How far can a casual go?

How far can you currently realistically expect to get in this game without a progressing FC, without vent, just using DF (assuming you have appropriate skill and gear)?

At what point do you start needing vent, or a regular group to clear content?

**For the sake of this question I'm defining a casual as a player without a FC or regular group, without ventrillo, just using DF**

*** progress update ***
-I have a full set ilv70 crafted gear... mostly unmelded.
-I have cleared upto and including Garuda HM and King Mog, using DF only (I haven't done Haukke HM, Copperbell HM, Pharos Sirus).
-I have not yet attempted Titan HM (you all scared me!), or Ultima.

if your criteria is JUST DF, then you could do up to and through the extreme mode primals, just dont expect much success. Coil of Bahamut is not available through the DF, but you might be able to snag a group through the party finder, same with the extreme modes. Coil turns 1-5 will be available through the DF in 2.2 I believe and will be nerfed a bit, to make way for turns 6-9

reliable success through the DF? HM primals up to garuda, and crystal tower.

Coil to T4 with pug

I clear all HM primals daily with pug. havent tried em primals.

As someone who is not a part of a large Free Company, I have been able to progress thru the content all the way up to and including end-game content.
Using Duty Finder, as well as the recently added Paert Finder, you can find groups to do just about anything.

Wait times for DF and PF will vary depending on yor role in the party; Healers and Tanks usually get into things rather quickly, while DPS will wait longer (somtimes considerably longer

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Originally Posted by Vanroe

Coil turns 1-5 will be available through the DF in 2.2 I believe and will be nerfed a bit, to make way for turns 6-9.

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I made this thread now because I assume each patch probably will let casuals get a little further, but didn't neccessarily want to get into that...

Thanks for the responses.

Titan HM and Coil are generally the biggest stumbling blocks. (EM primals excluded since they are past Titan HM)


Realistically, I don't think that a casual player would have much of a problem getting to Titan HM through PF and DF.

With the addition of CT and it's ilvl 80 loot... I don't think many casual players will find getting to Coil all that difficult either (just gear up in CT and DL)


Clearing Titan HM requires people being on the same page, as do Coil turns. This is generally where you're going to want to find a FC/friends to play with that you know and trust in-game to perform their role.


Sure, you could luck out and join a PUG with 7 other experienced players who play well and clear all content in the game... but, that's more the exception to the rule than the norm.

To me Titan HM is the glass ceiling for DF groups, was never in one that managed to get it done.

If you use PF you can do anything in this game up to T5. I think you will need a coordinated group and voice comm for T5.

I'm a casual and I'm doing coil t1 and t2 with pugs without too much effort.

One hour per day since September, beat Titan HM through PF in 30-40 tries, beat T1 third try(wiped 2 times before doing it), T2 first try(but that's not an achievement with enrage...). I'm going to ry Garuda EM, doesn't seem that hard, as a WHM. Titan EM and T5 might be difficult to beat before 2.2.

In theory, you could do everything in this game without voip. In theory. Things will probably fall apart in extreme primals and certain coil fights if nobody has voip. If only you don't have voip you could get away with it provided you were not a key role such as interrupts/healing/tanking.

You don't need voice chat for anything in this game, most people that totally insist it is necessary guyz mostly need it as a safety blanket.

All the situations you need to communicate for in this game can be handled with macros with sound effects or personal awareness.

I only really joined a progressing FC within the last week - and I had gotten up to Binding Coil Turn 4 on my own. Mostly through DF or PF, no voice chat. It just takes a lot longer.

For instance, I was joining PF group for Titan HM to get my WHM relic for about 2 weeks, several hours a night, almost every night, before I got in a group that could actually beat it. If you're playing casually, that could stretch into months if you're unlucky. But that's really the ONLY fight in the game so far that is horribly difficult without a FC.

With PUG:

All primals daily, up to T3 weekly (working on T4 phase 6), havent tried em primals

"How far can a casual go?"

How big is his/her wallet? (kidding)

While Titan HM will definitely trip you up in a DF group, a PF group can work for a casual player. Two reasons for this:

1) A PF group isn't forced into having an unneeded second tank for the trial, and therefore gets the benefit of an added DPS.

2) You're forming up and able to communicate with everyone before jumping in. Also, the PF will let you know the tone set for that particular group before you join. I've seen a few "Newcomer's Welcome/Slow and Easy" groups for Titan HM.

Is there a reason not to be in an FC? No VoIP and DF only I can understand, but all that aside, being in an FC helps casuals.
Reason? FC buffs are purely beneficial.

As a casual, you should look to join an Fc. If you don't want to talk to anyone in the Fc, ok- just filter them out so you don't see their chat. (I personally love FC/LS chat, but to each his own).

Anyway, with that aside, most casual players with no VoIP that I have met, have relic and turns 1 and 2 on farm. I'm guessing they are farther then that, but since they are casual, I don't see them on often

I have pugged T5. So using party finder certainly makes all the content accessible.

FCs have too much drama, which is why not everyone wants to join, even for buffs.

I got through Garuda EM on DF, but it wasn't fun anymore starting with Titan HM due to the high failure rate combined with the high amount of raging and quitting on first wipe.

I agree with others that PFs help increase what you can do without an FC, although you have to look a bit (or make your own group) to find one that isn't "i90 required for Sastasha, experienced only, no melee".

Short answer: you can do all the content (use PF more then DF tho)

I have pugged everything except T5.

I'd consider myself a casual player, I got from lvl 1-50 and past all the HM primals using DF back in October. Didn't really start needing help till I tried to find pugs to run coil.

everything available in df is doable with df.

and t1-t4 doable with partyfinder
t5 is questionable, an fc would be a great advantage

the game is about as casual-friendly as it gets though.

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Originally Posted by Yunnie

Is there a reason not to be in an FC? No VoIP and DF only I can understand, but all that aside, being in an FC helps casuals.
Reason? FC buffs are purely beneficial.

As a casual, you should look to join an Fc. If you don't want to talk to anyone in the Fc, ok- just filter them out so you don't see their chat. (I personally love FC/LS chat, but to each his own).

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Some people prefer not to join Guilds/FC/Whatever you want to call it. It generally comes with a certain amount of responsibility and expectation and if you are not seen as a "team player" it can cause drama. Personally i find it better to avoid it. You can still find groups through meeting decent players and having them on your friends list without having any sort of obligations such as earning money to buy them a guild house or something.

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Originally Posted by MXMoondoggie

Some people prefer not to join Guilds/FC/Whatever you want to call it. It generally comes with a certain amount of responsibility and expectation and if you are not seen as a "team player" it can cause drama. Personally i find it better to avoid it. You can still find groups through meeting decent players and having them on your friends list without having any sort of obligations such as earning money to buy them a guild house or something.

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Cute post and I agree, some prefer not to. But that type of casual who shows no effort to get better (getting VoIP, even just to listen, finding a solid group, usually an FC group or owning up to the responsibility of end-game content progression) has no right to sit here and QQ about the not progressing because of bad PF groups or people not taking them because they refuse to abide by the rules set by the leader of the raid (i.e. not getting Vent, TS3, etc). Either you do it or you don't go and what's laughable is they start throwing labels on people as "elitists".

static is easy mode anyway, most people clear everything in 1-2 hours. Pugging would just be a bit like lottery, you dont know with who your getting yourself into, eventually you will win just depends on how much time you spend as well, also sync may not all be there. Luckily this game is pretty easy so definitely puggable.

If anything so far this game is literally made for casuals.

You don't really need anything more than the DF to get most things done.

The only thing is if you want to do coil that's where the Voip and the other stuff starts to matter.

But apart from that, this game doesn't get more casual imo.

Nothing like what FFXI was at all.

So yeah, for casuals they should have plenty of stuff that they can do without any probs.

I've cleared all ex primals multiple times a week, turns 1-5 weekly, and still consider myself casual.

I don't use voice communication, not even to listen, which hasn't impacted me at all, I play very little, I don't associate myself with a big fc, (apart of a tiny one of close friends from old games. [not mmo's])

This is my first mmo, I've easily cleared everything as a casual, I'm not carried, I just know my job.

Hope this answers your question!

Oh and I'm ps3 lol

OP reporting back - great discussion, and helpful in setting expectations - thanks so much!

I'm not sure what kind of player I'm going to be... I've raided enough in other games to know there's a big enough difference in guilds/FCs that I need to find the right one. I don't want to spend time and effort doing that until I have abetter feel for the game. I am lv 50 in all DoL and DoH, and will probably have a bunch of ilv 70 (weapon and three pieces of vanya already) before I do any of the lv 50 content at all, so gear/loot won't be a limiting factor for some time.

I play pretty casually and do a lot of pugging and right now I'm up to Twintania and Ifrit Extreme. It all depends on how you use your available time, although I do try to set aside at least one night a week to raid with my FC, although it doesn't always happen.

I'm not sure what's preventing a casual player from joining a FC or using voice chat. There are plenty of FCs out there that play casually and it's sometimes nice to be able to ask familiar people to play with. Voice chat is just a quick download and you're set to go. You don't even need to talk, just being able to listen can improve performance greatly and it allows people to relay information faster when they can't afford to type during battle.

PF Coil up to T4
DF HM garuda is ez
DF HM titan, EX garuda, ultima is doable (30% clean rate?)
PF EX Titan/Ifrit is dobale
PF T5? some reddit guys did it before and won.

I casual player , my wife is even more than casual XD , but all we left from content that not done it's T5

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Originally Posted by Espon

I play pretty casually and do a lot of pugging and right now I'm up to Twintania and Ifrit Extreme. It all depends on how you use your available time, although I do try to set aside at least one night a week to raid with my FC, although it doesn't always happen.

I'm not sure what's preventing a casual player from joining a FC or using voice chat. There are plenty of FCs out there that play casually and it's sometimes nice to be able to ask familiar people to play with. Voice chat is just a quick download and you're set to go. You don't even need to talk, just being able to listen can improve performance greatly and it allows people to relay information faster when they can't afford to type during battle.

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I only reached 50 recently, and havent done a lv 50 instance yet (will do CM quest soon!). I have ilv 70 weapon, body, legs, feet, and waist. If some of my market listings sell, I can pretty easily make the ilv 70 accessories. I don't think my grear will be a limiting factor for a while :)

-Nothing is preventing me from having a FC, but I currently don't have a FC that's terribly active, and my regular availability is only later in the week, when some of the more regular/serious players and FCs I've met are typically already "done" for the week.
-I'm on PS3, so voice chat isn't terribly convenient - I got away from PC gaming partially because I like playing games as they came in the box.

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Originally Posted by Simaril

.....**For the sake of this question I'm defining a casual as a player without a FC or regular group, without ventrillo, just using DF**

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This game is very well designed for the casual community, however you want to define it.

Based on the OP definition, content with 'relatively high' success (i.e. at least 1/4 - 1/3 odds) using DF PUG would be CT, up to Garuda, or possibly even Ultima HM (depending on time of day server, etc). Titan HM is doable in DF, and even more so since 2.1 but the odds are more along 1/20 or even worse. Garuda EM is also doable in DF with roughly the same likelihood as Titan HM; Titan and Ifrit EM - I have no experience in any format, but this just looks horrible using DF alone.

Party finder PUG dramatically increases the likelihood of Titan HM success. Also with PF, you can do T1-T2 easily, and T4 is feasible too.

I would say this is applicable even if you include other elements commonly associated with 'casual' - i.e. lack of a 'high end' gaming system, limited time commitment, absence of preternatural finger dexterity, less aggressive mindset, etc.etc.