Premade 4s Queue Obsolete

Premade 4v4 should be the pinnacle of PvP. There is no random factor, and the matches are generally much longer than the pug brackets because groups are more coordinated. It is effectively the main end game for PvP.

Like many others, I was hoping this 2.15 patch would reinvigorate the 4v4 bracket so that those of us who want serious competition could actually find it somewhere. Having just completed a match, against the only other team queuing, who consequently is not queuing anymore... we got 81 marks (+5% for FC buff).

This is 20% less than you get for a solo queue victory in the pug bracket. Part of the change to solo queuing was so that grouping up as 3 and stomping uncoordinated misfits wouldn't be as appealing as getting 1 more person and queuing for 4s. It was a good idea, but obviously has failed given the ridiculous +100% (Compared to 2s,3s, or 4s) boost of solo queue.

In order to be relevant, 4s also needs to appeal to those grinding towards rank 30. Losing a 4s match should give as much or a little more as winning 3s, since losing solo is barely below it. Winning a 4s match should give something like +200%, because it takes effort to get a group of 4 together and the reward should be above and beyond.

But for now, I'm bummed.

Agreed.

10char

4s should certainly have more incentive. I agree.

100% agreed.

I strongly agree with this.

Well it is unfair to go up against a team of 4 premades as a solo que. It's very unfair that premades who already have their crap together can out farm us solo quers who cant find friends.











Said the whatever. Ofc I agree with the OP.

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Originally Posted by Cleftobismal

Well it is unfair to go up against a team of 4 premades as a solo que. It's very unfair that premades who already have their crap together can out farm us solo quers who cant find friends.

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Yeah, that's true, but most people don't really care about fair and unfair. I would love to mix in solo queues but I do it for a few games before I start running into a bunch of premades, and so, I will premade myself against that. I really wish they would actually make 4v4 attractive. The best way would be a Ladder system, but I doubt that would come for a long time. So the best way to fix that, imo, would be to increase the rewards. Solo queue should not give more than coordinated 4v4. That's just depressing.

Right now, solo queue is actually the best way to gain rewards. There's a definite flaw in that system.

won a 4 man 50's game vs dusty slippers and co- last night and then we didn't get another 50's pop the rest of the night :(

You won't see anyone queueing 4v4 until there is a ladder system implemented with rewards for attaining a certain 4v4 rating.

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This is 20% less than you get for a solo queue victory in the pug bracket. Part of the change to solo queuing was so that grouping up as 3 and stomping uncoordinated misfits wouldn't be as appealing as getting 1 more person and queuing for 4s. It was a good idea, but obviously has failed given the ridiculous +100% (Compared to 2s,3s, or 4s) boost of solo queue.

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This is not accurate.

First, # of marks and exp varies depending on the overall rank of the enemy team compared to yours. beating a team of players with higher ranks than yours yields more XP/marks, beating a team of lower rank players yields less. I got 92 marks for a solo queue win, so its not a 20% difference. Then later in the same paragraph you say its suddenly 100% more instead of 20% more? I don't understand.

Now, I agree that 4s premade should give the most reward. I'm just saying your statements aren't completely accurate.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

This is not accurate.

First, # of marks and exp varies depending on the overall rank of the enemy team compared to yours. beating a team of players with higher ranks than yours yields more XP/marks, beating a team of lower rank players yields less. I got 92 marks for a solo queue win, so its not a 20% difference. Then later in the same paragraph you say its suddenly 100% more instead of 20% more? I don't understand.

Now, I agree that 4s premade should give the most reward. I'm just saying your statements aren't completely accurate.

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try re-reading that last line again, i think you misunderstood

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

This is not accurate.

First, # of marks and exp varies depending on the overall rank of the enemy team compared to yours. beating a team of players with higher ranks than yours yields more XP/marks, beating a team of lower rank players yields less. I got 92 marks for a solo queue win, so its not a 20% difference. Then later in the same paragraph you say its suddenly 100% more instead of 20% more? I don't understand.

Now, I agree that 4s premade should give the most reward. I'm just saying your statements aren't completely accurate.

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Baseline xp/marks is the 2.1 value or the 2.15 3s value. Currently solo queue gives +100% of base value. Duo queue gives +5% base value. 3s gives base value. 4s was always a little higher, but is still 20% less than what solo queue gives now. EX: Solo gives on average 95~110 marks (up to 140, but that is not normal) ... which if you cut by 20%, is what players who do 4s receive (roughly 80~ marks). Make more sense now?

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Originally Posted by Lodiodrive

You won't see anyone queueing 4v4 until there is a ladder system implemented with rewards for attaining a certain 4v4 rating.

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This. A currency that can *only* be attained from 4's. And gear that can only be attained with that currency as well as a certain ladder rank. Possibly exclusive to rank 30 players to attain the currency and ladder positions. This will make it exclusive at first, but in the long run, it could be considered end game PvP.

4v4 should have a ladder system, where teams fight for the 1st place. right now PvP is a minigame. like treasure maps or chocobo leveling.

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Originally Posted by Hulk_Smash

This. A currency that can *only* be attained from 4's. And gear that can only be attained with that currency as well as a certain ladder rank. Possibly exclusive to rank 30 players to attain the currency and ladder positions. This will make it exclusive at first, but in the long run, it could be considered end game PvP.

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Making the barrier to entry (well, to being more than a 1 GCD distraction) even bigger through 4-man exclusive gear won't end well. No newcomers would stick around (which already happens, but it'd get even worse). :l

Vanity slots might work, but it has to be actual good vanity stuff, not just recolored PvE pieces, and even then, who knows. Vanity isn't an incentive for a lot of people, they want better gear so they can be more "skilled" than other people with it.

Easy fix:

Make Direwolf gear require direwolf marks.
Direwolf marks can only be gotten from 4v4 pvp.


Now people farm the solo, duo, tripple queue for warwolf level 70 gear.
But if they want to get direwolf level 90 gear they are forced to 4v4.