Botting his way to mining

So, I was mining near Ul'dah this morning and I returned to the same spot by the evening. I was mining my own business, when I notice the exact same player is back too. Or, better put, still there. I followed him around and I noticed he was always making the same set of actions and path.

This player was mining with the Miner's L55 main and off hand equipment and the rest was just in bikini. I sent him a tell in the morning but he didn't reply. Sent him another telling him I would report him if he did not reply. Not surprised that he didn't.

But, really, how does one expect not to be noticed with a bikini and a botting 24/7?

Naming is a bannable offence. We hate player bots just report them.

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Originally Posted by LordSideKicks

Naming is a bannable offence. We hate player bots just report them.

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Removed the name.

Probably because its hard to prove in any MMO unless they're blatantly cheating, like teleporting or such. I myself will farm shards legitimately for sometimes a few hours and wearing my bikini to keep repair costs low. Hard to tell the difference unless you catch someone doing it for 12+ hours straight or moving like a robot; then you got to convince a moderator of you've seen. It's frustrating for sure.

Been trying to convince them since launch. Every weekend I see the same trash doing his thing. Lol.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

I was mining my own business

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I see what ya did there.

More to the point, all you can do is report them, move on, and hope they get banned in the future. :/

You cant report people cause they don't want to talk to you. I ignore people all the time when I am gathering or w/e cause I don't want to be bothered.

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Originally Posted by Accolades

You cant report people cause they don't want to talk to you. I ignore people all the time when I am gathering or w/e cause I don't want to be bothered.

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yeah why should i reply to someone on a witch hunt

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Originally Posted by Toranja

So, I was mining near Ul'dah this morning and I returned to the same spot by the evening. I was mining my own business, when I notice the exact same player is back too. Or, better put, still there. I followed him around and I noticed he was always making the same set of actions and path.

This player was mining with the Miner's L55 main and off hand equipment and the rest was just in bikini. I sent him a tell in the morning but he didn't reply. Sent him another telling him I would report him if he did not reply. Not surprised that he didn't.

But, really, how does one expect not to be noticed with a bikini and a botting 24/7?

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so not wanting to put wear on high level gear and being able to run nearly identicle paths and not wishing to get off their ass to reply to you is botting?
also how do you know they were there when you werent?

Here they come the botters white knights.

All I got to say is this guy is still there in that same spot after a week of reporting on balmung. Reported everyday and been reported by multiple people too. I mean I know they can't get them immediately but really? Over a week of more than one person reporting them everyday and not one mod can come out and be bothered to watch him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtzAERhovPk

Like I say report and ignore. The white knights of bots/multiboxer with 3rd party program will come and flame you with their thousand of excuses. Run and hide

1) Harvesting things you have a 100% rate on naked does not make you a bot.

2) Ignoring /tells from people on a witch hunt does not make you a bot.

3) The ability to concentrate on a mundane and highly repetitive task for hours on end does not make you a bot.

I am not in any way defending people who bot, but, as so often happens in these situations, the accusation of botting is being thrown around with no actual proof. I've more than once ignored /tells from random vigilantes who feel that they are the last line of defence between the player base and complete anarchy. I most definitely have the ability to concentrate on the same mundane and repetitive task for hours on end (yay for years of playing FFXI).

I don't bot and I certainly don't support it but I also don't support random fools pestering me to prove I'm not a bot. If someone wants to report me that's fine. I'll have a nice and brief conversation with a GM if they even feel like investigating yet another baseless claim against an honest player.

The GMs might have more time to take care of real bots if so many people didn't waste there time reporting non-verifiable claims of botting.

You follow always the same path even if there are no nodes on the way and there is one right behind you? Yes, you are a botter… or really dumb.

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Originally Posted by ZohnoReecho

You follow always the same path even if there are no nodes on the way and there is one right behind you? Yes, you are a botter… or really dumb.

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I'd have to be dumb to buy a bot that bad, but that's beside my main point. It is not actual proof.

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Originally Posted by ZohnoReecho

You follow always the same path even if there are no nodes on the way and there is one right behind you? Yes, you are a botter… or really dumb.

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It's not actual proof. But I would bet my left nut it's a botter when you see this for hours on end, combined with a route that's on perfect rails as in he'll run straight through you and your 5 buddies you placed on it EVERY time for the duration, without fault or without stopping once.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

This player was mining with the Miner's L55 main and off hand equipment and the rest was just in bikini. I sent him a tell in the morning but he didn't reply. Sent him another telling him I would report him if he did not reply. Not surprised that he didn't.

But, really, how does one expect not to be noticed with a bikini and a botting 24/7?

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What's wrong with gathering in a bikini? I have a Sexy Miner gear set that I equip whenever I go crystal farming. It's not like there's a reason to wear your good gear to a crystal hunt. Bikinis are not a sign of botting.

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Originally Posted by ZohnoReecho

You follow always the same path even if there are no nodes on the way and there is one right behind you? Yes, you are a botter… or really dumb.

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Yeah, no. The most efficient method for gathering is to focus on the three nodes that are easiest to get to or have the bonuses you want and completely ignore the fourth. Right up to level 50 there is never a time when all four nodes are equally valuable to just getting the bonuses you want more often. And the nodes don't have much variance. There aren't a whole lot of times when you need to go out of your way for more than one of the nodes, which makes it really easy to take the same path many times.

In the group of 8 clones that I reported on Ultros (and were subsequently removed a week later along with a teleport-hack bot), after one particular node they would occasionally run toward the next node, then directly away from the node, and then head directly back to the node. I'd hazard a guess that it's because they couldn't target the node on the other side of a big rock and had to angle themselves until it caught on. And while this is a sign of botting, even players can do something similar once in a while as they think they see a node on the minimap in one place but it ends up being a bit off because it's really hard to see yellow icons on the yellow minimap.

When you report someone for botting, actually watch them for a while first to make sure that they're always doing the same things over and over again. Just five minutes and you should be able to give a detailed report on all of their pathing patterns and odd behaviors. Or just report everyone you see gathering everywhere. Because that'll get SE moving. Yeah, just like in that story about a wolf. Or was it about the crying boy?

I ignore almost everyone when mining, but not so much with intent. Mining is incredibly boring, and I only have a single monitor display setup. So when I go mining or fishing, I pop in my 360 controller, set the option in the game to allow input in background, and bring up netflix, only having enough of the screen visible that I can see where my next node is.

I won't pay attention to chat, I'll mindlessly run from node to node, while most of my attention is on whatever series I'm currently watching.

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Originally Posted by Grey_Cain

Yeah, no. The most efficient method for gathering is to focus on the three nodes that are easiest to get to or have the bonuses you want and completely ignore the fourth. Right up to level 50 there is never a time when all four nodes are equally valuable to just getting the bonuses you want more often. And the nodes don't have much variance. There aren't a whole lot of times when you need to go out of your way for more than one of the nodes, which makes it really easy to take the same path many times.

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Would assume what he means are the ones that run past ALL the locations for that +1 gathering attempts node every lap, instead of going straight for where it actually is, as a normal player would. It's not about ignoring a certain node, that's fine. It's about being on a perfect rail path that covers ALL the spawn locations for every node because the bots doesn't seem to be able to discern where they are.

Also with the same path, I wouldn't mean the same path as a normal player picks one between nodes. I would mean the same path as in actually covering the same exact inches of ground every lap, which no real player can realistically do unless they want to make an effort to look like a bot.

But we're on the same page. Gotta make sure watching what they do. Doesn't take long using your mouse pointer like you said to see where they path, and it's very quick to spot someone that runs with no deviations. Some of them have laps set up to alternately switch between two or more paths, but they always return through the same points regularly.

From: The People Against the Wussification of Eorzea

"I saw Sarah Good with the Devil! I saw Goody Osburn with the Devil! I saw Bridget Bishop with the Devil!" - A. Miller

Stop it now.

I have reported RMT ads, teleporting, and mob farming bots since early access. To be honest I'm done policing this game, I just blacklist and move on.

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Originally Posted by Cocytus

All I got to say is this guy is still there in that same spot after a week of reporting on balmung. Reported everyday and been reported by multiple people too. I mean I know they can't get them immediately but really? Over a week of more than one person reporting them everyday and not one mod can come out and be bothered to watch him?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YtzAERhovPk

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Just a heads up, you may want to remove your video. Last time I posted on someone elses thread about botters, I put a video of proof of those exact botters up and the entire thread got deleted and I got forum suspended for 20 days. Neat right?!

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

1) Harvesting things you have a 100% rate on naked does not make you a bot.

2) Ignoring /tells from people on a witch hunt does not make you a bot.

3) The ability to concentrate on a mundane and highly repetitive task for hours on end does not make you a bot.

I am not in any way defending people who bot, but, as so often happens in these situations, the accusation of botting is being thrown around with no .......

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Pretty much and honestly if you're not botting then you're fine. Even looking at fishing which can be entirely done by controller vibration feedback. I usually like to put on a show or movie and just fish based on controller feedback. They will deal with botters all you can do is report them.

Allow me to clarify by repeating myself:

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Originally Posted by Toranja

I followed him around and I noticed he was always making the same set of actions and path.

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The word is not "similar" or "approximate". It is "same" - exact.

And by actions, did not mean just the mining actions - the jumps and sprints were always the same. Also, he never once used Lay of the Land and knew exactly where the node was.

He was using 3rd party software for sure.

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Originally Posted by Slaxx

I'd have to be dumb to buy a bot that bad, but that's beside my main point. It is not actual proof.

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Do you know how I know someone is human?

When Y_t = Y_{t-1} + e

Do you know how I know someone is a bot?

When Y_t = Y_{t-1}

Do you know what that e is? "Errors".

What I see on my screen and what you see on your screen are not always the same thing. The errors I may make might not appear to you for a dozen different reasons.

Fun Fact: If you spent less time obsessively stalking these suspected bots in game and then taking your witch hunt to the forums you would accomplish your own goals much more quickly. Unless of course your goal is to obsessively stalk "botters" and then take your witch hunt to the forums, which would make you pathetic.

Edit: Was part of your argument really not using Lay of the Land? The ability that helps you find the nearest node? The nodes you can often see all 4 of at once on your mini-map? If not using Lay of the Land is part of your argument you are starting to look like someone who is terrible at gathering and is just jealous of people who know what they're doing.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

I followed him around and I noticed he was always making the same set of actions and path.

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You do realize that that is the very definition of gathering for an experienced player, right? You learn the most efficient "path" and then repeat the same actions over and over. The only way to tell if someone is botting is if they're using teleports. And not responding to you doesn't mean they're botting either.

If you suspect someone (even if your conclusion is faulty), you can report them. SE can then investigate to see if said person was using a 3rd party program. But you clearly need to be more careful in your assessments, as your evidence does not support your conclusion.

It's pointless to report the non-teleporting bots, SE doesn't do anything that I've seen. On my server, for example, there have been the same 4 bots that have been running anytime 24/7 that I've been in that area for well over a month now (3 of them with the same FC tag). I've reported them and had conversations with others that have reported them. I remember them specifically from mid-September because the mining nodes glitched and weren't spawning in the area for a long while... when that happened, the bots kept running around pointlessly in the exact same paths/circuits over and over again without pause, apparently not finding any nodes to stop at either but continuing along completely unperturbed by the situation. The two or three of us that were actually present at our keyboards confirmed with each other that none of us could see any nodes spawning all of a sudden. Every time I go back to the area I expect to see them gone but all of were still there as of yesterday.

Wonder how many shards just 4 bots running 24/7 for 6 weeks collect?

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Originally Posted by Kaedan94

...The only way to tell if someone is botting is if they're using teleports.

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Incorrect. Go to google and look up the assortment of bots players can get for mining and botany in FFXIV. None of them advertise teleporting (I'd guess RMT mainly utilizes blatant teleporting because they don't care as much if a hacked account is banned) and all run a recorded circuit that checks hotspots for the presence of a node - it's really not that difficult to watch and differentiate between people repetitively mining/botany'ing and automated scripts that run without deviation for hours/days/weeks.

[Was editing when you responded - my point is that I disagree with your argument that it's impossible for anyone to go lookup how the bots function, their features, and then go in-game and be able to differentiate between players and bots fairly easily.]

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Originally Posted by APilgrim

Incorrect. Go to google and look up the assortment of bots players can get for mining and botany in FFXIV. None of them advertise teleporting (I'd guess RMT mainly utilizes blatant teleporting because they don't care as much if a hacked account is banned).

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What's your point? I didn't say the only type of bot was teleporting bot. I said the only way you can be sure someone is botting by observing alone is if they're using one of the teleport ones.

I swear, some people just like to argue for no reason.

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Originally Posted by LordSideKicks

Naming is a bannable offence. We hate player bots just report them.

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If they ban people for name shaming a bot but not the bot itself, I've had it with square and everything they ever make for all eternity and will boycott them for here until the end of the universe. Square has had the VERY worst handling of RMT and botting I've ever seen in a major production MMO.

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Originally Posted by Zer0

If they ban people for name shaming a bot but not the bot itself, I've had it with square and everything they ever make for all eternity and will boycott them for here until the end of the universe. Square has had the VERY worst handling of RMT and botting I've ever seen in a major production MMO.

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Forum etiquette is different from in-game. You wouldn't get a ban from the game, just from the forums. If it were acceptable, false accusations could potentially run-amok. It's just a precautionary measure that pretty much every official forum (and many third party ones) do not allow.

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Originally Posted by Zer0

If they ban people for name shaming a bot but not the bot itself, I've had it with square and everything they ever make for all eternity and will boycott them for here until the end of the universe. Square has had the VERY worst handling of RMT and botting I've ever seen in a major production MMO.

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Guilty unless proven innocent huh?

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Originally Posted by Toranja

Do you know how I know someone is human?

When Y_t = Y_{t-1} + e

Do you know how I know someone is a bot?

When Y_t = Y_{t-1}

Do you know what that e is? "Errors".

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i suppose your perception of someones path has no errors in it huh? oh wait