PLD cooldowns in T5?

Just wondering, I don't know if my SCH wasn't prepping for DS like he should, but my static WHM said she was low on mana when we got to the 3rd conflag.

How should I be rotating my PLD cooldowns, and when?

Just on all death sentences? When rampart and sentinel down, use shield cd + convalescence?

I am a WAR, but I would be using your damage mitigation cooldowns only on death sentences. Are you going into the conflag? If you time it right you can avoid death sentences in phase 2 (most of the time) by timing phase one exit correctly. You don't have to do this obviously, but it can help.

Sch should use Adloquium prior to ds whm or off tank should stone skin. You typically don't "have" to use cd's until after the Dive Bomb phase.

I am not saying don't use the cd's during the early phase. I am just stating that your lack of your cool downs should not be whats causing your whm to run out of mana that early.

Ds applies a debuff that causes normal heals to heal for jack squat. Sch should use lustrate after ds to top you back off.

It seem like your whm is over healing and running out of mana. Make sure whm is using Shroud as well. A lot of whm's hang onto it like a golden egg and wont use it.

This is basically a 10-13 min fight and you could get off a decent amount of shrouds in that time. If you have a bard have them use ballad but, in the end I personally think it's the whm's mana usage is the issue.

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Originally Posted by Symbiant

Sch should use Adloquium prior to ds whm or off tank should stone skin. You typically don't "have" to use cd's until after the Dive Bomb phase.

I am not saying don't use the cd's during the early phase. I am just stating that your lack of your cool downs should not be whats causing your whm to run out of mana that early.

Ds applies a debuff that causes normal heals to heal for jack squat. Sch should use lustrate after ds to top you back off..

This is basically a 10-13 min fight and you could get off a decent amount of shrouds in that time. If you have a bard have them use ballad but, in the end I personally think it's the whm's mana usage is the issue.

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The DS debuff is only in phase 2. But I will have a chitchat with my whm lady. I don't think I was getting lustrated everytime, which also could be the issue since lustrate is hp % based.

For DS pop 1 CD at a time from lolsight>rampart>bulwark>sentinel, once you have a gap use virus. Always save ur HG for liquid hell.

Between T5 and other turn, there is a big gap for sch. That 's the fight you could realize who is a good healer.

I am a WAR, I can handle DS dmg with IB+SP and going into the conflag when i have close to full hp and DS is been casting

I am still a bit new to T5 but we finally downed it tonight and it took me some experimenting to cycle cooldowns properly. It also depends on the party composition. But what I did

Initial pull, pulling adds and twin, FOF, run in, shield lob twin, pop rampart (this bypasses that weird aggro bug at the beginning), then I hit foresight, spam flash, as I throw just ROH's not charged on each enemy. After R and FS wear off I do bulwark and bloodbath, then a sentinel for DS. Then throw in convalescence somewhere in there, by next DS i got rampart again. I use rampart a lot bc its 60 sec CD and its pretty good mitigation.
Its more about when and when not to use CDS in this fight. Some points you wanna save them and some times you are free to pop.

So basically, the initial pull, I pop em all, even HG bc I will have them all when I need them. I dont need many CDs during conflags bc I dodge all DS by running into con flag. If ur group is timing right, you wont get hit by one DS during conflag. Then during snakes, I pop bulwark and then a bloodbath a bit later. Dont use too many CDs here bc u really need them for all 5 snakes.

The most stressful spot imo is all 5 snakes. We had a marauder in our group, so he tanked the big snake while I tanked the 2 littles. Right before the 4 and 5 snakes pop, I provoke the big snake while I already have hate on the 1st 2 little ones. I shield lob big snake while running across to 4th and 5th. On my way, I pop rampart, shield lob left (4th) and flash or lob right (5th) snake. I run back a few steps toward the 3 snakes, then pop sentinel, and then 5 secs later pop convalescence. I try to only do those, our healers could heal thru it, and the little snakes go down quick even with a 2 LB, so they shouldnt do much dmg. Thats only if u dps the first 2 littles ones down before pulling 4th and 5th. So when all little snakes are down, I run to the middle in between the 2 nuerolinks and finish him off there. I dont use any CDs on only big snake, bc u need CDs for dread phase. This is bc of DS and infirmity healing rebuff so u def want a cpl CDs to go into the phase with. I usually have rampart by then, bulwark comes back soon and bloodbath, and conva will be back by like 3rd dreadknight. If you ever dont have CDs or they are too close to tell, tell someone to throw eye for an eye to be safe.

The first cpl days of T5 practice, I did HG on snakes phase, but u dont need it. If you have a few CDs stacked during snakes,along with virus on a cpl snakes and eye for eyes, youll be fine. I actually didnt even use HG during our kill run, but its def good to save if a healer is dead during hatch phase. If a healer is dead and the other is dodging liquid hells, you are screwed lol. Also, HG can be used if you, as main tank, gets targeted by liquid hell. You pop HG, let the 5 LH stack, then move a few steps to the right or left so that when HG is done, you are out of the LH. We got very lucky during our hatch phase that neither MT or OT got targeted by LH, but if it did target me, I was ready with HG. Noone died during our kill run either which really helps immensely lol. Good luck. I know its lengthy but I am fresh out of 6 hours of T5 raiding and this is exactly how I did it tonight. Hopefully you got stoneskin as well. It comes in handy if you can time it right.

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Originally Posted by Pesmergia

How should I be rotating my PLD cooldowns, and when?

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I just stoneskin myself for each DS. You shouldn't need a cooldown to eat it unless your healers are in a conflag.

If I have a healer in Conflag I Foresight and Stoneskin the DS. If it happens again I Rampart and stoneskin it. You shouldn't need to do anything more than that. If your heals are struggling hard on keeping you up then they need to have DS timer called out for them so they know what to prep. A SCH should never let you get hit without an adlo. WHM should be timing cure 2 to land as DS hits you but before the debuff applies.


Also if your healers are low on mana, get your BRD (Please don't tell me you don't have one) to sing mana song! It shouldn't be necessary, but if you have one you might as well use it.

Trying to have a CD up for every DS is not gonna work on PLD. It is better to play it by ear. Healer in conflag? Pop a CD, HP not-full and DS incoming? Pop a CD. Someone died to conflag? Pop a CD. On all other situations you should have Stoneskin being timed to be before or after the DS. This is good practice for the last 2 phases as well, since you'll need to learn when your healers simply cannot help you.

WHM should also not be emptying itself here. Let the SCH do the brunt of the healing with Lustrate. WHM's job on the tank should be Regen and SS, but mostly should focus on the party. Only exception is when SCH is conflaged, then by all means dump your mana on the tank.

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Originally Posted by Kimura410

Words.

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Right, you downed it and all which is great but this post is very confusing. At first I thought you were single tanking... but you're not. Why aren't you tanking Twin initially and having the other tank tank the adds? Also I'm not sure if you meant Warrior or not, because if your other tank changed to Marauder... he might need to rethink some things. Your post is helpful with the cooldown timing but it's also just... a really confusing method for T5. If it works it works but you might want to try simpler methods than tanking all the adds + Twin when you have another tank in the group. O_O

The offtank is a marauder with a bunch of cool downs so hes almost like a dps. Honestly, he didnt have a dps class and I am more geared so he worked with what he could to make himself a dps lol. It is confusing because we used an unorthodox method, a PLD with a marauder off tank. You could say I solo tanked it. The only part he tanked was the big snake until the 4th and 5th snakes appeared, at which point I provoked the big one and tanked all of them. This allowed me to slack on CDs during the phase of only 3 snakes. I tanked everything in the first phase just bc its what the group preferred, they felt it was cleaner bc the adds werent scattered about. Also that early in the fight, I am free to pop every single CD and have them back when I need them.

I know my post was very lengthy, but when I was trying to pick up tank specific tips before beating T5, I read every single detail I could, so I figured the OP would as well. Or he could flat out ignore it. In the end it doesnt make a difference to me, just attempting to help :)

Out of curiosity, how did your WHM deplete her MP when she's just half way through Phase 2? :confused:

BTW your team's bard should also play Ballad after killing adds in Phase 1 and off it once enters Phase 2 to help topping off your healer's MP

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Out of curiosity, how did your WHM deplete her MP when she's just half way through Phase 2? :confused:

BTW your team's bard should also play Ballad after killing adds in Phase 1 and off it once enters Phase 2 to help topping off your healer's MP

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I think the healers need to manage their MP well. My healers never need ballad at all during the entire fight.

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Originally Posted by JeTaisNoobie

I think the healers need to manage their MP well. My healers never need ballad at all during the entire fight.

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Well, technically they may not need but since OP's team seems to have problems, I guess ballad-ing at P1 may help them a little.

For me (main BRD) I just ballad after killing the 3 dragon adds in P1 until the nerolink drops, well my MP is there for free so I just use it to keep my healers at 100% MP :p

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Originally Posted by Kimura410

Words PT2

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Ah, alright. Yeah, that's basically the single tank method and MRD deeps are pretty decent (not great, but decent). Just hadn't heard of someone going MRD for T5 before so I was super confused. :P

To manage cd's using a paladin is not complicate, but need practice.

First at all, use a macro like this

/p death sentence 30 secs
/wait 28
/p death sentence incoming <se.1> (or other sound)

I put /wait 28 command because i need 2 secs to prepare to use "stoneskin" over me.
Sometimes could occur, than twintania use "plummet" before death sentence and can interrupt your stoneskin cast, but you recast again.

Second: Manage your cd correctly. Death sentence is each 30 secs, but the dangerous DS are after phase 2(heal debuff)

Once the neurolink is dropped and the macro is active, use rampart (90 secs cd) and cast stoneskin. When you see the cast bar on twintania, click the macro.

The next DS, use bulwark ( 3 mins cd) and cast stoneskin. The next one, same operation changing bulwark by sentinel.

Now, Rampart will be active to mitigate next DS.

At this moment, 2nd neurolink must be dropped or nearly. If twintania cast other DS, foresight + convalescence + stoneskin + adloquium + lustrate will be a success.

On final phase, use the same secuence of coldowns and you can avoid a lot of damage.

Don't be afraid if you are off cd's and let your OT take twintania.

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Originally Posted by SpookyGhost

Ah, alright. Yeah, that's basically the single tank method and MRD deeps are pretty decent (not great, but decent). Just hadn't heard of someone going MRD for T5 before so I was super confused. :P

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Yeah and the crap thing about a marauder is that they do not have provoke, less hp, less defense as well Id bet, and of course less stats. More dps than a WAR, but at that point you may as well just bring another dps. I dont recommend it lol. But as I said, our WAR doesnt have an alt so yea, thats how we are doing it atm :)