It has become apparent that the Shield Oath's enmity multiplyer is broken. After messing around with Sword Oath, Shield Oath and natural stance I've noticed that enmity gain is faster without an Oath up or with Sword Oath.
Defiance for WAR works wonders for enmity gain with the damage reduction which leads me to believe that the Enmity multiplyer for Shield Oath isn't working
Anyone else found this?
Shield Oath Enmity Broken
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10-07-2013, 09:56 PMKal-ElShield Oath Enmity Broken
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10-07-2013, 10:12 PMLogolar
Single target I've noticed that yes Sword oath generates more because of the damage boost....but with AOE pulls the enmity boost applies to things like flash and I've noticed it holds agro better on stuff like that.
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10-07-2013, 10:31 PMKenka
I noticed this last weekend when I was pulling single target hate from a Curtana PLD in Shield Oath with my Ifrit's Blade and Sword Oath. Is the extra damage from Sword Oath (just on autoattacks iirc) enough to offset the enmity multiplier from Shield Oath? I thought it was pretty much negligible.
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10-07-2013, 10:38 PMKal-El
The enmity boost from Shield Oath is supposed to be a multiplyer of the damage done.
I doubt that Sword Oath multiplies the damage of shield oath.
That's what makes me think Shield Oath is broken. -
10-07-2013, 10:47 PMSoulburn32
as far as i'm concerned the 20% damage mitigation is the reason to use this ability.
the extra threat is probably only enough to negate the 20% damage penalty. -
10-07-2013, 10:53 PMLogolar
Yes sword oath only upgrades auto attacks damage, but as it's mentioned you don't get the 20% damage reduction as well. but the enmity multiplication applies to your abilities that do not do damage like flash...So it's good for aoe tanking...but once you get geared you'll be able to do simple runs like AK and CM in sword oath for the most part.
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10-07-2013, 11:16 PMEhayteThis ^^. If you are comparably equipped you can easily take aggro from a PLD in Shield Oath who is focused on dmg mitigation if you are in Sword Oath focused on dmg output.Quote:
Originally Posted by Logolar
Also, Kal El, I have heard a rumor that Lalafel enmity is screwed up (like 20% less than it should be). That could be a contributing factor to your woes. -
10-08-2013, 01:09 AMKal-ElThat's Lalafell racism!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ehayte
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10-08-2013, 01:14 AMJames1213
Well it could be that Lalafells, don't seem all that threatening. =p
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10-08-2013, 02:05 AMEhayteYUP - /extends arm to hold Kal-El at arm's length by the head as Kal-El swings his tiny dagger-like sword wildly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal-El
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10-08-2013, 02:27 AMCzeslawVarpulis
I do believe it's that the damage reduction that's causing the hate loss. I forget to put shield oath up all the time after demon wall, and don't notice hate issues. Usually the healer is the one who notices shield oath isn't up, because of the damage I'm taking.
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10-08-2013, 02:29 AMHachikoDefiance and Shield Oath have the same effect on enmity. In general, a PLD in Sword Oath will pull off of a WAR in Defiance given enough time. A WAR might be able to keep up at the start with Unchained, but the ramp up time for WAR damage vs. the instant nature of Fight or Flight, and sword oath being so amazing usually puts a RoH spamming Sword Oath PLD in the lead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal-El
In fact, threat management is the only reason that WAR make better off-dps dps characters. PLD's will go dry spamming Riot Blade pretty quickly, while warriors have a much less TP thirsty low enmity combo in Storm's Eye. -
10-08-2013, 03:08 AMKal-ElQuote:
Originally Posted by James1213
This thread is becoming increasingly threatening to Lalafells!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ehayte
I'm gonna kick you both in the shins soon!! -
10-08-2013, 04:54 AMSapphidia
From what I understand of the current testing:
Shield Oath offers about 50% more threat than having no oath at all. The -20% damage and 100% threat equates to 160% threat overall, and testing has shown it to be closer to 150%.
Sword Oath has the same threat as No Oath on all attacks, making Shield Oath the better AOE threat choice as Shield Oath has higher threat Flashes and Circles of Scorn.
-However- the 50 potency auto attack procs that come with Sword Oath appear to have a bonus Enmity value attached to them. Testing seems to show they do MORE threat than a simple 50 potency damage should suggest, maybe more like 100 or 150 potency in threat. As a result, Sword Oath pushes out more single target threat than Shield. -
10-08-2013, 06:23 AMFaction
It's not broken, you just don't understand how it works. It's +50% enmity generation from damage rather than a flat 2x modifier like it used to be, which in effect just makes up for the damage loss you get by using it. Shield oath enmity=enmity without any oath on at all. Sword oath generates more enmity because you're dealing more damage.
Defiance is the same.