Titan Death Quote and its meaning

When you kill Titan his death quote is as follows:

"Titan: Hie, my children, into the dark! He will not be denied..."

Who is "He"? I could make a couple guesses but I don't think I could fundament any of them. Using the word "dark" I'd say it could be Zodiark but why would Titan be the only primal to reference it?

Anyone have theories or did I somehow miss something glaringly obvious?

Becaue Titan are only primal that living underground? (its so dark ... dark there, you know? if not count magma) and those Kobold also living in Ulgamo's Mine (name not correct but it is mine) that place also dark.

I don't know who the 'he' is, either, but when he says "Hie, my children, into the dark" he's telling them to run away. I'm trying to think of any male characters that Titan or the Kobolds would be aware of at that moment, but I don't think any of them were aware of Lahabrea or Nero... Hmm, maybe he's just referring to the idea of 'death' as 'he'? After all, he's telling them to run away because he's afraid of you--or someone else--killing his 'children.' So it makes a bit of sense in that context, but I can't say for certain.

When I defeat titan, i'm 99% certain the quote is "she will not be denied" -- so titan is telling his children, the kobolds, to run and hide in the depths of the earth, because his assumption is that you, the player, are coming to exterminate them all, having slain their great father. Don't you feel awful?

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Originally Posted by Norondor

When I defeat titan, i'm 99% certain the quote is "she will not be denied" -- so titan is telling his children, the kobolds, to run and hide in the depths of the earth, because his assumption is that you, the player, are coming to exterminate them all, having slain their great father. Don't you feel awful?

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I was about to ask if that happened for female characters. Thanks for solving that one.

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Originally Posted by Norondor

Don't you feel awful?

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Now I really do T_T What have I dooooooooooone!

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Originally Posted by Norondor

When I defeat titan, i'm 99% certain the quote is "she will not be denied" -- so titan is telling his children, the kobolds, to run and hide in the depths of the earth, because his assumption is that you, the player, are coming to exterminate them all, having slain their great father. Don't you feel awful?

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Nah not really. Demon and Dark souls kinda ruined me more inside.

You know, killing a blind spider girl's sister, who was only gathering souls to heal her sister.

And killing a maiden who gave up her humanity to heal sick people and help aborted children.

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Originally Posted by Norondor

When I defeat titan, i'm 99% certain the quote is "she will not be denied" -- so titan is telling his children, the kobolds, to run and hide in the depths of the earth, because his assumption is that you, the player, are coming to exterminate them all, having slain their great father. Don't you feel awful?

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I had no clue about that, never killed him with a female character. Thanks for clarifying! It makes sense in that context, yeah. Case solved it seems.

I had assumed he said "she" in reference to the Mothercrystal (especially with telling the Kobolds to flee into the dark)...makes things more interesting that he is really referring to you.

And yeah...I've felt a bit bad about having to kill him a bit. At the same time, he doesn't want to negotiate with me...I try talking to him, but no, he just tries to Landslide me again...

Well, since i really like anon and catapult's theories on the nature of summoned beasts (and they're almost definitely right), i assume Titan has the same kind of cultural attitudes and assumptions as kobold society at large -- and the kobolds didn't even summon their primal in response to the Garleans, but specifically because of Lominsan aggression. The only time they ever see overdwellers in O'ghoromo, it's because they've come to slaughter and pillage, so it's not a surprise that Titan assumes you're another band of butchers from the surface...

The "dark" is a reference to Zodiark. It's made clear in his battle music.

I don't get the whole "He will not be denied..." Denied of what?

It is Titan's very presence that endangers the Kobolds. Ironic.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

The "dark" is a reference to Zodiark. It's made clear in his battle music.

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Huh? The gender of whom Titan says will not be denied is dependent on the player, and the Kobold's home is a system of mined caverns.

"Hasten yourselves,
those who refer to me as Great Father,
into the depths of the caves so that you may hide.
I am not strong enough to deny this warrior entrance to our home."

I'm of the opinion that the conclusion reached earlier in the thread is correct. Zodiark is worshiped by the Ascians. The Ascians, as part of their plan to bring Zodiark to power, presented themselves as divine messengers to the beast tribes, basically the equivalent of angels to them, so that they could teach them to summon primals. The point of this was to destabilize the world's aether and cause the Sixth Astral Era to fall. Then they gave the Garleans Ultima Weapon to defeat the primals. This fed the aether already concentrated by the primals' essence into the Heart of Sabik, the core of the Ultima Weapon, and part of their plan. The beast tribes are being used. How would they know about Zodiark? And if they did know, why would they consider it a good thing?

Eh? I'm not saying "He" is Zodirak. I'm saying "dark" is Zodiark. It is in the music.

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Shorn from the world 'neath the blazing sun
Bound to the dark, for the light I shun

(...)

Into the dark of an endless night
Where the pulse of the land offers no respite

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The Primals are no fans of Hydaelin. They trust the Ascians. They must know of Zodiark and have some relationship with him.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

Eh? I'm not saying "He" is Zodirak. I'm saying "dark" is Zodiark. It is in the music.



The Primals are no fans of Hydaelin. They trust the Ascians. They must know of Zodiark and have some relationship with him.

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What? That part of the song you quoted is only talking about being underground. I think you're looking too deep into it's meaning.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

They trust the Ascians.

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Those beastmen who are pro-primal, including but not limited to those already tempered, trust the Paragons. Most don't know that those masquerading as Paragons are actually Ascians. In 1.00, the Sylphs in particular were the proof of this. On one hand, they recounted the legends of how the wise Paragons come in times of need to lead the beast tribes to the light of the primals, and yet, upon seeing an ascian in its true form, said:

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Originally Posted by Toll of the Warden (1.0)

Almxio: Stay back! Far, far back!
Zoxio: Those ones are of much evil! Those ones are of much power!

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All of the lyrics in Under the Weight are about the entity you're fighting.

Wrought from the rock that stands upon old // With heart of black and a stare that's cold
He's made from the planet's very crust and has no compassion.

Cold are the hands that grasp at your soul // 'Fore the graves are dug and the death knells toll
He'll kill all of you.

Tempered in the flows of the mountain's core // Where the rage runs red twixt shore and shore
Strengthened by the flowing magma of O'Ghomoro on the isle of Vylbrand.

Shorn from the world 'neath the blazing sun // Bound to the dark, for the light I shun
His body was broken from the rock and now he lives deep underground.

Into the dark of an endless night // Where the pulse of the land offers no respite
The overdewllers have come to these caves, where the benefits of the land will not save them.

In spite of the blood that was spilled before // You whet your blades, you thirst for more
They broke their oath and stole our land, and yet still they come.

Now kneel overdweller, your lord commands // There's no salvation for the sons of man
Titan will rectify this situation.

The skies will tremble and the earth will quake // From the crumbling walls no one escapes
Violently.

I'm not speaking of beastmen, but of Primals. Ifrit states he had already been warned by the Paragons of our existence before he was summoned. He trust their word.

If there's a difference to be made between Paragons and Ascians in ARR, I'm yet to see it.

If you that's your interpretation of Titan's song, that's with you.

Have you ever been on a tour of a mine before? There are places here and there where you can do it - decommissioned gold mines are the most common, since tourists tend to be curious about gold mining.

On these tours, it's not uncommon for the tour guide to take a moment to show you what it's like when the lights are turned off. Until you experience this, it is difficult to comprehend the true meaning of "dark". It's not shadow, it's not evil, it's not malevolent. It is simply a complete and utter absence of light, which confronts the senses and forces the use of your ears, smell and touch.

This is the sort of dark Titan has to be referring to. If there is a solitary group of people in Eorzea who have a unique understanding of "dark", then it is the Kobold Miners.

(While I'm on the subject, Kobolds should be immune to the Blind status effect. They are very well accustomed to the dark.)

Titan's song also reflects the brutal reality faced by miners. The underground is unforgiving and the earth, while it may be chipped away at here and there, is immensely overwhelming to man. If your tunnel collapses, the weight of the land will bind you relentlessly. It doesn't forgive.

To escape a cave-in requires incredible precision to avoid making the clutch of the land even tighter. This is also reflected in how precise you must be when fighting Titan, a sentient manifestation of the Rock itself.

As a miner, you must respect the land. It is your father. A strict one who severely punishes those who misbehave and will likewise unconditionally protect his children.

Oh? So you are saying that Hydaelin and Zodiark, the drivers of the main story, aren't likely to be referenced in a song featured during a Primal battle? You give Soken too little credit. You can always ask him to clear any doubt.

But carry with your train of thought and answer me this:

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Originally Posted by Toranja

I don't get the whole "He will not be denied..." Denied of what?

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Certainly.

You, the adventurer who has invaded their home, have clearly come for something. They assume you have come for blood, to pillage their homes of its mineral wealth and slaughter the children in your way. With Titan's fall, you will not be denied what you seek.
What they do not understand is that you have come for Titan himself, not that which he protects. Such a possibility is foreign to them, for why would you seek to bring harm to the might of their Father?

The tribes do pay respect to the paragons, but for their own sake, not for Zodiark's sake. The paragons kept their status as Ascians under wraps for a very long time.

The song is about Titan. It is ALL about Titan. I would expect the writer of the lyrics, probably Fernehalwes (not Soken), to keep on topic when writing this rather than deviating on to a bigger picture. There is far too much lore of the Kobolds to cover before getting into deeper matters. I give him exceptional credit for this.

I think this is also reflected in the other primal songs, such as Garuda and Moggle Mog, as the lyrics pertain to the battle and those particular Primals/Aetheric beings, rather than subtle hints at the grander story.