ^^ -
06-22-2011, 07:57 PMNero
A Merit-System i will like of course. But i think its to early to speculate about a System like that, since the Levelcap is still at 50. So i agree with both posts before me.
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06-22-2011, 09:45 PMnormalforceI like the idea, but — and it might be the earlier hour here — how would you gain points in your idea? Would it be like the Weaponskill quest in FFXI, where you needed 1000 points from successfully completing a skillchain? Or, are we talking about just successfully blocking X amount of attacks to gain some the merits.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jynx
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06-22-2011, 10:20 PMOscillate_Wildly
The one thing about jobs that really had me peeved was that nothing would be leveled up separately but instead quested for, if only because there are jobs I miss from XI. I understand, the way Gladiator is, it is very Paladin-like and so that's understandable. There's no reason to level up what you've already leveled up.
But in the future, so long as they offer new weapons and classes with classic FF names and a new spin on their role in the game, I will be happy, and a merit system would be a bonus.
I imagine if they did do a merit system they'd try to tie it into the guilds. O: -
06-22-2011, 10:23 PMArchadius
Didn't they already confirm that jobs will have quests for you to unlock additional skills, etc? That can be seen as a method of growth. I do like merits though. Helps to give an edge to players that put in the extra effort.
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06-22-2011, 10:25 PMOscillate_Wildly
Agreed, and yes they are skills you quest for after reaching a certain rank. I do hope they are at least a little difficult to acquire as you go on. Like unlocking weapon skills in XI to, as well as merits, give a little incentive to players who put in extra effort.
It's nice to have goals. -
06-22-2011, 10:27 PMnormalforceIf they have, I missed it. I had hoped they weren't going to just give us anything, and I do like the idea of rewarding those who put in the effort. It was something mentioned in this thread by Rentahamster about Leaderboards and Achievements.Quote:
Originally Posted by Archadius
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06-22-2011, 10:49 PMArchadiusI'm like 99% sure it was mentioned officially, and if I could remember where, I'd link it for you :( If you wanna search for yourself though, I'm pretty sure it was in a Letter From the Producer.Quote:
Originally Posted by normalforce
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06-22-2011, 10:51 PMnormalforceExcellent, I'll read back through the letters then. Thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Archadius
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06-22-2011, 10:52 PMAlexiaKiddIt was confirmed in something that Jobs and new skills and abilities for Jobs would be unlocked through quests. Have to dig the source up though but I think it was in either the battle reform or one of the producer letters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Archadius
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06-22-2011, 10:54 PMgiftforce
As long as it is FUN I don't care. I just dont want to have to grind a million hours to remain relevant.
Most people see "merit system" and see "grind system" instead so you can forgive me if I missed the point. -
06-23-2011, 04:15 AMJynx
I just personally think having a progression not just exp wise would be a benifit to giving the game much more longevity. For those who asked how you would gain the points.
Yes it would be just from blocking X-number of attack in my palladin example "As long as you could gain SP off said mob" making some goals much easier to hit than others but the rewards for the toupher goals would be rewarding. Obviously the system would need tweaks and balances and I guess I may have used the word "Merits" in the inproper way.
I don't mean something to do once your capped "Although a merit system would be nice once the game hits the final lvl cap" I meant it as a sideways progressions system where you can improve your character through task oriented "quests". Instead of the quest being Go to X and Kill Y it could be something more like.
Show us you can deftly handle your shield and I'll teach you Y go do X task. -
06-23-2011, 04:23 AMnorthernsky
The thing I also liked about merits is that you had some limited points to spend in different categories, meaning that not every player put his points at the same place. This tradeoff allowed for a certain customization and would be good for the incoming jobs.
Also there were those "general" merits to increase attributes or HP/MP for example, which in some way could replace the current physical level. They don't have to call it "merit" but I liked the fact that in some way, with the physical level, having your lancer at rank 45 makes you a stronger marauder at rank 15 than a 15MRD with no other jobs ranked up. I think the bonus was too much but there could be a way to scale a "merit-like" bonus to your attributes depending on your total amount of level on your different classes. -
06-23-2011, 04:36 AMAlexiaKidd
Hehe Jynx sorry think we trailed off onto a merit point system now, but I still like your idea. Merit points should come for sure down the line when we have our final cap. As for your ideas I like them, like mini quests and challenges to unlock new things.
I kinda wish they had more stat options in the game things like parry, block, evasion that you could skill up on too this would/could help with your system too. So if you reached a certain block level with your shield you would unlock a quest to gain a new defensive skill or even greater shield mastery. -
06-23-2011, 04:48 AMnormalforceYea, they seemed to miss the boat on that one. I had a fun time leveling up parry and evasion in FFXI.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexiaKidd
Ok, maybe fun wasn't the word I used at the time. But I was dedicated in my pursuits and it was something that I had to work toward. Something that I was proud of at the end of the day. -
06-23-2011, 07:03 AMJynx
While "Skilling up" was a massive undertaking at times it did have very visible positives for doing them. I don't wish for the "You have a chance to skillup" system that XI had where parrying and guard was like pulling teeth.
But a linear progression system where you can see your progress and effects of being good at certain aspects of your job. -
06-23-2011, 07:23 AMReinheart
I know I bring back DDO stuff a lot into my posts although it has crappiest graphics and I hate D&D... The system wasn't that bad on class builds. If you rank up you choose what abilities you want with something like merit points, which you can't change back making your character specific for whatever build you're making. If you really wanted to reset all build/merit points they had NPC where you gotta trade some crazy items to reset and more you reset I think the price gets higher... anyways main point being.
Say the classes like the rep said stays with the Job but Job had its own level
Class Level being CL and Job Level being JL.
Class Level capped at 50 just like now.
Job Level capped at 30 for this example.
Say I am Gladiator CL50 right now but since they just released the job system I now have the option of become a [Paladin] or [Dark Knight] after completing whatever requirements to use that job.
First I wanted to level Paladin to JL30 (cap) so I do that and gain the abilities/skills/traits of Paladin, then next since I'm capped I do Dark Knight to JL30 to gain those abilities.
Paladin gets mainly tanking skills/abilities/traits
Dark Knight gets mainly attacking skills/abilities/traits
Now here is the fun part:
Say I completed both jobs (Paladin and Dark Knight) to JL30 now I ca nbuild my character for that class. Total must be JL30.
JL20 Dark Knight + JL10 Paladin = JL30(Max) total giving me skills/abilities of Dark Knight up to JL20 and Paladin up to JL10 but I cannot use any abilities/skill/traits from JL21-30 Dark Knight or JL11-30 Paladin.
Can do the other way to JL20 Paladin + JL10 Dark Knight = more defensive character but still having some/little offensive skills from Dark Knight up of JL10
If I want basic single job JL30 Paladin = This will make it more defensive since everything is Paladin, I can use all the abilities/skill/traits of the paladin, but nothing from Dark Knight since I spent all the JL on Paladin.
You can still mix/match other CLASS skill/ability/trait just as now but you cannot mix jobs from different CLASS into one class...
Example me being Gladiator Class with Job Paladin JL30 can use Thaumaturge or Conjurer (Class) abilities/skill/traits but I cannot use anything from White Mage, Black Mage, Summoner (JOBS)
Am I making any sense?... kind of confusing myself LOL
Anyways I hope you get my point... this type of system would of been fun imo and gives players more variety, stand out as individual players.
Probably end game will be close to same build but gives chance to change if you want to be specific for solo player base, or party based depending on how you build your class/job(s) combination.
EDIT: Warrior is probably job for Marauder huh...since it uses axe as main if same as FFXI... More like Paladin and Dark Knight might of been better example... oh well.
EDIT2: Gladiator Base shouldn't be R20... since you can use abilities/skills from class all the way... I should of renamed it Class Level (CL) and Job Level (JL) or something to make it clear...
EDIT3: Edited the post to make it little bit more clear... I hope it's better... LOL -
06-23-2011, 07:40 AMnormalforceDefinitely. I see no reason why they couldn't expand on this idea to cover all sorts of useful skills and/or to bestow bonuses when fighting against a monster type that you have plenty of experience battling with. It could be something more than just kill 1000 Coblyns and get granted a small bonus: like Attack or Defense Bonus +1% against all Coblyns, or increased Evasion. Maybe after you gain a certain amount of exp points from killing them. Break points could be something like 50,000, 100,000, 200,000, 500,000, etc., — which isn't too bad, 100 exp per kill would be 500 kills for the first "level" — each giving you small bonuses that could add up to something nice.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jynx
Even just tracking what you've killed and how much exp you've gotten from them would be nice. -
06-24-2011, 08:06 AMJynx
It's a shame we don't know more about the job system than we do. For all we know it could be something crazy inventive or just something that gives your job a few more skills with no real effort.