Presenation on Cyber Bullying

So yeah as the topic says my friend is doing a presentation on cyber bullying specifically in gaming, problem is he's not a gamer he's currently trying to think of scenarios where bullying has occurred in gaming. So I'm just posting to ask for all your advice or any experiences with bullying you guys might have come across that might help him out :D

Thanks for your help guys!

The story of the Outcast Warrior: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7864486403

I have one that happened this morning. Went to CT and this one guy became very insulting because one member of my party was new to the raid and didn't know we had to have 4 people standing on the pad for Atamos. He became so vicious and ugly that his party kicked him.

He also decided he was the alliance captain and demanded we all obey his commands...

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Originally Posted by Lurkios

The story of the Outcast Warrior: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7864486403

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I wouldn't use that story. More and more people are saying that story was made up, and you shouldn't risk using a fake story for your school work.

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

I wouldn't use that story. More and more people are saying that story was made up, and you shouldn't risk using a fake story for your school work.

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Check the Korean boards - it's true those two users could have made up the story and posted it there first, but that goes for just about anything you'll find in a games forums.

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Originally Posted by Lurkios

The story of the Outcast Warrior: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7864486403

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When I look at the stories of people dealing with jerks, or the entries in the party finder.... I always remember this post.

Cyber bullying is more effective in more personal areas like Facebook. How can someone cyber bully an avatar in a game? Some one being extremely rude or insulting shouldn't be considered cyber bullying. A bully IRL can find ways to get at you. In game you just /ignore and grow up.

Rule 1: try not to be a dick to people.
Rule 2: if you have been a dick to someone, apologize and don't do it again.
Rule 3: if someone was a dick to you, don't dwell on it. Accept an apology if it's given, but don't let a little text on a screen from someone you don't even know pull you down. Especially when there's a million worse things that could happen.

Worked alight for me so far.

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Originally Posted by statikcat

Cyber bullying is more effective in more personal areas like Facebook. How can someone cyber bully an avatar in a game? Some one being extremely rude or insulting shouldn't be considered cyber bullying. A bully IRL can find ways to get at you. In game you just /ignore and grow up.

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You'd be surprised how you can be bullied in game. In ff11 a friend and I had a falling out and she bullied me unmercifully. All over a guy I wasn't even interested in. I was kicked from my Linkshell, she shouted I bought gil, and constantly harassed me about the guy in question.

She wouldn't stop no matter how many times I told her that the guy and I were only friends. We were more like brother and sister than anything else. The guy and I both ended up quitting the game though he did return for a bit and ended up changing servers and names to escape her and the damage she did to his reputation.

I'm not sure if it counts as bullying per say, but I remember seeing a thing in WoW at one point where a member of a guild had died, and they were hosting an in game funeral service type thing for the member.. and people came and ruined it (killed the people attending and all).

Also WoW related, I've heard of people getting harassed to a pretty extreme extent. Like blocking a person only to have the person make a new character and continue sending rude/nasty messages. Or people who used Real ID back when it was real name only for display, and then found people that harassed them based on Google search results (Twitter/Facebook). Not saying the people were smart that put their real name out there to people they didn't trust, but that doesn't negate the actions of those that abused it. I've also heard of (in PvP areas) one player following another around constantly and killing them until the player just gives up playing at that point in time.

I've personally experienced players telling me I didn't earn gear I wore (in WoW), and that I was obviously carried through raids since I was female, regardless of what any meters said, or how I performed in a group. I generally shrugged it off and such as it wasn't my guild mates that said the things, and the players that did were few and far between. Back in my Shadowbane/Halo 2 time I'd often have people say really inappropriate things to me when they found out I was a girl, including some of my guild mates. Not sure if it counts as bullying, but it certainly didn't help to make me feel welcome or anything, and did eventually result in me abandoning my headset for consoles altogether. Behavior such as that has gotten a lot better over the years though, it's not gone entirely (there will always be some creepy guy), but I run into more nice people than I do people interested in my gender now.

My first time running AK as a WAR. I read guides and understood the fights. I was a fresh 50 in full AF and had on ilvl 40-55 jewelry on. The three others I got put with via DF joined together as a group (so it was three of them and me). I leveled to 50 doing dungeons and quests, and never had problems with aggro up until this run. Instead of taking it a little slower and following the target marks, the dps were aoeing and the healer started to just let me die. Then the harsh remarks start:

"You're incompetent"
"Kill Yourself"
"Uninstall the game dumb***"

Usually I'm the type that presses caps lock and fights back, but instead I took a deep breath and asked what I'm doing wrong. I was told to leave the dungeon so they could get a more "competent" tank.

Personally, I'd like to get the best gear, and be the best player I can, but I want to get there with the best reputation.

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Originally Posted by statikcat

Cyber bullying is more effective in more personal areas like Facebook. How can someone cyber bully an avatar in a game? Some one being extremely rude or insulting shouldn't be considered cyber bullying. A bully IRL can find ways to get at you. In game you just /ignore and grow up.

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This is somewhat true. If the harassment is repeated and is something along the lines of spreading gossip about the person's irl, then it could be considered cyber bullying.

With that said, I think OP your friend is going to find it rather hard to find real instances of cyber bullying in mmos vs. "some guy said something bad and it hurt my feelings!"

I help students with papers on the side, and I would suggest your friend pick a different topic. Don't unnecessarily pick such a hard topic to find info on. I don't know the specifics, but I would imagine he or she could find a lot of other cyberbulling-related topics that have a lot information (fb/myspace).

Stories like that "Outcast Warrior" one actually happen quite a bit more often than you would think. I myself actually almost wound up in a situation similar to that when I first started playing MMOs, if it wasn't for a few friends sitting down and helping me to properly understand some basic mechanics I could easily have been that guy. Yes I grew up playing video games, but single player game experience does not truly translate over to MMO experience.

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Originally Posted by statikcat

Cyber bullying is more effective in more personal areas like Facebook. How can someone cyber bully an avatar in a game? Some one being extremely rude or insulting shouldn't be considered cyber bullying. A bully IRL can find ways to get at you. In game you just /ignore and grow up.

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I agree for the most part also. Some girls at my school made a blog about my friend and were writing some really personal things on there. When it's personal and something about your actual day to day life, and can change how people you see face to face think about you that's some rough stuff to deal with. On the flip side, like you said you can /ignore whoever on an mmo, and most of the time it's harassment cause you didn't dodge an aoe (silly stuff really).

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Originally Posted by Linadae

You'd be surprised how you can be bullied in game. In ff11 a friend and I had a falling out and she bullied me unmercifully. All over a guy I wasn't even interested in. I was kicked from my Linkshell, she shouted I bought gil, and constantly harassed me about the guy in question.

She wouldn't stop no matter how many times I told her that the guy and I were only friends. We were more like brother and sister than anything else. The guy and I both ended up quitting the game though he did return for a bit and ended up changing servers and names to escape her and the damage she did to his reputation.

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That sounds more like spamming and drama. Can't you /ignore someone in these games (I have not had to so assuming)? If they are saying things not appropriate can't you contact game support and they can review the logs and suspend an account for harassment of some kind?

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

I wouldn't use that story. More and more people are saying that story was made up, and you shouldn't risk using a fake story for your school work.

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Fake or not, mentors became a reality on korean community, and playerbase understood they was just a bunch of douches. At least korean players changed into better as community.. :rolleyes:

OP , if you need a direct experience of cyber bulling, it's very easy: tell your friend to sit near you while you que on DF , E language. 1-3 runs should be enough to meet the douchebag of the day.
Take screenshots so your friend can write his report about the attitude and reason behind it.
The funny part of his report will be how senseless and non sane minded was the attitude reported lol :D

Then, more in-depth , after ff14 you can try to log on wow for a couple hours.
Both games are noawadays nearly on par about douchbaggery. :rolleyes:

Unfortunately, I've met my fair share of cyber bullying throughout my MMOs. A few communities have been notorious for bad behavior and that has put an early end to my playing of those games.

Saddest case of cyber bullying happened in WoW to one of my guildmates. She was a healer and pretty fragile mentally. Unfortunately, she was a pretty weak healer and when I partied with her, I inwardly cringed, knowing there were going to be plenty of wipes. She started going through a particularly rough time--problems in her marriage, general deterioration of her mental state. Then we had some nasty guild drama happen where some not so nice stuff was going on and things were getting downright mean. As she started doing more runs outside the guild groups where frankly we had carried her, people started getting increasingly mean to her. Some of the WoW PUGs seemed to attract the dregs of humanity. After a string of bad runs where players were actually encouraging her to kill herself, they finally got their wish. After a culmination of guild events, toxic community dealings and problems in real life, she had a nervous break down, suicide attempt, and ended up in a psych ward where fortunately she got help. She gave up MMOs---got a bit addicted to FB games from what I could see. I think that she got better but haven't been in contact with her for quite a few years. I hope that she has stayed away from MMOs since they seemed to be a dangerous place for her mentally. I could tell that after every bad run in a PUG, she was crushed. Absolutely crushed.

I've come across so many people like this actually. Some find MMOs to be a refuge from whatever is troubling them in their lives. I met terminally ill people, mentally unstable people, people going through significant life events. I know that a standard come back would be---"This is the internet, grow a thicker skin." On the other hand, you never know what someone may be going through and it is best to always be kind. Just my opinion. Frankly, if a player tells another player to kill themselves, threaten them, etc, I would love to see HARSH action taken. Ban the account or give them an extraordinarily long time out from the game. Some harassment is over the top and should be dealt with accordingly.

I do have to second what Allyra said above. Perhaps look at other cases of cyberbullying where you can collect more data. As a parent of a middle schooler, cyberbullying is foremost on my mind. Our last school had some horrendous problems with this where the school district had to get involved. With so many social media sites out there, it is always a challenge for a parent.

The cyberbullies and trolls I come across usually get insta-blacklisted if they're in my server. The ones I meet in DF don't bother me since I use my own specific LS chat tab panel and talk to LS friends instead.

Amazing how people feel "powerful" behind their TV/Computer monitors and keyboards. These types of people are typically anti-socials, have no friends, or nothing going for them IRL so they vent out their anger on others in the online world to make themselves feel relevant to society.

Such a sad life.

http://www.mmomeltingpot.com/2012/03...ger-reactions/

That would probably be the most well-publicized story of recent date. One of the players on the CCP panel made comments encouraging the players to harass another player into committing suicide.

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Originally Posted by Rhysati

http://www.mmomeltingpot.com/2012/03...ger-reactions/

That would probably be the most well-publicized story of recent date. One of the players on the CCP panel made comments encouraging the players to harass another player into committing suicide.

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Sad how widespread is this kind of junk human being huh? Funny thing is the abuser is the only one who deserve to die :rolleyes:
I wonder why that guy didn't got some years of jail for attempted homicide using a media.
Don't we have laws protecting us from this junk of our society? :rolleyes: (a hint for the report of OP's friend )

In 11 we had a girl (she said she was 25) go at it with another girl in our LS. Now mind you first girl was a drama filled little tramp, kept putting up selfies before that term existed on our forums, had 3 or 4 guys on a string all at once type of BS. This other girl called her out on it and then the shit hit the fan. Drama girl put up a new hate filled message into her little info/sell area for everyone to see and read every day, called her a hag, a old tramp, told her to loose some weight so guys would like her more. On and on this girl would go, she would shout in Jueno, send her nasty tells, follow her to parties and sit and harass her constantly. The other girl finally quit, she quit all MMO's because of this chick. The only ironically funny thing that came out of all of it was drama girl was actually 15 years old and her dad busted her for sending all these adult guys pictures, but before that she went after 2 more players, both girls and ended up making them quit to. Oh Lemica the Drama Queen of Titan, I dont miss you one bit.

I think you get just as much sexual harassment on this game as you do "cyber bullies" most of whom are probably unhappy kids who hide behind the anonymity of the interwebz.

[QUOTE=Allyra;1757870]
I would suggest your friend pick a different topic. QUOTE]

I completely agree with you it's what I said to my friend too but the problem is it's not for uni or anything the presentation is going to be used for educational purposes it's going to be presented to kids in primary schools to make them aware of the dangers of cyber bullying so unfortunately he has no control of the topic it's been assigned to him by his bosses. Which is why I'm posting on here really because as you say it's not an easy topic.

But thanks for all your replies so far guys! they have been lots of help and I'm sorry to hear about some of your bad experiences guys but thank you very much for sharing them :)

My favorite one from a tank to a dps that i heard was "On a scale of 1 to Good, you are a negative good". Titan EX brings out the worst in people. I especially love the people putting "3 deaths= kick and reported" in the party finder. I cant imagine the stupid reports that the GMs have to go through.

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Originally Posted by Yurikitty

I think you get just as much sexual harassment on this game as you do "cyber bullies" most of whom are probably unhappy kids who hide behind the anonymity of the interwebz.

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I've come across quite a bit of sexual shenanigans in these MMOs. EQ2 for some reason was a Peyton Place of online affairs, women and men scorned, etc. Hubby and I had to eventually transfer servers. We just couldn't find a guild that didn't have this sort of stuff going on. Some of the catfights that would start in guilds--two women fighting---were cringe worthy. I can certainly appreciate your story because it happens so frequently.

Unfortunately, I don't think that most of the culprits in these situations or the cyber bullies are necessarily kids. Some of the worst guild drama I've experienced occurred in a guild with 30 and 40 year old folks. Our main culprit was a 45 year old woman and 47 year old man. I think that adults can be so much more scathing and vicious than a 13 year old saying, "l2p noob."

Bullying in a video game like this (the MMO genre in general) needs to be looked at more of a supporting argument than a primary focus. The bullying done isn't really over-the-top, at least by comparison to the more popular sort of cyberbullying (social media outlets like Facebook and Twitter). In video games, they are often controlled and rarely recorded for the purpose of picking on someone. At the very least, the bullied are almost always masked behind the veil of anonymity, the same as the bully.

To be honest, bullying in a video game is usually a matter of perspective. Harassment can get out of hand, but it usually falls upon one rather satisfying fact on the matter. This person (the bully) is spending that much of their time and stress trolling/raging at someone on a video game. As long as you don't stoop to their level, you come out as the bigger person. You know it, and they (hopefully) know it too. If they don't, well let's just say that stooping to their level would be like picking on a handicapped child. I'd probably get banned if I went further into detail on that one lol.

These days, people are a lot more sensitive to their feelings on matters. The bullies develop a much grander delusion of the "invincibility complex". While that is not exclusive to the bully, they exhibit it in a much more noticeable form. Anonymity does that I guess. Most kids/people these days need a good punch/kick to the face. Not just any random time, but when they actually do something stupid. People need to have a level of fear and/or humility put in them, which is unfortunately something that a lot of parents can't do these days (i.e. instill a minimal level of real respect for their peers). They either neglect to do so or are incapable of it because of the power of anonymity from the internet that their kids feel they have. To impressionable minds, a massive level of power (such as anonymity) is extremely dangerous in the development of a "good" person.

In an ideal world, these people will outgrow it, just as the folks before the internet ideally did (though many haven't). Unfortunately, with the greater ratio of the "bad apples", we're inevitably going to have a higher rate of stupidity going on. Stupidity that often shapes these people (or their targets) into people that hurt others (physically or otherwise). Remember the Asiana pilot names fiasco? An intern is responsible for that... an ADULT is responsible for confirming those names. Someone who actually reached a level of security necessary to be in that position, actually thought it was a good idea to do that. Nevermind the general public being capable of it, nevermind the report that an ex-pilot supplied those names as a joke, but do mind the fact that the intern is someone who was looking to land a job in a level of security and responsibility. Imagine how many more of them are actually leading us towards the "future". Scary. They can't tell when to bring out their sense of humor and when not to. Which actually brings up another scary reality. There are people out there that want nothing more than their 15 seconds of fame, and will do whatever it takes to get it.

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Originally Posted by Linadae

You'd be surprised how you can be bullied in game. In ff11 a friend and I had a falling out and she bullied me unmercifully. All over a guy I wasn't even interested in. I was kicked from my Linkshell, she shouted I bought gil, and constantly harassed me about the guy in question.

She wouldn't stop no matter how many times I told her that the guy and I were only friends. We were more like brother and sister than anything else. The guy and I both ended up quitting the game though he did return for a bit and ended up changing servers and names to escape her and the damage she did to his reputation.

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Excuse me for dwindling in your FFXI life, but was that in the world Cerberus? I remember something similar happening with 3 members from the ls I was in, and that wasn't funny to watch <.<;

Please do not use the term "cyber bully" in a video game. The point of games is that they are competitive. If you can't handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen. Real victims of cyber bullying face real world consequences, such as inability to go to school and confront bullies on a daily basis, depression, and suicidal ideation. Ingame you can simply ignore a problematic player. Nothing they do to you will have any consequence on you, because its not like they can physically attack you or verbally abuse you. It takes two to get "bullied", the aggressor and the person unable to exert some confidence.

Again, if you cannot handle the trash talk that comes with playing any kind of game, then just ignore the person or just stop playing altogether. Please stop painting yourself as a victim and just learn how to play in an online environment. Worst thing you could do is hijack the term "cyber bully" as it has real meaning to real people in the real world, not virtual avatars.

tl;dr
cyber bullying does not exist in competitive settings in a virtual world. Grow up or start blacklisting half your server.

edit: Games have referees and MMOs have GMs for a reason. If you think someone's behavior is beyond harassment, then blacklist/report them. Simple as that. If you have a bad reputation on your server then that is usually due to YOUR actions, not someone else's. Statements like "go kill yourself" are reportable, though you have to acknowledge that the person making those statements are likely 12 years old (or have the mental capacity of a 12 year old). Statements like "just uninstall/quit the game", though juvenile, is still acceptable trash talk.

lol @ the WoW funeral crashing...It happened on a PvP server during a time when honor points were pretty hard to come by. What are you doing hosting a funeral on a PvP server without proper security?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHJVolaC8pw <-- one of the best moments in vanilla WoW history.

I experienced harassment by a GM of a game once, so it's not just limited to harassment of players by players.

In this game, I admittedly used a minor bug exploit where I accessed a special merchant that is only available one week a year outside of that week. The equivalent of FFXIV ARR's event merchants that sell vanity gear. I made a token effort to contact a GM about it, but when one wasn't available I went ahead and bought a handful of the vanity items. This was a bug that the GMs had been aware of for years and had never bothered to fix. They would band-aid solution it, but the band-aid often fell off with other patches and updates. Not that this justifies my action, but it provides a picture of the low severity of the offence.

A GM contacted me in game about it, and was disciplined according to the ToS of the game appropriately which I accepted and went on my way, assuming it to be resolved. What happened next is where the GM team crossed the line into harassment.

The GM who had disciplined me posted the next day in the game's official forum about the incident punishing the entire server for my exploit and suggesting the player base take action against me in game, specifically mentioning my name. (The server I played on was open PvP with little moderation of said PvP.) She then went in game and used the game's equivalent of game-wide /shout to link to that post and again call me specifically out by name, using me as a scapegoat for the plight that she put them in.

I responded to her post on the forum by stating that her conduct was unprofessional and against her game's ToS since it specifically states that specifics of ToS violations will not be discussed with people other than the person who made the violation. I also requested an apology.

After my response, the most senior GM in the game posted that her behaviour was justified because I was 'one of the worst offenders' of exploits, and that the server-wide punishment for my personal transgression was entirely defensible. Her actions being against their own ToS be damned. A single minor violation in fourteen years apparently qualifies me for the status of one of the worst. I did regularly find bugs in game and reported every single one of them to staff in game. Perhaps that's what he was referring to. This was the first that I used to my own gain, which I admitted and accepted punishment for. Punishing the entire player base over it and attempting to publicly lay the blame at a player's feet is not acceptable.

I responded to his post by saying as much, and immediately dropping my subscription to that game (which I had been subscribed to for the greater part of fourteen years) like a hot potato, only playing out the remainder of the time I had already paid for.

This is a screen capture of the original GM's post:
http://i44.tinypic.com/msou2d.png
http://i43.tinypic.com/20h966e.png

I unfortunately do not have a screen capture of her in game communications, her boss's response, nor my responses to either of their posts since I was not thinking clearly enough and those posts are now archived in a forum I no longer have access to.

It is to the credit of that player community that not a single person took action against me during the short remainder of my subscription for what was clearly an abuse of power on the part of the GMs.

Edit: After some digging, I found my response to her boss's post lurking in my documents folder. It's not a screen capture, unfortunately, just a copy/paste of the text. The sections that are bolded are quotes from his response, the non-bolded sections are my response to each of those quotes, and the italicized section is the letter I wrote requesting cancellation of my three accounts:

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Post on 3/17/2012

>>5) Someone found an bug that allowed them to get into Guild Fest. I should point out that this someone was also one of the biggest abusers of the Extreme Shop bug, so there's no claiming, "I didn't know that this was a bad thing!"

Not counting the items I had before the incident that had been given to me during a vault cleaning, all that I have received from that shop is one item (an oversize backpack with some stuff in it) and I catalogued the shop for elanthipedia. That hardly counts as being one of the biggest abusers.

>>8) Lyneya asked player "Wtf?". Player basically responded, "Whatever. It's not like you're going to do anything about it. Go away and leave me alone."

Actually, the full and undistorted conversation was as follows:

Chatter[Lyneya] Mhaeric?
Chatter[Mhaeric] Yes? You're lucky I just checked in before heading out
Chatter[Lyneya] Need to gab, can I bring you to me for a sec?
Chatter[Mhaeric] Sure

The world grows blurry and indistinct. After a moment everything becomes clear again. Looking about, you see...
[Lyneya's Hideaway, By the River]
Large tangerine trees stand along the river's edge, their boughs providing a sheltered place to rest by the water. Yellow and green flowers grow around the base of the trees. In the distance, a fountain sits near a stone bridge that spans the river. A small cottage with a wide wooden door is situated just past the bridge, surrounded by some flowers that have grown incredibly high.
Also here: GameMaster Lyneya.
Obvious paths: none.

Lyneya says, "Hi,."
You wave.
Lyneya says, "So, I'm trying to decide what to do here."
You ask, "About?"
Lyneya says, "I mean, on the one hand, I can see that you tried to get my attention on chatter before you went shopping at a closed fest. On the other hand, you didnt wait very long before you said "screw it" and went anyways."
You say, "Oh that."
You chuckle.
Lyneya says, "You had to know you were abusing a bug. You dont go into a tent in one place and come out at another."
Lyneya says, "After the extreme shop thing, I'd have thought you'd display better judgement."
Lyneya asks, "So, what gives?"
You say, "Not sure. Just went window shopping to check stuff out."
You say, "Then ended up buying stuff."
You say, "Got sucked in by the caravan customization." (It was rainbows!)
You say, "I don't even really need or want any of the stuff, so I'm more than willing just to get rid of it all."
You shrug.
Lyneya asks, "You shrug like its just.. whatever. Not important. I guess to you it isnt?"
You say, "The stuff, no." (I.e. the mech abuse, yes)

(From this point forward, I am running around getting ready to leave and only partially atk, checking in every once in a while to type a brief response. Its impossible to show the odd pauses in the conversation that occured.)

Lyneya says, "I'm at a loss here."
Lyneya says, "I quite honestly am flabbergasted by your blase attitude."
Lyneya says, "I've already reclaimed the items Portal had in his inventory. I need to talk to the trader guy about how to deal with Pouch, and I need to talk to the other SGMs about how to handle everything else."
You say, "So much for un-moderated."
You wave your hand distractedly.
Lyneya blinks.
Lyneya says, "Actually, bug abuse is one of the only things that can actually get you in trouble over here, Mhaeric. Beside that point, I'm really disappointed in you. You knew better, or else you wouldnt have been asking about it on chatter."
Lyneya says, "Unmoderated means that we dont get in the middle of your pvp disputes and we dont bother you about your language. It does not mean you can abuse bugs."
Lyneya says, "Pouch and Portal have both received bug abused warnings."
You say, "Oh, I think there's a slight miscommunication btw. Not that it changes anything." (re: her thinking I'm blase about the mech abuse.)
Lyneya says, "Read NEWS 5 18."
Lyneya says, "I'll set you back down so I can get on to figuring out how to deal with the rest of it."
Lyneya nods politely.

The world grows blurry and indistinct. After a moment everything becomes clear again. Looking about, you see...
[The Western Road, Foothills]
The road dips slightly between the path north through the forest and a steeper rise to the southeast. Off to one side, victim of some misfortune, sits an abandoned wagon -- or what's left of it after passersby have stripped it of usable parts.
You also see a bone-trimmed wayerd pyramid, a bone-trimmed wayerd pyramid, a battered Wayerd pyramid, a bone-trimmed wayerd pyramid, a battered Wayerd pyramid, a battered Wayerd pyramid, a bone-trimmed wayerd pyramid and a bone-trimmed wayerd pyramid.
Obvious paths: north, southeast.

<<11) Lyneya made it clear, again, what is expected from the TF community when it comes to bug abuse and exploits on the forums.

You forgot the part where she explicitly named me as the person who was subject to a policy violation and discussed various details of that policy violation such as the number of accounts and what the violation was for. I find it very telling that you intentionally gloss over that part, since it goes against your very own policy that you are so actively defending in this post. And especially since you continue to discuss in even further details the circumstances surrounding the violation in this very post in points 5, 6, and 8. Point 9 even reveals that you not only publicy discussed it, but individually with other players prior to the public discussion. Given my cancellation reason that was forwarded to you, and has yet to receive more than a form-letter response, I am at a loss to explain how you feel that is even remotely an acceptable thing to do. Here, I'll include it here as a reminder:

<<I am cancelling all of my three accounts (*****, BALLD1, *******) because of unacceptable actions by GM Lyneya that directly violate your privacy policy. Her actions were in direct follow up to a mechanics abuse violation in TF that I received and that had been resolved.

<<For a bit of backstory and context, the mechanics abuse I was found to be guilty of was entering and purchasing some items from a closed festival which did not have its access cut off properly. While I don't believe this to be considered a major mechancis abuse as outlined in POLICY 5, I accept that its open to interpretation and accepted the policy warning on the two accounts which had accessed the festival. I assumed the issue was resolved, except for the behind the scenes work necessary to fix the bug. Everything up to this point consists of acceptable conduct by your staff and does not factor into my complaint or cancellation.

<<The day after the above mechancis abuse consult was resolved, GM Lyneya made the following post titled "Mech Abuse in TF" on the TF forums in the official GM Announcements folder: http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms:%20The%20Fallen/Talk%20to%20Simutronics/Official%20Announcements/view/1095. She then cut and paste a link to it in the in game chatter. Both of these locations are public means of communication.

<<The majority of the post is information about mechanics abuse and explanation about how it applies in TF. The second last line states that she will be punishing all of the players in TF for the mechanics abuse of one of those players. While a questionable decision, this is within Simutronics rights as you are able to provide or remove content for any reason.

<<Had she ended the post there, there would still be no issue. However, the last line of that post is completely unacceptable. Simutronic's policy is, and has always been, to not discuss or comment on an individual policy decision with anyone other than the person subject to that decision. That I was publicy called out by name in both a forum post as well as via a link in game to said post flies in the face of that policy so blatantly it has me shocked. It is also more than a little hypocritical, since her violation of policy is direct response to a policy violation itself. Even in the Extreme Shop series of violations from last year, there was no singling out of any player by name by a GM. It smacks of vindictiveness or a personal grudge and is quite frankly petty.

<<Whatever her reasoning, I am disgusted by her behaviour, as well as the fact that her superiors must have signed off on the post before it went out. I do not hold out for anything more than a non-apology in response to this, and as such am no longer willing to continue providing your company 60USD per month.

I have purposely kept myself out of the kerfuffle resulting from this, both on the forums and in the game, because I agree with the mechanics abuse warnings as was stated in my cancellation reason. Even the soup Nazi-esque "No guildfest, for you!" response for all of TF is fine by me, again for the above reasons, although I do consider it to be an over-reaction and childish.

However.

Your, and by extension, Simutronics' continuing hypocrisy is what is not alright. Especially considering that it was as an attempt to publicly vilify one of your paying players in game. An attempt I might add that notably backfired. I am heartened to see that people saw it for the childishness that it was and chose not to act on it.

I stated that an apology was something I did not think would be forthcoming, and I was correct. I am disappointed that I didn't even receive a token response from you at least acknowledging the situation and explaining your side of the situation, but no matter. What I am is angered by your continuing public discussion of details of my violation with others knowing full well that I disapprove of it and that it is against your own policy that you are holding up on a pedestal in the very same post.

Simutronics and I are completely done once I use up every last minute I paid for. Good luck in your future endeavours. Given the events of the past month, I believe you will need it.

-Mark.

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Bullying in a video game like this (the MMO genre in general) needs to be looked at more of a supporting argument than a primary focus.

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They are looking at other aspects of Cyber bullying too but my friend has been assigned to gaming specifically :) were as his other colleagues are looking at bullying in the likes of facebook etc. To be honest I think it' really good that they are looking at cyber bullying in gaming, mainly because I think its a topic not many people look at when they think of cyber bullying? what I find more interesting is that with the likes of facebook and twitter it's pretty easy to point out how someone is getting bullied but with gaming it's a lot more different I mean some people are just assholes! I mean for mature gamers it's easy to just ignore them but his audience are 10-13 year olds so I think it's great to help them be aware the abuse in the world of gaming.

I find it odd that some post on here don't consider cyberbullying a thing in games. Just because they don't know your real name doesn't mean they can't damage or hurt your reputation sure it may be a game reputation and people can move on from that but we shouldn't tolerate it here either. The only way to combat cyberbullying is by recognizing it on all fronts. Sure some belittling another on a game may seem as if it isn't as impactful as other forms of cyberbullying but you don't know the state of that person's mind. Maybe they turn to games to escape from being bullied else where.

Give him hands on experience OP let him spend a day with you in Eorzea. I think he'll get a very good idea of how it can look.

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Originally Posted by Mhaeric

I experienced harassment by a GM of a game once, so it's not just limited to harassment of players by players.


The GM who had disciplined me posted the next day in the game's official forum about the incident punishing the entire server for my exploit and suggesting the player base take action against me in game, specifically mentioning my name. (The server I played on was open PvP with little moderation of said PvP.) She then went in game and used the game's equivalent of game-wide /shout to link to that post and again call me specifically out by name, using me as a scapegoat for the plight that she put them in.



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Oh man that is really horrible of her!! I'm so sorry to hear that and thank you so much for sharing that though It never even crossed my mind that GM's can be the one doing the bullying!

HAha and TeaTimeBear I'm scared if I show him a day of FF on my ps3 he might end up breaking my ps3 and rage quit my character D:

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Originally Posted by Chakyeung

They are looking at other aspects of Cyber bullying too but my friend has been assigned to gaming specifically :) were as his other colleagues are looking at bullying in the likes of facebook etc. To be honest I think it' really good that they are looking at cyber bullying in gaming, mainly because I think its a topic not many people look at when they think of cyber bullying? what I find more interesting is that with the likes of facebook and twitter it's pretty easy to point out how someone is getting bullied but with gaming it's a lot more different I mean some people are just assholes! I mean for mature gamers it's easy to just ignore them but his audience are 10-13 year olds so I think it's great to help them be aware the abuse in the world of gaming.

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Agreed. Awareness is important, especially when people have not gained the potential level of maturity or "thick-skin" that comes with life and experience. The primary thing that separates social mediums like Facebook and Twitter to gaming is the anonymity. Facebook and Twitter are often mediums people use for their real selves (real names, real pictures, etc). Video games are usually the place people turn to for their fantasy selves. While people are putting their social beings out there, they still have that layer of protection (anonymity). Being aware of that is a double-edged sword, in that those who are emotionally vulnerable will potentially take it less personally, while those who seek to do harm can do so without anyone being the wiser about their identity.

This is probably why they're just considered "assholes". They're just seeking to be mean (hurtful is subjective to the target/victim). Whereas it being a personal thing, as in RL identities are in play, is a far more impacting act. Victims do not have the protection that anonymity provides. It's more of a difference of severity when you compare video games to social outlets. A threat is a far lesser crime than actually acting on it. Doesn't change the fact that a threat is still a punishable act though lol. I mean the report your friend has to go on, with gaming, has a huge number of resources to choose from.

Defamation is a common thing to see. I'd wager that it's usually justified, but it definitely does have wrongful uses. It's the gaming worlds equivalent of being put on the list. You know, like how sexual predators have to be put on a list and notify those around them that they have this background before moving someplace new. People in the gaming world don't have to notify the folks on the new server of who they are at least lol. It's interesting to observe, if I'm being honest.

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Originally Posted by statikcat

In game you just /ignore and grow up.

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Not everyone is in as secure a place mentally as you, no matter how old or young they are. Telling people to "grow up" to deal with interpersonal problems they may be experiencing in-game is not productive and can actually hurt the situation. Words are not "just" words; they can hurt just as much, if not more, than many "real" things.

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Originally Posted by Archona

Please do not use the term "cyber bully" in a video game. The point of games is that they are competitive. If you can't handle the heat, then get out of the kitchen. Real victims of cyber bullying face real world consequences, such as inability to go to school and confront bullies on a daily basis, depression, and suicidal ideation. Ingame you can simply ignore a problematic player. Nothing they do to you will have any consequence on you, because its not like they can physically attack you or verbally abuse you. It takes two to get "bullied", the aggressor and the person unable to exert some confidence.

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You need to learn more about the psychological effects of bullying, my friend.

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Originally Posted by DardGhalawad

Excuse me for dwindling in your FFXI life, but was that in the world Cerberus? I remember something similar happening with 3 members from the ls I was in, and that wasn't funny to watch <.<;

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Fenrir actually. It was pretty shocking to me too. I was not expecting her to get so unhinged. Specially over a guy half her age. In any case, call it spam call it drama, it's still bullying. It's one person purposely making another's life miserable. Motives may change but the results are the same.

I was bullied in school and it was long before cyber-bullying came about. And to be honest, the term ,bullying, really made it sound nicer than it was. If it had been adults doing this to another adult it would have fallen under the term torture. People would have ended up in jail but because it was children it was passed off as kids just being kids and if I ignored them they'd stop. Well that doesn't work.