The Lore of Inter-breeding

As we move through the game where five very similar races live and work together, we see that there is not one mixed race person on the planet, npc wise. So this raises the obvious question, can the races interbreed and when/if they do what happens. Is this a pokemon situation where two different monsters breed, but one race is dominate and the child is born as one or the other? Or is interbreeding impossible?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post490835

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Can different races crossbreed?

Answer: Yes, but it is rare...and often difficult due to cultural differences, etc. which is why you don't see it often. The lore team has informed me that there will be future quests/events that touch on this and other issues, such as love and marriage.

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Okay, now we know there can be cross-breeding. But, we still aren't aware of a case of cross-breeding or the circumstances surrounding it.

Please don't call it inter-breeding, it's like ...members of the same family that way. r-rofl.

But! In 1.0, there was one couple, Niellfresne (a Wildwood) and F'halminn (a Seeker) which indeed were an item. There doesn't appear to be any stigma against dating outside one's race in this game (so logically, clan shouldn't be a problem either), though we've yet to see any bi-products.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

Okay, now we know there can be cross-breeding. But, we still aren't aware of a case of cross-breeding or the circumstances surrounding it.

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There's an Entire Playable half Roe race, though.

Can you imagine what the offspring would look like between a Lalafell and a Miqo'te? The cuteness would probably cause diabetes.

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Originally Posted by jomoru

There's an Entire Playable half Roe race, though.

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We don't actually know if that's true, from the Lore, they've only said this is a joke between Mid-Highlanders.

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Originally Posted by Gildrein

Fun Fact: Some Midlanders like to joke that because Highlander names have a very Roegadyn feel to them (in addition to highlanders being very large and muscular), that the clan is somehow “less Hyuran.” Many an alehouse brawl has broken out as a result of a Midlander in his cups uttering such quips as ‘Your mother was a Sea Wolf ’ in the presence of a Highlander. Needless to say, most of these quarrels do not end well for the instigator.

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Originally Posted by Velox

Can you imagine what the offspring would look like between a Lalafell and a Miqo'te? The cuteness would probably cause diabetes.

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Wouldn't that pretty much just be a normal cat?

This may sound bad, but I never liked the idea of races being able to breed with other races in fantasy settings. The fact that they can breed suggests that there is a common evolutionary ancestor and that fact makes them each seem less unique to me. Like they are all just the same species just with different breeds, like dogs or cats. I had hoped that their shared humanoid appearance was superficial and that they were biologically more diverse. Seems kinda boring otherwise. Probably just me though.

Quite true... we humes have lived with our pet cats and dogs for eons and there has not been anything from that. Aside from the fact that dogs think we're gods and cats think they are.

Leave things be. Let the furries have the rest.

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Originally Posted by Sylentmana

The fact that they can breed suggests that there is a common evolutionary ancestor and that fact makes them each seem less unique to me. Like they are all just the same species just with different breeds, like dogs or cats.

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Well biologically they look too similar to not be related in SOME way through the evolutionary tree. Scientists recently found traces of Homo neanderthalensis DNA within our own, showing that even when there was 2 distinct species of Humans at one time that looked nothing alike, they were close enough related to breed and produce offspring with mixed blood. Those traces, even though they are small, are being passed down through the generations even today. In fact, it may be possible that the breeding between the races passed along just the right traits from both that allowed are species to survive the bitter cold of the last ice age.

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Originally Posted by Toranja

Okay, now we know there can be cross-breeding. But, we still aren't aware of a case of cross-breeding or the circumstances surrounding it.

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This. How is it that the city state of Gridania has its flag crest representing the unity of hyur and elezen together for hundreds if not thousands of years, yet has no evidence of intermarriage among the population? This is a plot hole. If 2 races live together long enough, especially under the same banner, intermarriage is bound to happen.

How is it with the reproduction? If, as example, a Viera female and an Au Ra male are reproducing, which race does the baby have? I somewhere heard that it would always be the race of the mother, and so a Viera.

10 years... We're reaching new levels of necromancy.

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Originally Posted by Calacitea

How is it with the reproduction? If, as example, a Viera female and an Au Ra male are reproducing, which race does the baby have? I somewhere heard that it would always be the race of the mother, and so a Viera.

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This was completely made up by RPers and has no basis in lore at all. If true, then Hilda wouldn't have pointy ears and Severa wouldn't have a dud third-eye. Genetics seems to more or less work how it does in our world from what we've seen.


A Viera/Au Ra would be some unholy jackalope thing, but it would be a mix of both. It's just that every single mixed race baby in the game has been half Hyur, and Hyur happen to be the most basic thing that everything else is based on. So that means that everything we've seen is just "non-Hyur parent, but less". If the game ever introduced something like you described that didn't involve a Hyur, the mixture would be more apparent and more importantly for the dev team, more expensive to model since it would need to be unique.

It's a shame that we cannot see more hybrid individuals like Hilda, I have always liked when fantasy worlds do have that as a thing. Makes it more diverse and let's you explore more social tropes. Perhaps on time we will be able to see a few, if the budget allows haha.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

This was completely made up by RPers and has no basis in lore at all. If true, then Hilda wouldn't have pointy ears and Severa wouldn't have a dud third-eye.

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It was not "completely made up", it was an inference based on the examples we were shown in game over time because XIV's worldbuilding has all the depth of a puddle half the time. Furthermore, the full inference that the other person is unaware of that people referenced was that the hybrid would take primarily after the mother and have some secondary characteristic reminiscent of the father's race. The fact that some people present it as objective fact and not mere inference is a inherent problem to XIV's community, to say nothing of the inevitable, inherent distortion that can occur in a ceaseless game of telephone over long time spans.

There's a hell of a lot of times when someone in the community comes up with something, and then the entire community just goes 'yeah, that seems legit' and accepts it to such a degree that they forget where the idea came from. From what I've heard this particular one comes from the roleplaying community; someone in some FC just laid it down as a sort of house rule or something, and because it took until either Stormblood's or Shadowbringers' patches to get an actual counterexample (I forget when exactly Severa got her backstory) it had a LOOOOOT of time to catch on without opposition.

This might be one of the most commonplace ones, but in my eyes it's almost forgivable; this one actually looked legit for the longest time, even if it mostly just got there because for the writers it didn't matter enough to refute. It's way better than 'Black Mages replaced their eye with materia', which is an idea that came from nowhere and is refuted by every single source you could possibly check.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

It's way better than 'Black Mages replaced their eye with materia', which is an idea that came from nowhere and is refuted by every single source you could possibly check.

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I looked into this mystery a while ago!

The oldest mention I could find of the concept is from a early 2012 post where they describe it as a "theory" based on a cutscene where a black mage character's eye glows in a cool way. That's from the late 1.0 era.

It seems like an idea people were excited about just got mythologized into something actually in the game over the years.

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Originally Posted by Lurina

I looked into this mystery a while ago!

The oldest mention I could find of the concept is from a early 2012 post where they describe it as a "theory" based on a cutscene where a black mage character's eye glows in a cool way. That's from the late 1.0 era.

It seems like an idea people were excited about just got mythologized into something actually in the game over the years.

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Wow, that is... not even circumstantial evidence, that's just straight-out nonsense. Losing the evidence over the years probably made that more credible.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Wow, that is... not even circumstantial evidence, that's just straight-out nonsense. Losing the evidence over the years probably made that more credible.

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Yeah, I was surprised by how dumb the explanation turned out to be with how many people say it. I guess if you can't actively fact-check something, it can just spread around.

I did learn some interesting stuff about how the 1.0 job quests were structured looking into it (which I never made it far enough at the time to actually experience). Apparently, most of the structure and dialogue are re-used for the 2.0 ones, but they have different (and generally somewhat stupider) lead-ins. For example, in the black mage one, you find the Gem of Shatotto by killing killing poop bugs until it drops.

I hope it's okay for me to borrow this thread. Since it's been bumped from 2013 anyway, might as well use it to talk about 2013 content.

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Originally Posted by Wyssahtyn

It was not "completely made up", it was an inference based on the examples we were shown in game over time because XIV's worldbuilding has all the depth of a puddle half the time. Furthermore, the full inference that the other person is unaware of that people referenced was that the hybrid would take primarily after the mother and have some secondary characteristic reminiscent of the father's race. The fact that some people present it as objective fact and not mere inference is a inherent problem to XIV's community, to say nothing of the inevitable, inherent distortion that can occur in a ceaseless game of telephone over long time spans.

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To me, that whole idea is blind "justification" and not "inference".

The idea that the child takes the mother's race is justification to play a hybrid race in-game because of how popular those types of stories are even in writing outside of RP. Anyone who spends more than half a thought on the topic who doesn't want to RP as a half-something character won't come to the same conclusion.


The only way to perfectly make Hilda a half-Elezen would be to ever-so-slightly change the proportions of her body and make her just a tiny bit taller than Midlanders could be. That doesn't sound like the effort the devs would do so they just gave her a unique head like how the Garleans, Ancients, and other important characters have unique heads. Otherwise, she's still a max-height Midlander when NPCs are very rarely made max-height. Other than their wacky proportions that don't even make it into official art half the time, the only characteristics Elezen have unique from Hyur are height and ears so I don't know what people would be expecting anyway.

Then there's the legendary tale of the Au Ra who had a child with a Hyur that looked like an Au Ra but with less scales. But again, Au Ra are just "Hyur with extra bits" so I wouldn't expect a hybrid to be anything different than "race that isn't a Hyur but with less of those extra bits".

"Takes after the mom, but also the dad" is kind of how genetics work so the idea of "mother's race completely, but secondary(?) characteristics from dad" sounds super flimsy. Calling things that aren't on a Hyur "secondary characteristics" is just admitting that every single race is just "Hyur but different" anyway.

It would be cool if we got some NPC's that are mixed race but then the cry for make them playable would happen and yoshi-p already says no to new races.

Well part of it is that until the Sorrow of Werlyt happened even in game people said oh Garlean halfbreeds don't have the Garlean third eye. Then we learn Severa is half Garlean and has a Garlean third eye. There is some bit of compatibility thrown in earlier sections of the story where part of the reason why there isn't more inter racial children is that some of the races seem to not be able to produce offspring. Or at least babies that ended up being born. Then there's the whole being with someone not of your own race taboo to the point many lovers don't stay together long enough for a child to begotten.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Well part of it is that until the Sorrow of Werlyt happened even in game people said oh Garlean halfbreeds don't have the Garlean third eye. Then we learn Severa is half Garlean and has a Garlean third eye. There is some bit of compatibility thrown in earlier sections of the story where part of the reason why there isn't more inter racial children is that some of the races seem to not be able to produce offspring. Or at least babies that ended up being born. Then there's the whole being with someone not of your own race taboo to the point many lovers don't stay together long enough for a child to begotten.

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Nothing in the game ever suggests that there is trouble having kids between races. That's just something players have come up with to explain why we don't see the kids instead of the obvious devs don't feel like making more models.

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Originally Posted by SannaR

Well part of it is that until the Sorrow of Werlyt happened even in game people said oh Garlean halfbreeds don't have the Garlean third eye. Then we learn Severa is half Garlean and has a Garlean third eye. There is some bit of compatibility thrown in earlier sections of the story where part of the reason why there isn't more inter racial children is that some of the races seem to not be able to produce offspring. Or at least babies that ended up being born. Then there's the whole being with someone not of your own race taboo to the point many lovers don't stay together long enough for a child to begotten.

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I still think the "only purebloods can have the third eye" was a lie told to make the Garlean people feel special, and prove their superiority to themselves. If those "savages" weren't inferior, they'd have a third eye, wouldn't they?

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Nothing in the game ever suggests that there is trouble having kids between races. That's just something players have come up with to explain why we don't see the kids instead of the obvious devs don't feel like making more models.

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2014 Las Vegas Fanfest Camate-Fernehalwes Interview:
Q: “Are there any folklore stories involving cross-racial relationships? Especially between Hyur and Elezen? And then, what do Roegadyn-Lalafell children look like? What is the fatality rate for such a union?”

Fernehalwes: “... As for the Roegadyn-Lalafell one, I mean, you know… First of all, logistically, how are you going to… I mean, I’m sure there’s fan art out there on the net. You can take a jaguar and a lion in a lab and do that. But the thing is, it doesn’t happen in nature, because some things shouldn’t happen in nature. But it could. I’m just saying, some things shouldn’t happen but that’s not saying it can’t. It can.”

the issue is more of a wailord on skitty sort of deal than some biological incompatibility like the other person implies. or to use non-pokemon meme example, chihuahua on great dane; they're unlikely to physically mate due to size difference.

I do hope you were not thinking of lalafells

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I still think the "only purebloods can have the third eye" was a lie told to make the Garlean people feel special, and prove their superiority to themselves. If those "savages" weren't inferior, they'd have a third eye, wouldn't they?

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Well it’s implied the only half garlean we meet in the game didn’t have a third eye at all despite his mother trying to cut out a pimple. So as far as we know it is indeed a unique racial trait. Like Roegadyns and their blocky noses, or elezens and their elf ears.

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Originally Posted by True-to-Caesar

I do hope you were not thinking of lalafells



Well it’s implied the only half garlean we meet in the game didn’t have a third eye at all despite his mother trying to cut out a pimple. So as far as we know it is indeed a unique racial trait. Like Roegadyns and their blocky noses, or elezens and their elf ears.

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Not sure how far you are into the game, but there’s a few more half-Garleans later on and 1 of them has a third-eye that black instead of white.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

Not sure how far you are into the game, but there’s a few more half-Garleans later on and 1 of them has a third-eye that black instead of white.

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Haven’t done Sorrow of Werlyt yet (guess you’re talking about the female hyur). So I can’t say much about it.

Somewhat related, but I thought I'd share some concepts I did for elezen+miqo'te children for me and a friend's roleplay characters couple of years back.

https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca88...WKYljk_oPTU-_I

https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca88...uz-wXHyWb0ucv4

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Originally Posted by Wyssahtyn

2014 Las Vegas Fanfest Camate-Fernehalwes Interview:
Q: “Are there any folklore stories involving cross-racial relationships? Especially between Hyur and Elezen? And then, what do Roegadyn-Lalafell children look like? What is the fatality rate for such a union?”

Fernehalwes: “... As for the Roegadyn-Lalafell one, I mean, you know… First of all, logistically, how are you going to… I mean, I’m sure there’s fan art out there on the net. You can take a jaguar and a lion in a lab and do that. But the thing is, it doesn’t happen in nature, because some things shouldn’t happen in nature. But it could. I’m just saying, some things shouldn’t happen but that’s not saying it can’t. It can.”

the issue is more of a wailord on skitty sort of deal than some biological incompatibility like the other person implies. or to use non-pokemon meme example, chihuahua on great dane; they're unlikely to physically mate due to size difference.

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Even before then, Ferne explained about the difficulty in mixed race unions producing offspring and that if it does happen, its very rare - on this very forum in fact:

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Originally Posted by Fernehalwes

Can different races crossbreed?

Answer: Yes, but it is rare...and often difficult due to cultural differences, etc. which is why you don't see it often. The lore team has informed me that there will be future quests/events that touch on this and other issues, such as love and marriage.

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Of course that was done way back in 2011 when ARR was early in development and 1.0 was still active and operating, so like much of EW's plot points there might have been some changes in the lore behind the scenes in regard to this that we don't know about, but my gil is still on that still being canon.

So, having had two citations straight from the head of localization (and one of the main lore writers), it's pretty conclusive that mixed racial children in Hydaelyn/the Source (and by extension, the Shards as well) is actually very rare - anything else is just headcanon at best and players making things from whole cloth at worst.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Even before then, Ferne explained about the difficulty in mixed race unions producing offspring and that if it does happen, its very rare - on this very forum in fact:



Of course that was done way back in 2011 when ARR was early in development and 1.0 was still active and operating, so like much of EW's plot points there might have been some changes in the lore behind the scenes in regard to this that we don't know about, but my gil is still on that still being canon.

So, having had two citations straight from the head of localization (and one of the main lore writers), it's pretty conclusive that mixed racial children in Hydaelyn/the Source (and by extension, the Shards as well) is actually very rare - anything else is just headcanon at best and players making things from whole cloth at worst.

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Again, nothing in that post says anything about difficultly in producing offspring. It's difficult due to cultural difference IE the spoken races in Eoreza have spent centuries fighting each other. Think how interracial relations have been frowned upon in the real world. No trouble having kids, just everyone around them doesn't approve and there can be consequences.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Even before then, Ferne explained about the difficulty in mixed race unions producing offspring and that if it does happen, its very rare - on this very forum in fact:



Of course that was done way back in 2011 when ARR was early in development and 1.0 was still active and operating, so like much of EW's plot points there might have been some changes in the lore behind the scenes in regard to this that we don't know about, but my gil is still on that still being canon.

So, having had two citations straight from the head of localization (and one of the main lore writers), it's pretty conclusive that mixed racial children in Hydaelyn/the Source (and by extension, the Shards as well) is actually very rare - anything else is just headcanon at best and players making things from whole cloth at worst.

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So I can have strong warrior children with a roegadyn momma ? Perfection

Femroes ! Call me !

As I recall, the rules are the child will always be of the mother's race, but with minor cosmetic features of the father's race, so as to avoid problems like roe x lala romance and children

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Originally Posted by shadowclasper

As I recall, the rules are the child will always be of the mother's race, but with minor cosmetic features of the father's race, so as to avoid problems like roe x lala romance and children

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Again, as argued in the two pages before this, in every post since this thread was revived: literally never a rule. All the mixed-race characters we'd met across the first few years of the game (Arenvald and Hilda most prominently, although Arenvald didn't have visible Garlean features) did fit this trend, but it was never a rule and was never stated, only inferred, it turns out wrongly. It was proven wrong most prominently with Severa.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Again, as argued in the two pages before this, in every post since this thread was revived: literally never a rule. All the mixed-race characters we'd met across the first few years of the game (Arenvald and Hilda most prominently, although Arenvald didn't have visible Garlean features) did fit this trend, but it was never a rule and was never stated, only inferred, it turns out wrongly. It was proven wrong most prominently with Severa.

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Does she actually have the full garlean abilities (no aether, the third eye hyper perception, greater than normal physical abilitues) or does she just have the third eye as a mostly cosmetic feature?

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Originally Posted by shadowclasper

Does she actually have the full garlean abilities (no aether, the third eye hyper perception, greater than normal physical abilitues) or does she just have the third eye as a mostly cosmetic feature?

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By all available information, she is a Garlean, and is constantly described and seen as such, except when we learn her backstory. We don't have many direct answers to your question, but I'd actually point out that we have the worst possible reliable source on that: the pure-blooded Garleans were racist as hell towards her, but only ever looked down on her for her 'savage blood'. To me, the fact they only ever attacked her for an abstract confirms that she was actually completely 'passing' as a Garlean, because otherwise they'd have thrown stones for something far more tangible. So while there isn't a direct answer to your question, at this point it would feel like an ass-pull (not to mention a bit of a betrayal of the character's whole point) if she wasn't for all meaningful intents and purposes a Garlean.

I believe there are other examples among event quest NPCs, Severa isn't the one lone counterexample to this non-existent 'rule', she's just the big, prominent and permanent one that got a backstory that very directly said it.

She definitely is Garlean passing as when that illness spread through they refused to give her mother medicine for it while giving it to pure blooded Garleans first.

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Originally Posted by True-to-Caesar

So I can have strong warrior children with a roegadyn momma ? Perfection

Femroes ! Call me !

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I'm a short femroe with scales and invisible muscles, can I call you? Haha