Tank Problems need Tank Solutions

I was thinking of how to fix Tank/Healer issue.

I understand how hard for developer to manage these two roles together, specially for MMORPG game.

I would suggest this solution and I think it will be healthy for the game in the long run.

Mana management, but why?

• Trade survivability vs damage: each tank utility will have MP cost that can reach to 0
• Balance between tank and healers
• Utilize Mana bar instead of being a Dark knight only

this could give balance to not only warrior but all tanks to limit their healing capability by not losing DPS

these are examples (numbers just for example):

Warrior:

Damage cooldowns:

Fell cleave and Decimate 2500 MP cost

Defensive cooldowns:

Bloodwhetting(Nascent Flash) 1500 MP cost

Damnation 2000 MP cost

Thrill of Battle 1500 MP cost

Equilibrium 1500 MP cost

Shake It Off 1500 MP cost

special cooldowns that reduce its combo MP cost to 0:

Warrior: Inner Release (for both damage and survivability)

I take an example for warrior being high healing tank job but almost all tanks have this issue, good that paladin clemency have actual cost that actually limits paladin healing.
What do you think? is MP management could be the solution for tank/healer balance?

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

Trade survivability vs damage: each tank utility will have MP cost that can reach to 0

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Paladin used to have this. It was very strict and if you messed it up, you had less Holy Spirits or other magic as part of your magic phase. The MP cost was halved so that you could still manage virtually unlimited Clemencies though. Now, not only can you mess it up and still have lots of MP for the magic phase, but you can also Clemency even more.

Dark Knight does still actually have this. You have to prevent yourself overcapping on MP, but also try to maintain 3,000 MP for TBN in case it's needed.

However, Dark Knight used to be far more complicated where you'd manage Dark Arts and use it to empower or transform attacks but only within the constraints of the MP bar. You also had the MP itself draining while Darkside was up and if you ran out, it disabled Darkside, which you needed to avoid. You genuinely had to play really well to prevent this.

Ultimately, these sort of things changed for the same reason as everything else. To make it easier for the majority of players - the new, returning and casual players, with the aim to make it difficult to mess up the rotation at all.

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Balance between tank and healers

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That should really be better. It wasn't really a problem in Heavensward. But it does make it even easier to carry the party through a dungeon and that makes it easier to get casual players through fights that they find difficult.

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this could give balance to not only warrior but all tanks to limit their healing capability by not losing DPS

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Warrior's problem could be solved simply by longer cooldowns. As a simple example, when you only have Thrill it's pretty balanced. Even Thrill+Equilibrium on its own is alright.

I don't see any need for all tanks to have a shared resource method. However, so long as we're all forced to see MP bars, I'd agree that it makes little sense not to use MP, especially since MP can as easily represent anything that starts (loads into instance) at maximum charge and regenerates over time (e.g., a cooldown).

That said, I don't want to see MP simply stand in place of an on-demand CD timer. MP is already used very differently from that on DRK and PLD, and using MP in place of a simple timer would both be clunkier (as it'd update only every 3 seconds, instead of per second or as granularly as one can display) and would waste thematic potential for WAR and GNB.

Sidenote: I'd also like to see more flexibility in ability timing among most tanks, with slightly fewer separate abilities but more more agency, impact, and flavor in total among what would remain. Perhaps then content could be more than just crafting a CD schedule for your non-red buttons while dancing about and rotating red skills like everyone else. But, that is doubtless a pipedream.

Rather than change how existing skills function, I would rather they design something with that in mind for GNB and WAR.

This makes me wonder what you do with the tank that already uses MP harder than most of the casters.

I have been told that Healers are fine and don't need fixing. So obviously all the other roles are wrongly designed.

I think to fix the tanks what's needed is that all their attacks except Total Eclipse, Overpower, Unleash and Demon Slice are removed and those made into Job Gauge builders... And then for skills to use the Job Gauge on, well there's Sheltron, Bloodwhetting, Blackest Night and Heart of Corundum.

And in place of all the removed attacks, a bunch of skills that just Reduce damage taken by x%.


I'm sure everyone who has said that "Healers are fine" will agree that these are good changes.

Mana doesn't really function outside of jobs designed specifically around it wherever it's WoW or FF14. Dumping mana instead of timers is just making it way more convoluted and harder to control and balance.