Medica II, Regen, etc, before a pull

I'm new to being a healer. I've tried checking the threads by title and a couple of them by posts on the matter, but without spending a ton of time looking all the same, I haven't found the answer to my question and possible theory backed up by other healers.

On any mob pulls in dungeons, it is of course bad practice to have regen ticking or Medica II on you when pulling as a tank (tank being my main). I always click it off if it is still there before a pull.

But as the WHM, which I have been working on my skills, I started experimenting and found that if regen or Medica II is ticking away, and I stay out of range of the pull, I never get the aggro on me.

I did it with Titan HM the other day right after the SCH did her buff. But instead of moving into place, I held back for a few seconds until after shield lob hit, and then joined the crowd. titan didn't notice me.

On mob pulls in dungeons, I stay out of range until I see the change in color of the mob name from light red-ish to red, flash or some AoE emnity having been let loose, and walk into range and again, no mobs come after me.

While it is not suggested in dungeons (especially since there may be a mob out of view I didn't see), and potentially Ultima (since he is so close anyway when you start, though I haven't braved that one yet as a healer), has anyone experimented with this as well, successfully? I know having it on titan HM at the start isn't much help really, but it helps for a getting-more-experience-with-Titan-WHM like myself a second to get into the groove of my new DF group.

Feedback appreciated. :)

Don't really see how it would help, though. I'd imagine that if you are out of range of the mob, you are also out of range of the tank, and thus you are unable to heal them. If that's not a problem, the pull isn't difficult enough to need the pre-regen/medica 2. If it IS a problem, well, your tank is now in danger and you are unable to assist.

I'm not saying this to discourage you - stuff like this is often what we springboard off of to find neat strategies and tricks we can do - but I don't see the use of it AS IS.

Some content if you try to stay out of range while the tank gets attacked, he will begin to take too much damage (like in turn 1, the boss can put out some nasty double hits as soon as he's grabbed).

I'd just be careful with what you do. Some tanks are awful at getting hate, others are great. With trial and error, you'll get see what you can and can't do and what your limits are.

Medica 2 on the other hand, there's no point to even using it before a pull. You'll pull hate so fast if everyone that has the medica 2 regen starts attacking the boss/mob.

This is the order of operations leading to "Regen agro":

-Regen is on tank
-Tank pulls a pack of 3 with Shield Lob (or just runs into them for initial aggro)
--The tank is now on the hate list of all 3 mobs at (say) 0 enmity, plus whatever was done to the one Lob'd target
--Your Regen ticks; the 2 remaining mobs (or all 3) now have highest enmity built on you

This is unaffected by range. I've gotten Regen aggro (and DoT aggro even) from entirely different floors of a dungeon.

There are next to no situations where pre-Regen/Medi2 is a valid tactic. In some exceptional cases SCHs can have Eos act as off-tank this way but that's about the most outlandish way you can get any benefit from this.

The reason why you don't immediately pull aggro in titan HM with regen on tank is because his shield lob starts the fight. Try your theory in any multiple pull dungeon and you will have all the mobs swarming you. It doesn't matter if you go out of range or not, mob will still come to you.

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Originally Posted by Menae

Don't really see how it would help, though. I'd imagine that if you are out of range of the mob, you are also out of range of the tank, and thus you are unable to heal them. If that's not a problem, the pull isn't difficult enough to need the pre-regen/medica 2. If it IS a problem, well, your tank is now in danger and you are unable to assist.

I'm not saying this to discourage you - stuff like this is often what we springboard off of to find neat strategies and tricks we can do - but I don't see the use of it AS IS.

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Thanks. Good points well taken. Back to the drawing boards then....

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Originally Posted by DeadRiser

Some content if you try to stay out of range while the tank gets attacked, he will begin to take too much damage (like in turn 1, the boss can put out some nasty double hits as soon as he's grabbed).

I'd just be careful with what you do. Some tanks are awful at getting hate, others are great. With trial and error, you'll get see what you can and can't do and what your limits are.

Medica 2 on the other hand, there's no point to even using it before a pull. You'll pull hate so fast if everyone that has the medica 2 regen starts attacking the boss/mob.

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Also good specifics.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

This is the order of operations leading to "Regen agro":

-Regen is on tank
-Tank pulls a pack of 3 with Shield Lob (or just runs into them for initial aggro)
--The tank is now on the hate list of all 3 mobs at (say) 0 enmity, plus whatever was done to the one Lob'd target
--Your Regen ticks; the 2 remaining mobs (or all 3) now have highest enmity built on you

This is unaffected by range. I've gotten Regen aggro (and DoT aggro even) from entirely different floors of a dungeon.

There are next to no situations where pre-Regen/Medi2 is a valid tactic. In some exceptional cases SCHs can have Eos act as off-tank this way but that's about the most outlandish way you can get any benefit from this.

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I have definitely had the above happen to me more often than not while running tank in WP and before not knowing that it was regen at fault, couldn't understand why the mobs jumped to the healer before I could even flash. And interesting point about hate from a second floor. Haven't had that happen to me yet, but don't plan on seeing if I can get lucky on it either.

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So without getting a party wiped, looks like for the most part I just got lucky. So, unless the party knows I'm experimenting, I won't push that luck.

No reason to keep the thread up for much longer....so I'll delete it in the next day or so. :)

This may be working for you but it is really a bad habit to get into. With Stoneskin on the Tank he will not even be taking damage for a few seconds anyway while the tank is generating enmity and then you can do whatever you normally do. Depending on the mob I tend to start with Regen and the Cure and other stuff as needed...I love healing and it is pretty easy once you get the nuances down.

The only time I pre medica to pull mobs is in T4 when the first dreadnaught drops w/ the bugs so to make feeding easier, other than that (possibly T5 snakes?) I think its best if tanks pull themselves

Like Mikedizzy said...Stoneskin should buy you any buffer you need for the tank to get hate. Once that drops, you should be able to apply regen on him.

I think the only time I intentionally put it on in advance was the Demon Wall that ignores hate and does damage to all.

There's only one fight so far I'll use Regen ASAP is Titan EX; tank (esp WAR, with Unchained+Berserk up) has enough aggro from the thrown pull to hold Titan with an immediate Regen, and I can sit around until after the first Landslide and see if there's any serious lag going on.

Everything else? No. After the tank has aggro, sure I'll use Regen. But especially on multi-pulls...its just a bad idea.

Hi everyone.

Thanks for the feedback. Again, to clarify, it was mostly experimentation. From the tank perspective, I'm definitely quite familiar with having regen or whatnot ticking and losing mobs to the healers.

I honestly was putting this thread up to get general feedback (which I got and was appreciated) and planned on deleting the thread.....only to find out that I can't delete it. First forum I've joined where I can't delete my own thread. :(

Anyway, no worries - no regen ticks or Medica II before pulls. Otherwise equals very bad and could go very wrong. :)