Titan Extreme : It's Titan Hard all over again.

Feelin' a bit frustrated tonight, so I think I'll vent a little about Titan Extreme.

People have solid strategies for this fight so far. And so far, a lot of people seem to be able to survive. The fight's been a ton of fun to learn, but it's also been one of the most horrifically painful events to constantly re-run over and over ad nauseum.

I'm not the most impatient of people. But I'm getting tired of trying night after night and getting the same result. Parties that come up -just short- of Mega-Bombs*, usualyl dying to line bombs, and then fingers start getting pointed. 'Someone didn't bait line bombs!'... Yet half the party survives, which means it's still easily dodgable if you're just aware of the AoE's.

It feels like Titan Hard Mode all over again. Hard Mode was an initial road block for a lot of people, particularly a connection check. While Extreme Mode isn't required for content (and could be argued to be just a 'bonus' fight), I have found so far that it's extremely frustrating as a skilled DPS/Healer to constantly whipe on this with almost no hope for a turnaround on my own.

I almost wish you could do a lot of the DPS checks solo, instead of in a party. I'm growing so tired of constantly succeeding on my end, yet watching as HP bar after HP bar hit 0. It's depressing to see these skilled players slowly seeming to break down and give up.

Forgive my rant. No real constructive stuff to offer up. I'm frustrated, and I wish there was more I could do. But I only have one lance / scholar book / white mage staff. There's only so much one human can do. =/ It's not possible 'carry' in this game on most fights (Though I've heard of carries on Extreme titan, I've never seen 'em.)

Edit 1: added the rest of the text (Seriously SE? couldn't spring for better forums?)
Edit 2: Typed 'Mega Bomb' instead of 'Line Bombs'

just because people are in the extreme fight dont mean they knew the other fights, they could of been dead the whole time on the previous fights. so when they get there they of course fail hard.

Use party finder require Ifrit check or show primal weapon, this will cut down the amount of wipes greatly. The fight is a joke with people who know how to dodge his mechanics. I have 1 shot it a lot of times with groups that require Ifrit checks.

I am hearing this alot and I am not looking forward to doing this fight now. We had one of our FC members basically quit the game because of this fight along with the BS in Coil. I hope I have a different experience and I hope yours gets better for you.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Use party finder require Ifrit check or show primal weapon, this will cut down the amount of wipes greatly. The fight is a joke with people who know how to dodge his mechanics. I have 1 shot it a lot of times with groups that require Ifrit checks.

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And for people who can dodge everything but haven't managed to beat it once yet because of other people? I have way too much lag during primetime to even attempt this fight, and in off-hours all I can get is learning groups (I already know the fight and would prefer not to wipe 57 times with people who don't, only to have the group disband when we're getting close, which is how I got to where I am now) or the ever-popular "will queue Ifrit" groups who won't even let me join.

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Originally Posted by Mikedizzy

I am hearing this alot and I am not looking forward to doing this fight now. We had one of our FC members basically quit the game because of this fight along with the BS in Coil. I hope I have a different experience and I hope yours gets better for you.

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i generally dedicate one day just for pf'ing titan em. lol. its not pleasant to say the least. u need everyone to be able to dodge everything, kill everything, and have perfect connection throughout the fight to clear it. but u get lucky eventually and get thrown in a pf with just that.

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Originally Posted by Calyanare

And for people who can dodge everything but haven't managed to beat it once yet because of other people? I have way too much lag during primetime to even attempt this fight, and in off-hours all I can get is learning groups (I already know the fight and would prefer not to wipe 57 times with people who don't, only to have the group disband when we're getting close, which is how I got to where I am now) or the ever-popular "will queue Ifrit" groups who won't even let me join.

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Was making a ifrit check group, I took a sch once that had not cleared it. He told me he knew the fight and I could kick him if he made any mistake and died, I didn't want to wait longer for a healer so gave him a chance. Ending up winning too. If you send the person making a group a tell they might be willing to make an exception so I would try that. Most people are willing to give you a chance if you tell them you will own up to any mistakes and leave if you cause a wipe.

Sad thing is, Ifrit EX is so much easier then Titan EX it's a joke that it's the 3rd primal to fight.

End game is more frustrating than fun. I guess if you have a static or meet the crazy high requirements for pf, then it can be semi fun.

As a healer I feel really stupid doing these fights, because most deaths arent the healer's fault, and there's nothing really a healer can do about it except watch people die. Also with any caster healer or damage dealer, movement fights are just a pain to do when you have to cast. Finding that small window to get your cast off without eating a plume or a bomb just isnt fun at all. Then when people do take damage and you actually have to heal them, you either expose yourself to eat an aoe or let that person die because you have to dodge and cant heal them due to not being able to cast on the move. I really wish Square would give healers more tools to heal on the move or have the mechanics not one shot people if they fail to dodge. Raising dead people during a fight wouldnt be so bad if they didnt have the lame weakness debuff, I dont ever remember playing any FF game where raising someone gave them a debuff, they came back with low HP sure... but never a debuff.

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Originally Posted by CassTristesse

As a healer I feel really stupid doing these fights, because most deaths arent the healer's fault, and there's nothing really a healer can do about it except watch people die.

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This isn't exclusive just to healers. I played tank at first and watch players die over and over again. I thought I could effect fights more being a healer but it ends up being the same.

aw come on just run it with ur coil static and make some "fun" rules like mine does :
1.1st one dies pay 10k
2. die to landslide and fall off pay 25k
3. etc
4. last man standing gets 50k, 100k if not tank

Titan X is extremely frustrating. MY BcoB group does not have time to do it as a a group. So most of us DF or PT.

That darn Titan X has caused us tons of issues. Got a member that is near always emo now because he cannot pass it. Got a member that was the first that passed it and was boasting about it till it cause him to skip loot order in his "mood", cause a hugh group arguement explosion. Now he is like a ghost... Just going through the motions and then leave.

There is me, that will not do EX thank to Titan. Also playing FF14 less, because game is pissing me off (thanks Titan).

Most of the group now, do not want to do things together, as most seem to be focused on EX and Titan. Just clearing that one fight takes most of their time.

Half the group cannot clear Titan or are doing it much less or not at all. The other half spend forever on him. The group is splitting up...

Etc, etc, etc.

All I know is Titan is troll and is having a big impact on the FF14 community. A big bad impact.

Regards.

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Originally Posted by gadenp

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Ya the one issue about Titan fight is that this isn't a fight about skill but a fight about perfection.

you need..

-Perfect memory for Titan attack order
-Perfect Internet Connection to prevent a single speck of lag since a small pit can be fatal
-Perfect unity with Party members so they can dodge things perfectly like they are only a single person
-Perfect reaction time so you can react to all attacks.
-"perfect" computer to handle the game

It just runs down to a fight about perfection since even with the best skills if your connect to the server is bad in either your end or SE end you basically don't have a chance in the fight.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

Ya the one issue about Titan fight is that this isn't a fight about skill but a fight about perfection.

you need..

-Perfect memory for Titan attack order

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Not true. I don't know the rotation of both Titan HM and EX fights but I have no issues dodging his abilities. Dodging isn't rocket science (unless you have poor connection). Just pay attention.

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Originally Posted by CassTristesse

I really wish Square would give healers more tools to heal on the move or have the mechanics not one shot people if they fail to dodge.

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Roll scholar! Lustrate is the best move in the game. (I say this as a WHM main in coil.)

To those of you still bashing your head against Titan Extreme, good luck! If you're having trouble, do the same strategy as with Titan Hard: create a new linkshell for people who you KNOW can dodge and put out the damage. Slowly fill it with competent people, then win. Might take a few days but if you're not starting from scratch every day with party finder, it's a big help.

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Originally Posted by CassTristesse

As a healer

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Healers can carry the fight to some extent so a good healer is very important. DPS just have to learn to stay alive and not get hit by the big things and it should be all good. Tanks are tank swap corrected and in titan ex case, dont die to LS and you'll be fine. Overall, healers is the main guy which determines HOW MUCH room there is for error. Generally as long as it's not a one hit ko, they have the potential to recover the fight.

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Originally Posted by EdwinLi

-Perfect memory for Titan attack order
-Perfect Internet Connection to prevent a single speck of lag since a small pit can be fatal
-Perfect unity with Party members so they can dodge things perfectly like they are only a single person
-Perfect reaction time so you can react to all attacks.
-"perfect" computer to handle the game

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- Nope, you don't need a perfect memory for titan attack order, you need to have a common sense on how or where you will position yourself in each attack.
- This is the only thing that should be good, if not at your finest ping condition.
- Nope. As long as the members got brain to not mess up the position of others, you'll be fine.
- Nope. "Perfect" is too overreacting.
- Seriously? I'm running Titan EX with 30-40 FPS, is that perfect? Hell no.

@OP: Carrying in Titan EX is easier than carrying in Ifrit EX.

Titan EX is hard because there's a lot of one hit kill mechanics rather than in the other two. I just finished streaming titan EM, managed to get a win for the weekly at least. Now I'm on to ifrit EM to finish :)

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Use party finder require Ifrit check or show primal weapon, this will cut down the amount of wipes greatly. The fight is a joke with people who know how to dodge his mechanics. I have 1 shot it a lot of times with groups that require Ifrit checks.

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Dunno from personal experience ifrit check groups just fail as much as "can't dodge = kick" groups. At least I didn't find one yet that actually 1shotted that fight.

We were once in a place where it took all week to deal with the Ex primals, but in the past few weeks everyone has got their shit together and we managed to clear coil and primals in about 3 hours this week, leaving the rest of the week to sitting around town.... But the real thing that changed was everyone started to use WTFast to improve connection pings to the server. Personally I have not gotten hit by a single plume since I started using WTFast. If your group is still getting clipped by any of these moves I really recommend giving it a try, its free for the first month.

make wol 'hit area' smaller and add crack like visuals effects(or whatever) to make it look same size as before. (like ifrit eruption, edges of aoe attack doesn't hit you).

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Originally Posted by Empressia

aw come on just run it with ur coil static and make some "fun" rules like mine does :
1.1st one dies pay 10k
2. die to landslide and fall off pay 25k
3. etc
4. last man standing gets 50k, 100k if not tank

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Can I join your FC? With manawall/manaward, and titans predictable pattern, I think I could get rich.

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Originally Posted by hua

Not true. I don't know the rotation of both Titan HM and EX fights but I have no issues dodging his abilities. Dodging isn't rocket science (unless you have poor connection). Just pay attention.

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Well i think you should try the fight as a caster if you haven't already. I tried Titan HM for my relic, with 4 groups actually and we wiped every time. When i did die it was to me not remembering his pattern, which i'm new to the fight so it's difficult to do when chaos is going on. But i'd always get killed while casting. I would start casting then see a plume pop under me, so i'd interrupt the cast and run to the side but since i was casting while in the plume, apparently the server still registered me there and i'd die. I really hate how this game saves our position, and it's because of this server flaw why you need to memorize this fight and not just wing it as a casting class.

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Originally Posted by DeceptionsWrath

Well i think you should try the fight as a caster if you haven't already. I tried Titan HM for my relic, with 4 groups actually and we wiped every time. When i did die it was to me not remembering his pattern, which i'm new to the fight so it's difficult to do when chaos is going on. But i'd always get killed while casting. I would start casting then see a plume pop under me, so i'd interrupt the cast and run to the side but since i was casting while in the plume, apparently the server still registered me there and i'd die. I really hate how this game saves our position, and it's because of this server flaw why you need to memorize this fight and not just wing it as a casting class.

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I used to feel this way. My main is BLM. But now I own titan ex, and my last two clears I finished on the top of the dps parse. We do have a steeper learning curve than most, and our personal strategy to maximize damage is slightly different than the normal "stack on titans butt at all times" strat. But if you know when plumes are coming, as well as all of his other moves, you won't get hit. Because you won't be attempting to get a long cast in when you know plumes are coming next.

Also, you are right about the server registering you someplace when it seems like you are some place else. But part of the problem is people do not realize that the damage will hit you if you are not out of the plume when the warning animation finishes. Not when the plume explosion animation hits. Its the same with landslide (and any AoE in the game frankly). The damage is registered when the warning animation stops, not when the move animation hits. This is why you can see people running through landslide animations. Because they weren't in the landslide warning hitbox.

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Originally Posted by Nosiahk

@OP: Carrying in Titan EX is easier than carrying in Ifrit EX.

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This.
I'd really like to see a double healer carry on Ifrit EX.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

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I've joined more than one full clear party that still got some crazy deaths going on. In fact, best I've done it that way was a 3 shot. And it's not even "Oh, these guys must have bought their runs", I've pugged with people I deeply trust and know they have succesfully beaten the fight several times. Titan EX is just that annoying, sometimes. It's the only fight I never expect to PUG win in less than one hour, no matter how experienced the group.

Heck, these days my group wiped because the healers were DPSing so hard Titan was jumping right after double gaols, or using Earthen Fury before the first bomb even exploded. Then we stopped DPSing and won, lol.

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Originally Posted by Sedant

We were once in a place where it took all week to deal with the Ex primals, but in the past few weeks everyone has got their shit together and we managed to clear coil and primals in about 3 hours this week, leaving the rest of the week to sitting around town.... But the real thing that changed was everyone started to use WTFast to improve connection pings to the server. Personally I have not gotten hit by a single plume since I started using WTFast. If your group is still getting clipped by any of these moves I really recommend giving it a try, its free for the first month.

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God, you sound like one of those cheesy, tacky, advertisements.

I actually really like Titan EX, it's a very fun fight for melee dps. :)

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Originally Posted by Thorauku

- Nope, you don't need a perfect memory for titan attack order, you need to have a common sense on how or where you will position yourself in each attack.
- This is the only thing that should be good, if not at your finest ping condition.
- Nope. As long as the members got brain to not mess up the position of others, you'll be fine.
- Nope. "Perfect" is too overreacting.
- Seriously? I'm running Titan EX with 30-40 FPS, is that perfect? Hell no.

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Well these are just tacky requirements ideal for Titan EX. 90% of the fight requires people do be able to dodge while playing without a single spike of lag due to majority of Titan Skill being instant kill or fatal to the entire group if 1 member of the team miss up even once.

Also, I've been seeing these requirements pop up once in a while for Titan EX group in Balmung lately but their don't pop up often.

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Originally Posted by avecha

God, you sound like one of those cheesy, tacky, advertisements.

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MMO companies hate him. Find out his one simple trick!

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Originally Posted by Doo

End game is more frustrating than fun. I guess if you have a static or meet the crazy high requirements for pf, then it can be semi fun.

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The end game is a pain in the ass sometimes. I had a lot of fun progressing through the HM primals
and coils 1-4 but coils 5 and EX primals are very annoying. Even Party finder groups are a pain in the
ass because a lot of them (in my experience) will kick you if you mess up or trip up once.

I think its great to have difficult fights like this.. not sure I'll ever do it again though . First first experience was not pleasant. Once there is more end game content to choose from wont be as much of an issue. If this fight was required to advance though I would probably quit too. Hard to say.. maybe I would breakdown and memorize everything needed. Its all a pattern after all. Although I do understand the latency gripes.

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Originally Posted by Gooner_iBluAirJGR

The end game is a pain in the ass sometimes. I had a lot of fun progressing through the HM primals
and coils 1-4 but coils 5 and EX primals are very annoying. Even Party finder groups are a pain in the
ass because a lot of them (in my experience) will kick you if you mess up or trip up once.

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Progressing through content wasn't fun for me since most of the time I felt like I was just watching other party members die to easy to avoid mechanics. The unforgiving mechanics, needing 7 other players to play perfect, and the rotation/phase style combat really makes for a frustrating end game experience. DF groups usually disbands in 1-3 tries regardless if the group did well or not and PF groups set up super high standards to try to make runs as fail safe as possible. Seems like the only way to get anything done is to have 8 players you know on and wanting to run it which isn't an option for many players.

It's just like HM all over again: finding 7 other people capable of dodging crap and knowing the mechanics.