A player named Marael said the following:
"The game plays like a single player RPG. Honestly, I don't even know why it's online at all in the first place. This might be contributing to the silence. There's very few things in the entire game that actually require communication with other players of any kind. Coil, CT, that's about it, right? If the game consists largely of single player content, or content where all you have to do is memorize a boss' script to succeed, a lot of people aren't all that motivated to speak. Again, it's a single player RPG put online for whatever unfathomable reason, and it seems that a good chunk of the community just seems to disregard the fact that there even IS a community at all. When you have to go out of your way to do something, and it's not required to get the job done, sadly, not many people are going to do it."
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The sentences highlighted in red are the statements I would like you to focus on. How accurate (how true is it to your actual experience) are those statements to you or your experience thus far with this game. I bought FFXIV about 6 days ago and while I am thankful to be apart of a very sociable free company filled with veteran and helpful players (One Hit Knock Out - OHKO for short) , the path that the game provides for me (which I must follow) to be able to get to the point where my veteran free company friends are at (end game) is very very single-player focused. If I were to answer my own question, I would say that those statements really hit home - in other words, they ring "very true" to me.
I definitely have my reasons (and I need some time to think about how to word those reasons so that they are coherent - so forgive me if I have to keep editing a bunch of times).
Reasons:
1. To progress (keep in mind I am only level 26 at the moment) through the dungeons, you must follow the quests centered around the "story line".
2. (Had it and now I can't remember... it will come back to me haha).
3. No open world PvP in this game (although I am kind of nervous about saying this because I understand that there are people who wouldn't even touch this game if open world pvp was included). I put it here because seeing another player (enemy let's say) should theoretically remind me and enforce the idea that I am not the only player in the world playing the game. There is more to it than just interacting and completing objectives with NPCS.
What are your reasons for your point of view? Let's have a civil discussion (we have the weekend - so no rush!).
Purpose for this discussion/thread:
I'd like to take the reasons presented by various players in this discussion and try to figure out non-obvious methods of being able to bring more players together and make this feel like an MMO.
(of course, this hints that I feel it is a bit lacking in the "let's go do this together" aspect of the game - currently the side of the fence that I am on).
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12-28-2013, 09:13 AMMohamedHow well do the following statements relate to you about this game?
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12-28-2013, 09:23 AMSangcreux
While everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I don't agree whatsoever. This game plays about as solo as all other games currently. Think of WoW for example, one of the most renown mmos of its genre. You can basically solo from level 1to cap, and frontiers the only time you communicate is in raids, and that's only if you don't have it down already.
I have met some great people.every group iget I socializes. My FC is very active, and for the most part HMs require strategy and discussion. I hope your experience gets better, but I never feel like its a solo RPG. Unless of course I'm playing my solo storyline. -
12-28-2013, 09:27 AMRi_ri
I agree, and I like it this way. I like that we're not forced to commit to other people to progress our characters, what is usually the only thing that makes people play together.
For example, I'm in a T4 group right now, waiting for a tank. I'd rather go sleep, but here I am... I know for experience that I either take this opportunity, or run the risk of missing T4 this week (and I need my chest).
I'd hate to have this situation everyday, like in older MMORPGs.
Maybe I completely missed the point, but as I said, I'm sleepy... yet here I am, using the forums to maintain me awake. -
12-28-2013, 09:28 AMMohamedThat's a very good point you brought to the table Sangcreux. In fact, I can relate directly to that because nowadays, if I want to fall asleep real quick, all I need to do is log on to WoW and stare at the people running to and from the auction house to the mailbox 100 times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sangcreux
Joking aside, it's true. Almost all mmos nowadays don't require you to group up with someone to tackle the journey to becoming a hero... only what's after.
I would consider what I highlighted in red to be a good argument towards making the structure of an MMO based off of a single-player RPG.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ri_ri
Basically, I too enjoy that I don't have to depend on people most of the time to progress my character, but I also miss the social interaction when it comes to progressing your character to end-game (not what to do with him/her at end-game).
So it's kind of really tricky to design an MMO to be able to incorporate both of these experiences I think as the community nowadays has changed. Instead of people asking for group content, they try to ask for soloable content.
A reason for soloable content:
1. Time zones are different. Very valid reason to ask for single player content - I can't play with my friends because I am awake while they are asleep! (How can I kill X to progress through Y if there is no one on to help me out with it). So I agree in that regard. Soloable content does help a lot.
A reason why a shift in asking for more content to do solo than in a group may be due to:
1. Community (People are in general... not as friendly in recent years - for a variety of reasons). -
12-28-2013, 09:33 AMPallasLloydBut most MMOs, including WoW, don't make you drop party and solo every single thing like ARR does, and then to add insult to injury, make you do the instanced fight with gimpy NPCs that just get you killed. That was one of the things that makes this game suck especially hard, IMO. You can barely play it with someone else even if you WANTED to.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohamed
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12-28-2013, 09:36 AMSangcreuxI enjoyed those fights. But then again it's a matter of opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by PallasLloyd
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12-28-2013, 09:38 AMPallasLloydWhether you thought they were enjoyable or not is beside the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sangcreux
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12-28-2013, 09:41 AMSangcreuxI dunno man. There were around 30-40 instances fights. Most of those were main story quests, which isoverbylevel50. The endgame is very sociable.Quote:
Originally Posted by PallasLloyd
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12-28-2013, 09:42 AMMohamedHaha, you made me laugh IRL. I actually died to the sylph storyline cut-scene challenge where there is this ugly monster looking thing that comes (with the four tainted slyphs). Let's just say that Papylamo (however his nsme is spelled) should try to be a little bit more quick with his heals!Quote:
Originally Posted by PallasLloyd
I agree that it points back to game design. Sometimes I truly question the original intentions for final fantasy 14. Here is another question: Do you guys think that some aspects of FF 14 were originally intended to be played as a single-player RPG from the start? (I know this is really asking you to think outside the box and stuff...but I mean... the bare backbone of it... not the intricacies).
There are a lot of instanced fights (so far I have experienced more instanced fights than dungeon group content). Do you think that if there was more group based content than instance story line fights, that some people would feel differently about this game feeling like a single-player RPG?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sangcreux
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I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
Me too. :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
Best of both worlds :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
I find that guilds can be either supportive or a complete detriment to your playstyle. It really...though... depends on both the player and the guild (not one or the other). Do you think that the focus on "raiding" is partially to blame to the "tool" mentality often expressed by large free companies? (By tool I mean what you mean - just means to an end... and by large free companies I mean free companies in which you have the potential to feel like you are just a number).Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
Which, for the most part, intensifies the feeling of this feeling more like a single-player RPG than an MMO. It's fine to include it, but like you said... the conflict is that you don't have the option to do it with a group. I think that it would be way way way more fun and exciting if Papylmo and Nda were replaced with two other players. :PQuote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour
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12-28-2013, 09:45 AMDark-Saviour
It sort of is, but that's not intrinsically a bad thing, nor does it need to lead to the game lacking in social contact.
I've always preferred to play online games 'alongside' other people. Or to be more specific, we do the same content, helping each other, but are not really reliant on their presence to complete it. PSO was the first online game I played, and it really set the bar for what an online game should be in my eyes, and that game literally had a single-player mode.
As far as I'm concerned, the biggest issues, as I've stated before are guilds, and the type of group content being offered. The first causes a problem due to the tendency of those in guilds to become insular and distant from the community as a whole. As for the latter, when you have a linear-progression style of content with all of the rewards at the end, and necessitate that everyone is reliant on everyone else, it leads to a situation where other players are just regarded as necessary tools for people to get what they want; any time spent socializing or chatting is time not spent expediting the journey to the reward.
As far as the game being soloable goes, the only major thing I see with that which might conflict with being social is that you're not allowed to do the story/class duties while in a party. Other than that though, it's not an issue in itself.
To me, at least, its not a good situation if the type of 'socialization' a game fosters is merely talking about strategies to succeed in group content, nor is it good if people are social only because the game has forced them to group to do something they really don't enjoy doing.
Socializing should be something laid back that happens amongst the entirety of the community as you play; not something super-serious, nor something you have to try and force people into. -
12-28-2013, 10:58 AMZfz
I think human community has always been built around need. In a game where it's easy to solo all the way to level cap and pug most of the content, the need disappears and people don't invest time in community building.
That doesn't mean you can't build communities. It just means the scale is smaller and it feels more like a straight-forward "online game" than a "massively multiplayer" online game.