what think of something like eukrasia for dps like mnk & drg? orr more jobs in gen

i know right now it wouldn't quite work without some reworking of how some combos weave and/or some finagling the way the "eukrasia" type skill works i think, but i also think it'd be interesting and definitely appeal to people who struggle with too many buttons. without simplifying the job, but adding something that interacts with skills to modify them into something else instead of having independent buttons, would be interesting

from testing the combo skills in pvp to adding a thing like that in sage and i think even a little bit in reaper KINDA-sorta, maybe it could be applied to other classes in their eventual re-work? what think, pals?

ideally something like that for every class in their own way, but like, especially those with more buttons c: y/n?

in general, i suggest offering counter ideas instead of just simply denying people of theirs, also. it's more fun and engaging to make it a discussion instead of an immediate shut-down c:

Most combos could safely be rolled together into one single skill like it is in PvP/Solo Role-play Instances; but then you'd have people screeching about simplification and homogenization because their 'tap these buttons in same order always' became 'tap one button three times' which is basically not a different. And for cases where you might not want full combo, it could just be split into different skills (like Gunbreaker main combo), for combo that ends at second and combo that ends at third. Still one less button for the bloat.

That's all combos are, artificial button bloat. Pruning them is a step towards opening up hotbar real estate towards actual skills and that's my main hope for DRG rework, that its like, 2 5-skill combo occupying 7 buttons could be made into two buttons because like. There's no reason for the two positionals to be separate buttons other than the artificial 'its more difficult because its more buttons to press'

leave Monk's combos alone. you cannot condense them into fewer buttons without sacrificing something or making it worse to play. it is the only job in the game that actually takes advantage of its combo skills being different buttons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VentVanitas

leave Monk's combos alone. you cannot condense them into fewer buttons without sacrificing something or making it worse to play. it is the only job in the game that actually takes advantage of its combo skills being different buttons.

---

This. Like I'm all for condensing skills, but MNK is the one job that it can't be done with really. Buttons like Ley Lines deserve to be condensed with Between the Lines and so forth. MNK is just different though due to how it's skills interact with each other.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VentVanitas

leave Monk's combos alone. you cannot condense them into fewer buttons without sacrificing something or making it worse to play. it is the only job in the game that actually takes advantage of its combo skills being different buttons.

---

i mean it's not really changing the combos that much if they make it eukrasia-like i think. eukrasia only activates for one skill at a time, all that does legit is take away like four independent buttons from itself to give you an alt button to activate it lol you'd just have to activate it a lot so it was just a thought to put in the air. for adding new-ish skill interactions into older jobs, esp that have a lot of buttons that could easily be consolidated. it's not like i'm asking for an entire 3-5 key combo to be put on only two buttons that you can't alternate

it's not abt mnk specifically anyway, it says in the title "jobs in general", just using mnk as an example. it's ok lol

the question is to encourage creative thinking on how to cut down on buttons without making it too simplified, i honestly think eukrasia is an interesting mechanic (??? skill interaction?)

Eukrasia should be a limited solution. It works on Sage because it's a caster so the slow effect from pressing a button for it to activate (and otherwise do no effect) is less jarring then it would be for non-casters.

If they were going to consolidate skills across the board then they should rebalance/rework the current system instead of a workaround like Eukraisa.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VentVanitas

leave Monk's combos alone. you cannot condense them into fewer buttons without sacrificing something or making it worse to play. it is the only job in the game that actually takes advantage of its combo skills being different buttons.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

This. Like I'm all for condensing skills, but MNK is the one job that it can't be done with really. Buttons like Ley Lines deserve to be condensed with Between the Lines and so forth. MNK is just different though due to how it's skills interact with each other.

---

They can't be condensed into fewer buttons, but there would be no button conflicts from Opo-opo attacks--or even any of the nine form attacks--being made to automatically update forms when not in Perfect Balance / Formless Fist. You only need individual buttons for each form during Perfect Balance / Formless Fist.

https://i.imgur.com/2PLZ4Ri.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Niroken

Eukrasia should be a limited solution. It works on Sage because it's a caster so the slow effect from pressing a button for it to activate (and otherwise do no effect) is less jarring then it would be for non-casters.

If they were going to consolidate skills across the board then they should rebalance/rework the current system instead of a workaround like Eukraisa.

---

that makes sense, but it doesn't need to behave directly like eukrasia does yeah? just a thought, but definitely with casters at least - maybe rdm especially. i think it could work easily with rdm because you choose when to cast spells that generate white or black magic, so just augmenting them for one or the other seems fine.

honestly i didn't put mnk or drg first bc i want those specifically changed to use something like this, but bc they were the first to come into mind uwu

potentially excited to see what changes ARE coming to drg, tho
as for mnk - doesn't even have to be affecting the main combo buttons but something else in the skillset
just jogging the thinktank a little on ideas!

&& the mention of it maybe working with ley lines is good, i havent played blm past 50 i think because i hate the job, but i've def looked at other people playing and dread leveling it when it's time

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rongway

They can't be condensed into fewer buttons, but there would be no button conflicts from Opo-opo attacks--or even any of the nine form attacks--being made to automatically update forms when not in Perfect Balance / Formless Fist. You only need individual buttons for each form during Perfect Balance / Formless Fist.

---

condensing the combo to three buttons outside of PB/Form Shift does not give the option to reuse an Opo-opo skill which yes, is an interaction that can happen. I don't care how small or niche it is, I don't want things like that to be removed from the job. it would also make low level pre-Rockbreaker MNK AoE more awkward to play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by VentVanitas

condensing the combo to three buttons outside of PB/Form Shift does not give the option to reuse an Opo-opo skill which yes, is an interaction that can happen. I don't care how small or niche it is, I don't want things like that to be removed from the job. it would also make low level pre-Rockbreaker MNK AoE more awkward to play.

---

It's not niche. Pressing an Opo-Opo button during Raptor Form or Coeurl Form is a loss except for the specific case of being a low enough level that you do not have all three AoEs yet, in which case spamming Arm of the Destroyer is possibly a gain over Arm -> single target -> Rockbreaker, and honestly it's not even worth worrying about at those levels.

The case of spamming Arm of the Destroyer without Rockbreaker is a shorter lived case, but either of these problems are easily solved by AoE buttons not changing to combo buttons until you learn Four Point Fury.